Posted by LatteLady/NV on 4/26/10 7:20pm
Msg #333635

Signing in pencil

I go to the local jail at least 5 times a month. Never have had any big problems. Today when I went downstairs and met the inmate, slid the documents and my book under the door. A few minutes later, the inmate shows me a pencil with a confused look on his face. I shook my head no. I asked the cage guard to please give the inmate a pen. He replied back, "Ma'am this is a prison, the inmates aren't allowed to have pens". Well knowing that this is bunch of BS I told him that I have a book full on inmate signatures in pen and this is not true that inmates can't have pens.

The cage guard had to call his supervisor for permission to give the inmate a pen. After a few minutes, he called the inmate over and then proceeded to throw the pen in his face. I was so angry but I knew I had to keep my composure or they would throw me out of there.

So what would I have done if the cage guard was a jerk and wouldn't have given the prisoner a pen? I only have one chance with the inmate. If something goes wrong, I can't leave and come back. Can a legal document be signed with a pencil?

Reply by MW/VA on 4/26/10 7:24pm
Msg #333638

Sounds like the guard needed a crayon. LOL. As far as I know, NO to signing in pencil--it's not permanent.

Reply by Jessica Ward on 4/26/10 7:26pm
Msg #333642

I'd never dream of accepting a pencil signature. I think you had the right idea. I'd request a supervisor to allow the pen. Then once I got home, I'd call and report the guard's obnoxious behavior. (FYI: My husband works in a prison--that guard was WAY out of line).

Reply by NM/CA on 4/26/10 10:03pm
Msg #333664

depends on how the inmate has treated the guard? who's to say.................... no pencils would leave signing open for fraud..........

Reply by Bob_Chicago on 4/27/10 9:40am
Msg #333719

Agree guard was a jerk, but I queston if a pencil signature

IS , in fact , illegal. Not a great idea of course, but if he signed it with the intent of
being bound, then it is , in fact , his signature,

FWIW, see http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/signature

Same as discussions here, about not using gel pens, because they can be erased by
"ink washing"
Why would someone trying to commit fraud involving a signed document, even if
signed in pencil, by eliminating the valid signature, to insert a forged signature?
Pencil is "permanent " until erased. Many valuable art works have been signed in
pencil by the artist centuries ago.
Fraud with a validly signed document would require changing the terms of the document,
not the signature. So long as document has been prepared using a permanent method
(permanent ink or laser printing) then the signature, even if in pencil or other
erasable method, authenicates what is contained in the document.

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/27/10 9:42am
Msg #333720

Agree, Bob. n/m

Reply by Notarysigner on 4/27/10 9:56am
Msg #333723

Re: Agree guard was a jerk, but I queston if a pencil signature

Very interesting thanks Bob.

Reply by NM/CA on 4/27/10 11:20am
Msg #333742

Re: Agree guard was a jerk, but I queston if a pencil signature

Best to check with your local SOS as to what is acceptable for recording in the county........