Posted by pat/WA on 4/24/10 10:19am
Msg #333243

need an opinion

I inadvertanly completed the notary blocks in blue. They are going to be recorded in Nevada.
Should I include loose acknowledgments in black? Thanks for your help. And thanks Paw for your advice but the Chicago Title instructions say no blue ink except for signatures.

Reply by Robert/FL on 4/24/10 10:23am
Msg #333245

Well since your instructions did say "No blue ink", why did you use blue ink? Did you just not see the instructions? In Florida we can't complete new acknowledgments once the notarization is complete; i.e. we have to be in the signer's presence in order to complete another acknowledgment certificate and affix our seal. But, I'm not sure what your regulations are in Washington. If your state allows you to correct/replace acknowledgments after the fact, I would re-do it in black ink.

Reply by pat/WA on 4/24/10 10:27am
Msg #333248

The instructions were from Chicago Title and were sent on a separate document. I didn't see it until I had completed the signing.
Your advice is appreciated.

Reply by pat/WA on 4/24/10 10:30am
Msg #333250

Appreciate any help

The instructions were sent from Chicago Title and I didn't see it until after the signing. I normally only use black ink unless instructed to use blue. In this case the borrower ignored the black pen I gave him and started signing with his pen, which was blue. I should have corrected him and had him sign in black. My mistake.

Reply by Robert/FL on 4/24/10 10:32am
Msg #333251

Re: Appreciate any help

What about going back and "tracing" over your original handwriting in black ink? You wouldn't be able to do anything about the signers' signatures but at least your certificates would be in black per the instructions, although it would probably take you forever.

Just a thought.

Reply by pat/WA on 4/24/10 10:38am
Msg #333253

Re: Appreciate any help

THANKS
I will give that a try. I was most concerned that my error would not cause the borrower delay in his financing.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/24/10 10:59am
Msg #333257

Re: Appreciate any help

"Tracing over"?? I don't think I'd do that...makes it look like the cert's been tampered with...
which, technically, it has been.


MHO

Reply by Robert/FL on 4/24/10 3:18pm
Msg #333306

Re: Appreciate any help

I agree, and it wouldn't fly in Florida because we can not correct even our own certificates after completion. But I'm not sure Washington's position on the matter. If they let notaries make "corrections" to their own certificates after the fact then I don't see how "tracing over" would be a violation.

Reply by Shelly_FL on 4/24/10 3:23pm
Msg #333307

May as well make a copy of it ... then it will be black!

Sweet sarcasm, of coarse!

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/24/10 10:24am
Msg #333246

There's your answer, Pat...

"...but the Chicago Title instructions say no blue ink except for signatures."

I'd line through the incorrect one, note "see attached ack" and attach an ack that complies with both your state laws AND their instructions....

Hopefully they'll accept that without docking your fee for the additional recording fees incurred.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/24/10 10:32am
Msg #333252

Robert's right, too....you may need to go back out

and complete the new ack in the signer's presence...not sure how much latitude you have in WA but here in FL we'd have to go back out - on our own dime.

Reply by Julie/MI on 4/24/10 11:00am
Msg #333258

Does the county have a specific ink color in order for it to record...frankly I find ink color laws absolutely absurd.

When I do closings at title companies here in Michigan, they have black and blue pens all over the place and especially in commercial closings some of the partners may sign in black and some and blue on the same documents.

I would just send it in with the blue. I've been closing loans since 1983, worked in my county's register of deeds office for 7 years, and we had stuff come in in pencil or purple or red ink and we could not reject it...

I bet you'll be fine and I wouldn't put a note on it either.....I've made a mistake on ink color a few times and Never ever ever ever had a problem.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/24/10 11:07am
Msg #333261

Julie...see Msg #33398

and she has clear instructions to complete everything in black ink as that's what's required in NV...

I disagree to just "send it in" - clearly an error has been made - just because that mistake is acceptable in MI, and MI would accept any color ("we had stuff come in in pencil or purple or red ink and we could not reject it.." doesn't mean it's going to be accepted in NV - and according to her instructions, it WON'T be accepted.

IMO she should do everything in her power to comply with the instructions she's been given and make the loan fundable and recordable, even if it means a return trip to the signers..

JMHO

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/24/10 11:07am
Msg #333262

Sorry...that's Msg #333198... n/m

Reply by NCLisa on 4/24/10 12:03pm
Msg #333272

Nevada allows blue or black ink

for signatures and notary acks.

Reply by dickb/wi on 4/25/10 1:32pm
Msg #333405

agreed julie..same with me...i always use black regardless..

of directions.....wis wants black so i don't even own any pens with blue ink and title co's have always said to me "no problem just go ahead and use black"........

Reply by Cheryl_NV on 4/24/10 11:12am
Msg #333264

Blue is the preferred color here in Nevada.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/24/10 11:16am
Msg #333265

Cheryl..then can you explain Paul's Msg #333217 pls? n/m

Reply by pat/WA on 4/24/10 11:24am
Msg #333267

Blue or Black????

I traced over the information on the notary block in black (not the signature). If anything happens, I will let you know.
It seems it does not matter how long you have been signing loans, somethin always happens that is new

Reply by Mary Ellen Elmore on 4/25/10 6:35pm
Msg #333469

Re: Cheryl..then can you explain Paul's Msg #333217 pls?

I quote from the stated message:

". . .printed in any ink other than black;"

It does not cover signatures but what color ink the specified documents in that particular section of NV notary law is being quoted must be printed in.

It actually refers to certain, specific documents must be printed in no color other than black.

The word signature does not even appear in the law Paul quoted in that post.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/25/10 7:13pm
Msg #333480

NV law is clear that text is to be black

Cheryl just said blue is the preferred color.....that's what I was asking about...not even talking about signatures....maybe she was.

IMO if text is to be in black then the preprinted notary cert should be included in that provision.

Just my thought

Reply by Cheryl_NV on 4/26/10 9:57am
Msg #333529

Re: Cheryl..then can you explain Paul's Msg #333217 pls?

The ink in your printer must be black. According to a letter I received from the county clerk saying due to the volume of signings I do and that my commission was about to exprire when I renewed and purchased a new stamp would I please buy the stamp in blue ink in addition to signing in blue ink. This letter came about a year and a half ago, if something has changed since then I am unaware of it.

Reply by LKT/CA on 4/24/10 11:42am
Msg #333269

<<<The instructions were from Chicago Title and were sent on a separate document. I didn't see it until I had completed the signing.>>>

I think this is just as important an issue, maybe even more important. Sometimes notaries get too comfortable and complacent and don't treat each signing like it's their first and don't treat each loan package as if it's totally different from all others they've ever had signed. Notaries get the, "I've been doing this forever, so I've been there, seen that, done that" bug and then the result of what you wrote happens.

We have to allow enough time between appointments, not be rushed and sit down and read the instructions and review the docs carefully BEFORE we commence with a signing. This "print and go and rush out the door" has to stop (not saying you printed and ran out the door, but that has been mentioned quite a bit too). This will avoid the headaches we create for ourselves and the borrowers.

Always treat each loan signing as if it were your first and treat each loan package as if it were totally different (not slightly different but TOTALLY different) from the last one you had signed.

Reply by John/CT on 4/24/10 2:41pm
Msg #333301

Excellent advice, Lisa. I, too, have to force myself to ask

"What's new or different with this package?" ... even if it is from same service and lender used in previous engagements. Turns out there are variations from time-to-time.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 4/24/10 5:24pm
Msg #333322

Re: Excellent advice, Lisa. I, too, have to force myself to ask

"Turns out there are variations from time-to-time."

True. And *changes* from time to time.

Reply by PAW on 4/24/10 12:46pm
Msg #333287

The way I read the statute, it says, "must ... not contain... text that is smaller than a 10-point Times New Roman font and is printed in any ink other than black"

At face value, to me, that would include any text, including the notary certificate.

Apparently, Chicago title also interprets it that way since their instructions stated 'no blue ink'.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/24/10 4:13pm
Msg #333314

I had one signing way back (probably 2003 or 2004), when I followed the instructions at the front of the loan package. Towards the back of the package was a paper with instructions to complete everything in black ink!! Naturally didn't see that until almost through with the signing, and had been using blue ink. Called the company and they said not to worry about it.

Reply by MW/VA on 4/24/10 5:31pm
Msg #333325

IME, some tc's just create their own rules. I have one tc

that REQUIRES all docs shrunk to fit letter-size & black ink. It's not a lender requirement, because I do signings for the same lender with other tc's. IMO it shouldn't have made any difference.

Reply by PAW on 4/24/10 6:50pm
Msg #333338

It *may* make a difference to the title company

Many recorders now specify docs need to be letter size or there will be an extra fee.

Reply by jba/fl on 4/24/10 7:18pm
Msg #333343

Re: It *may* make a difference to the title company

I think Orange County has required letter size for quite some time now, or extra fee. They used to have a ruling in place that must have 25% recycled content in paper, but I think that fell by the wayside. I would hate to see that requirement come into effect. That certainly would affect all of us.


(Look, used them both and spelled them both correctly!:effect/affect)

Reply by Starr/LV on 4/25/10 1:13am
Msg #333366

Re: It *may* make a difference to the title company

You can sign in either blue or black with the exception of the DOT that has to be signed in black.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/25/10 7:39am
Msg #333373

Now this is 3 versions of how do sign for property

in NV....poor Pat ...

Reply by Notarysigner on 4/25/10 12:38pm
Msg #333399

Re: It *may* make a difference to the title company

When I asked about this, I was told there is a $3.00 charge to record Doc that are not letter sized. Thus, the print all letter. Someone at the TC now has the wonderful job of enlarging the letter sized docs that should be legal sized. go figure.

Reply by jba/fl on 4/25/10 1:17pm
Msg #333403

there are simple solutions:

1. Redo their forms to be letter size
and
2. quit scanning to legal.

Reply by MW/VA on 4/24/10 7:23pm
Msg #333345

Yes, the Note & DOT are usually letter-size. I have a dual

tray printer, so it will print according to the file. What I was referring to is that the whole package is shunk to letter. That one gets me, because that's the big no-no that we're always told not to do.