Posted by Lita on 4/25/10 5:26pm
Msg #333443

Important Fact about Signature by Mark (x)

Since this is something we don’t deal with often I thought I would post an FYI. Everything I have read says the witnesses do not have to sign in your journal, only the person signing with the mark (x) does. Per the CA SOS 2010 handbook, to qualify the mark (x) as a signature a witness must also write the signers name next to the mark (x) in the journal and then sign their name.

So, yes the witnesses do not need to sign the notary journal for the purpose of being identified but one of them does to validate the signer’s mark (x). It doesn’t say which one but I would think the one who signed the signers name on the document should act as the witness in the journal.

“The signer by mark must include his or her mark in the notary public journal. To qualify
as a signature, the making of the mark in the notary public journal, must be witnessed by
an individual who must write the person’s name next to the mark and then sign his or her
own name as a witness.”

I have a nice little cheat sheet I put together for 10 yrs from now when I finally get one, if anyone wants it just email me.

Reply by LKT/CA on 4/25/10 6:10pm
Msg #333461

Something I didn't realize could be done but the witnesses to the signature by mark can - at the same time - also act as credible witnesses (if necessary):

Page 14............."Exception: If the witnesses were acting in the capacity of credible witnesses in establishing the identity of the person signing by mark, then the witnesses' signatures must be entered in the notary public's journal."

That's good to know....the few signature by mark appts I done, the signers had current ID but this is helps if in the future CWs are needed too, now we'd only need two people not four.

Reply by Lita on 4/25/10 6:30pm
Msg #333468

yeah, I realized that we could use them as credible witnesses IF they know the signer, but the witnesses to the mark (x) do not need to know the signer they just need to witness the signer signing.

Reply by LKT/CA on 4/25/10 6:50pm
Msg #333475

I think I'm just going to make copies of the handbook pages outlining the situations I rarely (or haven't yet) handle:

Signature by mark, plus the example....pgs 14 - 15
Subdivision maps (this is the only notarization that doesn't require our seals)....pg 7
No fee can be charged (two instances).....pg 17
Proof of Execution by a Subscribing Witness......pgs 12 - 13

Reply by Lita on 4/25/10 7:04pm
Msg #333477

yeah, that's what I am doing. I'm detailed easy to understand notes on all this sort of stuff. I got stuck the other night on credible witnesses and how to log in my journal so as a result I'm getting all this sort of stuff outlined for my emergency use. I'd be happy to email you what I have and you can use it , modify, or toss it.

Reply by LKT/CA on 4/25/10 7:53pm
Msg #333486

Ok, I'd appreciate [e-mail address]