Posted by Lita on 4/26/10 2:37pm
Msg #333562

Expried ID with Renewal slip ????

Can't find this in the Notary Handbook, I have a borrower with an expired ID card (issued by DMV in Calif) Lender will not accept credible witness so he will be renewing his ID (he has no other form of ID that I can use). Can I accept his present ID card which shows expired and was issued over 5 yrs ago with his renewal slip from the DMV? I think I can but the SS asking me to confirm since the lender is doing a redraw because CW is unacceptable. If yes, does can anyone point me in the direction of where I can find it in the handbook?

Reply by Linda Juenger on 4/26/10 2:53pm
Msg #333567

Lita, I can't help you since I am not in CA, but here in IL, when we go to the DMV, the ID card or DL is printed immediately. Is this not true for CA? Just wondering

Reply by Shoshana/AZ on 4/26/10 3:04pm
Msg #333569

When I was a CA notary, the answer was no. Why not call up the SOS and get an answer?
Here in AZ, we get our DL/ID's immediately.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 4/26/10 3:25pm
Msg #333578

I've asked before, also, and was told "no"

The explanation being that it is a separate document - not the ID itself. The extension is good for extending your right to drive, but not for ID purposes. It's gotten to the point where I advise people of that over the phone when I make the confirmation. (I make a point of not being heavy handed about it, though.)

Reply by garland/CA on 4/26/10 3:32pm
Msg #333582

Re: I've asked before, also, and was told "no"

just attended a refresher class for renewing my commission and this was discussed. we were told "no". maybe they have a passport?

Reply by Lita on 4/26/10 3:57pm
Msg #333589

Got My Answer From CA SOS

Thanks Shoshana, I called and spoke to someone at the Notary Dept of the CA SOS and NO you cannot use a paper renewal slip as an acceptable form of ID. You must wait for the renewed item to arrive if they do not have any other acceptable form, which this person doesn't have. He said the handbook is written in a way that it only states what is acceptable if it's not there then it is not acceptable. Thanks everyone for jumping in on this.

Reply by Shoshana/AZ on 4/26/10 5:06pm
Msg #333609

It's that way in AZ too, sometimes.

If it's not there it's not acceptable. Sometimes you need to be a mindreader for things that AREN'T addressed in the AZ handbook.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 4/26/10 3:14pm
Msg #333573

why didn't the borrower get his ID renewed BEFORE closing..

not sure what the CA law are, but here in IL, that expired ID no can do...

Reply by Notarysigner on 4/26/10 3:19pm
Msg #333574

Re: page #8 2010 CA notary Handbook

A. Paper Identification Documents – Identity of the signer can be established by the notary
public’s reasonable reliance on the presentation of any one of the following documents, if the
identification document is current or has been issued within five years (Civil Code section
1185(b)(3) & (4)):........read more

Reply by Robert/FL on 4/26/10 3:28pm
Msg #333580

This is the type of thing that should be clarified by law

People who get their D/L's suspended and taken away for a DUI or other traffic arrest should still be able to use their D/L's as identity documents IMO. An expired driver license only means that the DRIVING PRIVILEGES are suspended, not the person's identity. In Florida our statutes direct that the document must be current or issued within the past 5 years. IMO more leeway should be given. It is heartbreaking to have to turn away an old woman who hasn't driven in 10 years because her D/L expired a few months ago and she doesn't care to stand in line at the DMV for 3 hours to renew it.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 4/26/10 3:37pm
Msg #333583

Re: This is the type of thing that should be clarified by law

"People who get their D/L's suspended and taken away for a DUI or other traffic arrest should still be able to use their D/L's as identity documents IMO. "

Robert, re-read your post. How can they show a DL when its been taken away??? If it is suspended and they still physically have the card, how would we know its suspended?

I disagree that an expired license should be able to be used. Tell me what you can do with an expired license. Nothing. Ever try it? Ya, I feel for the little ole ladies and gents, but if they no longer drive, they need to get an ID card.

Reply by Notarysigner on 4/26/10 3:44pm
Msg #333584

Re: This is the type of thing that should be clarified by law

Robert has an interesting point. For example, our DL also double as a donor card. Now if someone unfortunately loses their live and the driver's license is expired, will they also lose the privilege of offering the organs? That information shows on the DL (expired).?

Reply by Linda Juenger on 4/26/10 3:48pm
Msg #333586

Interesting James. Don't know. Gonna check that out for

IL (or does someone know for sure) because ours also serves as a donor card.

Reply by C. Rivera Chicago Notary Services on 4/26/10 4:25pm
Msg #333593

no I don't think so, the donor info is still valid cause its

registered with the state...ever wonder why its on the DR or ID to begin with?

Reply by jba/fl on 4/26/10 6:24pm
Msg #333628

Re: no I don't think so, the donor info is still valid cause its

"ever wonder why its on the DR or ID to begin with? "

No - I sure don't. If I am in a traffic accident and CTD, they can get ready to harvest immediately if I have my ID with me.

In FL if I don't have my DL and get stopped for some reason, they can, at their option, take me to jail. This applies to everyone....so, if you don't have it, best be on your best behavior.

Reply by jba/fl on 4/26/10 3:52pm
Msg #333588

That poor little old woman has better resources than I

She can make an appointment to get an ID and when she gets there, if there is a wait, she will be bumped to the front of the line, even if I have the same appointment time or one before her. Do I begrudge her? Heck no. And - her State ID will NEVER expire if she is of a certain age.

Those rulings are in place to help our seniors. They need to take advantage of it and stay current. And lest you think this is heartless, revisit my post about my mom who is in this situation due to bad health and laziness of my siblings.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/26/10 4:11pm
Msg #333592

Completely agree Jules:) n/m

Reply by Notarysigner on 4/26/10 4:37pm
Msg #333597

Re: That poor little old woman has better resources than I

Well now that you brought up the senior thing, I haven't had to go to the DMV in the last 12 years, they send it to me in the mail.

Reply by jba/fl on 4/26/10 6:27pm
Msg #333629

Re: That poor little old woman has better resources than I

I had one of those "forever young" DL's until this past year when they insisted that I come in person and get a new one. Unfortunately, now I look, um, older than before.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/26/10 4:11pm
Msg #333591

Re: This is the type of thing that should be clarified by law

How much clearer can it be?
Current or issued within 5 years. That needs no clarification.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 4/26/10 4:27pm
Msg #333595

Re: This is the type of thing that should be clarified by law

We don't have that in IL. Either its current or its expired. Pretty clear. No 5yr thing.

Reply by Notarysigner on 4/26/10 4:39pm
Msg #333598

Re: This is the type of thing that should be clarified by law

That why I referred her to the handbook. All of our DL are not issued for the same period of time, some are two , three, four, five years. So it would work for three years but not if issued for five years.

Reply by Lisa Holley on 4/26/10 5:28pm
Msg #333618

Check state requirements with the state office

I had this situation come up and called the State office branch for notary services for clarification. It was explained to me that in Oregon an expired license with a renewal slip was adequate Identification. I'm sure this is different state by state and for that matter, lender by lender.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/26/10 6:04pm
Msg #333625

Re: Check state requirements with the state office

"...adequate Identification. I'm sure this is different state by state and for that matter, lender by lender."

I'll agree vary state to state, but lender to lender has no bearing on what we notaries can accept as ID - only what our state considers "adequate ID"... and I've had my share of companies tell me not to worry about the ID because there's a Name Affidavit or an A/K/A Affidavit in the package.

Don't care what the lender accepts - I care what my state accepts and that's it.

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/26/10 7:26pm
Msg #333641

Re: This is the type of thing that should be clarified by law

I had a non-obligated signer once who had to sign a loan on a house his mother was paying for which he was living in. We'll call him "Sonny" because that's what he called himself.

Sonny was straight up weird. Tall and weird. He drove an old van and wrote songs, you see...he was about 55 or 60...a former full-time and part-time beach bum, leathery and wrinkled and wearing an ancient Hawaiian shirt and cut offs. And, while we waited on Momma to get there I had to listen to a song he had written about Surfside Beach, Texas. Great. Perfect. Love an old never-been serenading me. He played his guitar and sang...and he played his scratchy 45 record on his little record player and sang along with it. Then, once he was finished singing those songs, I told him we needed to get down to business and I got Sonny to settle down and think about the loan process.

I asked him to show me his ID while we waited on Momma, who was obviously running late. He folded his hands, cocked his head at an angle that was supposed to be endearing, I guess, but looked really weird and crazed...and he clucked his tongue very dramatically. "Oh," he said wagging his head, "Sonny's been a veerry, very, very bad boy."

I think, "Crap. Did Sonny kill Momma?? Am I next?" Fortunately, about that time Momma drove up in her long black Lincoln Continental which was probably from the 80s because it was as big as a whale. Sonny pranced off to the other room and came back with a brown envelope with his DL taped to it and it had a sticker on it-- "Suspended" it said. But, I could see it was Sonny and it was current...it was just no good to him to use for driving his beat up old white Good Times van at that time. The envelope was the one they used to put his valuables in while he was in the pokey for DWI #2+, so he said...because he had "...been a very, very bad boy." He liked saying that.

That was the point of the story...the DL was available, although suspended. But, if you'd like more detail, Sonny played piano in a purported fancy restaurant and apparently had trouble staying sober. In fact, he tried to serve beer while we signed the documents, but I refused and told him we could not sign, nor could Momma, if they commenced to drink while I was there. It was obviously beer-thirty right then and there for him because poor Sonny shook like a leaf while he signed, but he wasn't imbibing, and neither was Momma.

Curiously enough, Momma was only 14 years older than Sonny. I do remember that.

We finished up a quickly in spite of Momma and Sonny fighting no less than three times during that signing about that damn woman he occasionally takes up with. After I left...practically running from that macabre scene, I am sure that a good time was had by all.

Reply by jba/fl on 4/26/10 8:31pm
Msg #333648

You Texans just do it up right! ROFLMAO!

You really got me with, "I think, "Crap. Did Sonny kill Momma?? Am I next?" " Since you were relating the story, I knew it was ok to bust my gut on this.

Thanks for the great evening!

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/26/10 8:48pm
Msg #333649

That was one of the most memorable signings I've

ever had. It was fraught with dramatic behavior...fighting, singing, some of what could be called dancing while singing and playing "Lost Weekend in Surfside" unplugged...just remembered that's what he called his song...no sex (thank The Good Lord!) but I feel certain that drugs in the form of remnants of TCH could have been shellacked inside the walls of those veins from that long ago lost weekend in Surfside...maybe a little Quaalude and LSD, too. (It was fairly early in the day--before noon...that's why no beer had been drunk yet, as far as I could tell.) A regular off-Broadway production right in the heart of Bryan, Texas, it was.

It still gives the shivering willies just thinking about Momma's and Sonny's age difference. That means she was probably carrying him when she was 13. Never a more dramatic pair have I had the pleasure of signing. Chase loan. I do remember that. I remember that it was one of those where they wanted blanks filled in with black ink, and signatures with blue ink. Now, in the chaos of all the fighting and tremoring going on, that was undoubtedly one of my finest notary moments, being able to deftly swap out those pens like I did. Too bad I didn't make a video of that one. I'd put ol' Rob the Notary (see a post in Leisure) right out of business.

(BTW - "Sonny" wasn't his real name. It was just what he called himself...in third person, no less.)

Glad I could give you a laugh, Juls.

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 4/27/10 2:37am
Msg #333674

Brenda, You found Shaggy! Did you get a chance to see

Scooby? LOL

Reply by CopperheadVA on 4/26/10 7:48pm
Msg #333644

Here in VA you used to be able to get your renewed D/L right away on the spot at the DMV. That is no longer the case with the new and improved D/L's that many states now have - they are created off-site with engraving and mailed to the recipient.

I just renewed mine and the DMV punched the word "VOID" in it and gave me a slip of paper that showed I had paid for a renewal. I saw that word "VOID" on my ID and I was thinking OMG now I have no valid identification! I asked the DMV clerk if the two together was considered a valid drivers license and she said yes.

Reply by GOLDGIRL/CA on 4/27/10 1:04am
Msg #333670

While the combo is a valid DL, it couldn't be used in CA for valid ID!

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/27/10 7:28am
Msg #333689

Same here...

Although we get our licenses on the spot, if we WERE issued a "receipt" evidencing renewal it would not be acceptable as ID for notarial purposes.