Posted by Anonymous on 9/1/05 6:05pm
Msg #63363

I have an important question for experienced notaries.

I have been doing signings for about 9 months. I have done pretty close to 75 signings. I have never had a situation like this before and need some advice. I got a call from a signing agency that I did a signing for recently. He was very angry and upset with me because I did this signing and whoever put the documents together at the title company didn't put in the Deed of Trust or the Note. It seems I am being blamed because I didn't catch their error. Will someone please respond to this. Now the signing agency says, it's my responsiblity to go back to the borrower's house and get the documents that weren't in the package in the first place signed then send them to the company all at my expense. Please help me!!!

Reply by MelissaM_FL on 9/1/05 6:15pm
Msg #63367

One of the functions of an SA is to know what docs must be in a package. You should look through your docs when you print them and make sure the important stuff is in there: Note, Mortgage, HUD, TIL, RTC (if it is a primary residence), ID Affidavit, Compliance, Title Affidavit/Survey Affidavit. These, and some others, are in almost all packages and, therefore, you should at least glance through to see that they are present before you go to a borrower's home.

I rearrange my packages and place the RTC, HUD, Note, Mortgage and TIL at the beginning in order to mitigate problems. The reason for this is that, if a loan isn't going to close because the terms are wrong, I want to know that it's not going to close as quickly as possible.

If you've done 75 signings, or anywhere close, then you should be aware of what is normally in a package. Unfortunately, I think that you probably are on the hook for this one. I guarantee you won't make this mistake again. I can see an SA missing some of the junk affidavits that title companies love to throw in, but missing the most important docs in the package is huge, IMO.

Please take this in the spirit that it is intended, which is as constructive information and not as criticism.

Reply by LisaWI on 9/1/05 6:21pm
Msg #63368

I have to ask, with no harm intended, but didnt you or the borrowers think it was odd that those docs were not there?? I quess I would be making a phone call asking where these docs were and if this was intentional. Which I dont see how it could be, seeing as they are pretty much the basis of the whole signing. But that is past tense and my opinion is yes you should make the trip especially if they are a good company. Good Luck!!

Reply by Chris_NJ on 9/2/05 9:10am
Msg #63462

I had this happen to me this week. I called twice to tell them that I only had the affs and Iwas told (by someone that didn't know better) that that was all there was. Like an idiot, I 'assumed' that I was the second notary out. Well we all know what happens when you assume. Live and learn. (of couse I felt like a real fool and I'm sure they wont be using me again).

Reply by Sara_NV on 9/1/05 6:26pm
Msg #63369

Yes, you SHOULD have realized those two very important documents were not in the package. Did the package get sent to you originally or to the borrowers? If it was sent to the borrowers, could it have been possible that they pulled the DOT and note out and set it aside or something and that's why they did not get signed?

Reply by buylamb on 9/1/05 6:33pm
Msg #63370

I have had documents missing in several closings...and it is the responsibility of the loan company to provide them. As a notary you are providing a service to get the documents signed correctly and by the correct people. EVERY package I get is different based on the company providing the docs. Every time the docs were incomplete (about 4 times this year) the company informed me and they paid me for the second trip with out any complaint. It is their responsibility....Now, If I or you, lose them or fail to print them....Its our responsibility...Be careful that you are not drawn into a situation where you can be accused of practicing law. Familiarity with these things is natural but you are still just the cog that makes the signing official and the signers identified.

Reply by Glenn_CA on 9/1/05 6:47pm
Msg #63372

You should have caught it. All loans need those documents to proceed. Your response should be "I'm sorry, what can I do to fix it" and move on, unless you don't want to sign for that title company or signing service again.

Reply by Kate on 9/1/05 7:08pm
Msg #63373

Did you check your Journal?

To make sure that you didn't notarize it and they misplaced the docs when they were returnded? Have had that happen.

Consider it a learning experience and 1st call the borrower to see if there is any DOT or Note in their package? If so go out at no charge is what I would do at this point.
Had I caught it at the table I would of charged for the second trip. The reason I wouldn't charge for this 2nd trip is, you may keep them as a client and the amount of time that has been lost trying to close this loan.

I have also called a LO to tell him there was no DOT in the package and have him treat me like I don't know what I'm looking for, finally the borrowers told him, no DOT in either package.
I got paid for the 2nd trip.

Good Luck.

Reply by lindetteh on 9/1/05 7:16pm
Msg #63375

Are you sure you missed the docs or is it possible they lost them. If you did the closing a week or two ago they should have called you as soon as they got the package back. Also what exactly are they asking you to do it seems to me they would need to get the entire package signed again since it is illegal to back date. I would call the borrower and see if they have copies in there package and if they do I think someone is trying to use you as a scape goat.
So make sure you are the one who messed up before you go back.

Reply by christine patnaude on 9/2/05 9:16am
Msg #63463

I should have added that I was asked to back date and of course said no. Then they tell me that the lender found someone to back date it for them. I'm actually thinking of going to the courthouse to see who's signature is on the recorded docs.

Reply by Lee_AR on 9/1/05 7:32pm
Msg #63377

No way, Jose! (nm)

Reply by Anonymous on 9/1/05 8:05pm
Msg #63380

What I would have done in that situation, is called the signing agency from the borrowers house. That way it completely takes the responsibility off of your self. If you did'nt notice it, then there is really not much you can do. Did you check your log and see if you actually did notarize a deed of trust? This is a hard one, if the signing company gives you alot of work, and pay's decently then you should probably just go back out there and fix the problem. I have been taught that a company will continue to use you as long as you are willing to correct your errors.

Reply by Roger_OH on 9/1/05 8:27pm
Msg #63384

The difference between being "just a notary" and an NSA

Anyone who has done 75 signings would have to realize that without a Note or DOT/Mortgage, there can't be a loan. To just send back the docs without even questioning this to the SS is YOUR error. Part of being an NSA versus "just a notary" is ensuring that your customers get excellent service, even if they have left out obviously necessary docs as the two above. The NSA should be experienced and professional enough to make the call to the SS, save the signing (and an extra trip) and look good to your customer for going the extra mile on their behalf.

Reply by Evangelina Arvizu on 9/1/05 11:43pm
Msg #63413

This is one reason why I REFUSE to do loan signings; no matter what the pay--besides the fact that I REFUSE TO WAIT TO BE PAID FOR A SIGNING! There is a sheet, sometimes called List of Documents or Cover Sheet that you ought to be certain is included with the package, or make one up, for yourself, at the time that the documents are delivered, and you have done a complete review, prior to the even making the appointment with the borrower. This way you get the opportunity to go through the list with the Title Company or Closing Agent, or even the Escrow Officer who is well versed with the ENTIRE transaction, and THAT ERROR would have been detected prior to the signing. Now, you could go hard line, and refuse to take the blame, which will mean that you won't get any calls from that Signing Agency, or Lender, in the future. If it were me, I would say, simply and diplomatically, if it was a mere oversight, then we are all responsible, and send me the items, I will call you back to reverify the receipt of the document(s), and take care of it at no charge, this time! STRESS THIS TIME, and mean it, and follow up with a letter to the signing agency contact, or officer in charge. Let them know that you want to work with them again, and hope that from that time onward, you will make it your duty to verify that all the documents are present.

Reply by Anonymous on 9/2/05 10:56pm
Msg #63588

I can't believe all the post that are taking sides with the Signing Service that was angry with the signing Agent because the signing agent did not catch the errors of others. SHEESH!!! Talking about the "death of commom sense"!!

Reply by Roger_OH on 9/3/05 10:39am
Msg #63624

Hey Anonymous!

Gee, since so many posters said that the notary SHOULD have been knowledgeable enough to catch such a BASIC and OBVIOUS omission, maybe you should rethink YOUR position? You apparently didn't feel strong enough about your opinion to post your name; maybe since you knew it really was wrong for a real NSA to ignore this situation.