Posted by Anonymous on 7/1/05 12:41am
Msg #49255
Explaining Docs
I did a signing and on the confirmation page it said they pay us to explain documents. I thought we are not suppose to explain any documents, according to NNA. I am not sure what every document in a package is, because there are always different documents in every package. Any comments or suggestions about becoming more familiar with docs would be greatly appreciated.
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Reply by Kevin Ahern on 7/1/05 3:36am
Msg #49261
There is a difference between explaining the documents and identifying the documents. Unless you are an attorney explaining the contents of documents could result in prosecution for an unauthorized practice of law. It could also lead to the borrowers suing you for negligence if you give them the wrong information.
Identifying a document on the other hand is nothing more than telling a borrower that "This is the mortgage or note", when the particular document was clearly marked as such by the lender when it created the document package. If you are identifying the document you are only drawing the borrowers attention to the document's title as printed on the page.
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Reply by Anonymous on 7/1/05 8:07am
Msg #49278
Thank You, I was just wondering why this SS said I am paid to explain the docs.
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Reply by PAW_Fl on 7/1/05 8:34am
Msg #49282
I think you need to go further than just reading the title of the document. You must be able to "explain" the **purpose** of the document. You cannot go into the details that are specific to the loan, but you certainly can, and imo, should, explain what the document is for. For example, just simply telling the borrower "this is the PUD Rider, sign here" is a disservice to the signer. They need to know and understand what a PUD rider is for and why it is in their package.
Personally, if someone came to me and just read the titles of the documents and pointed to where I was to sign, I would ask them to leave, call my broker and get someone who knew how to explain why there's all those papers that have to be signed.
There are some documents that really need to be examined by the borrower, at the table, before signing them. Docs that they swear to, for example the Title Affidavit or the Survey Affidavit. You simply cannot say this is the Title Affidavit, sign here.
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Reply by Charm_AL on 7/1/05 8:38am
Msg #49283
I agree with PAW...You must be able to explain the docs...espesically that PUD rider LOL...sorry couldn't help myself!
Yes, you do need to know the docs, which is why you need to study them before you sign if you aren't sure what they are.
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Reply by Bobbi in CT on 7/1/05 9:23am
Msg #49293
Nice answer /nm
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Reply by Bobbi in CT on 7/1/05 9:28am
Msg #49296
CT specific: "Explaining" docs can have bad effect on NSA...
:(
ANY CT lawyer will tell you that a non-attorney "explaining" or "summarizing" anything is the unauthorized practice of law.
I am not suggesting or recommending what a non-attorney NSA does or says to the borrower.
It is Your Individual Choice.
Just pointing out that, because of the view CT attorneys take, my style is to err on the side of caution.
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Reply by TAgey_VA on 7/1/05 9:30am
Msg #49297
Re: CT specific: "Explaining" docs can have bad effect on NSA...
I agree tiwh Bobbi in CT. We hold same views here in Virginia.
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Reply by Stephen_VA on 7/1/05 12:39pm
Msg #49372
Re: CT specific: "Explaining" docs can have bad effect on NSA...
I would disagree somewhat. Summarizing the document if it does not "require the execercise of legal judgement" is *not* UPL in Virginia. The primary distinction is not whether your summarizing but whether you are using legal knowledge to do the summation or advising the person about how the document effects them legally.
So, summarizing a document by saying "This is the note, it contains the rate, your pre-payment info, change dates, index information, etc." is not UPL. Saying "don't worry about the accleration clause, loans are never accelerated" would very much be UPL.
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Reply by Stephen_VA on 7/1/05 12:44pm
Msg #49373
Here's the funny grey area clause:
...shall be engaged in UPL if.....
UPC 6-8 g: Provides a legal opinion in reponse to inquiries regarding rights and obligation under legal documents provided that a layman's description of the purpose or intent of a document shall not constitue a legal opinion.
And there is the wonderful grey area.
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Reply by SamIam_CA on 7/1/05 12:46pm
Msg #49375
Re: Here's the funny grey area clause:
What does UPC stand for?
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Reply by Stephen_VA on 7/1/05 1:17pm
Msg #49387
Re: Here's the funny grey area clause:
It appears to stand for Unauthorized Practice Considerations, its just a subdiving heading in the UPL Rules and Considerations document.
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Reply by Stephen_VA on 7/1/05 1:16pm
Msg #49386
Re: Here's the funny grey area clause:
It appears to stand for Unauthorized Practice Considerations, its just a subdiving heading in the UPL Rules and Considerations document.
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Reply by SamIam_CA on 7/1/05 1:18pm
Msg #49390
got it! Thanks for the info. n/m
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Reply by Kevin Ahern on 7/1/05 3:04pm
Msg #49409
Re: Here's the funny grey area clause:
And that wonderful grey area is the stuff of which law suits are made. I pick up a lot of litigation business thanks to the grey areas that require a judge's ruling.
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Reply by BrendaTX on 7/1/05 9:46am
Msg #49307
**Unless you are an attorney explaining the contents of documents could result in prosecution for an unauthorized practice of law. It could also lead to the borrowers suing you for negligence if you give them the wrong information. **
Agree. The best scenario for a new NSA is to find companies which have their "stock" answer for explaining a certain document, and hopefully have it available to the NSA.
I think that in post #33325 there may be a link to Dogmonger's post for an SS w/ this kind of info online. If not, perhaps you can search for it under the poster's name "dogmonger." Or maybe Dog will repost it.
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Reply by Barb NY on 7/1/05 8:41am
Msg #49285
Agree with PAW. I usually tell people I will explain what the docs are and if there is a question as to the numbers or terms of the docs we will have to call the title co/lender (whoever the contact is).
Explanation does not have to be complex. For example, this is your mortgage. It is the lien again your house in the amount of your loan for xxx years. You can point to that on the paperwork. I usually do the HUD and note first. Because if the note is not correct that is the end of the signing for that day. And while the HUD can be corrected and sent to the borrower directly, it needs to be resolved with Title co/lender or borrower may not want to continue.
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Reply by IL-Not on 7/1/05 9:40am
Msg #49303
Thank you, Re: Explaining Docs
Information like this is why we all come to NotRot on a daily basis. Although there is some conflicting reports, depending on your state, it is all very good information. I try to give a 'brief' explanation about the docs before presenting it. That is the best I can offer, further questions need to be directed to the LO.
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Reply by Barb NY on 7/1/05 11:38am
Msg #49356
Re: Thank you, Re: Explaining Docs
Sounds like you are doing it right. When in doubt call the LO or if you have a contact, the Title Co.
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Reply by Kevin Ahern on 7/1/05 3:11pm
Msg #49410
And is New York a title theory or a lien theory state with respect to the encumbrance it creates on the borrower's property. If New york is a title theory state then the mortgage is more than just a lien. It splits the title to the property and conveys legal title to the property to the lender, while the borrower retains the equitable title, and you would have given the borrower the wrong information.
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Reply by Nancy in Florida on 7/1/05 6:04pm
Msg #49440
Re: FYI for Kevin Ahern
Kevin, the answer to your question is that NY is a lien theory State.
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Reply by SamIam_CA on 7/1/05 12:44pm
Msg #49374
The Signing Registry has a great training guide with a script. It helped/s me to answer the "what" questions about the docs - without crossing over into the "whys & hows".
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Reply by CindyF on 7/1/05 2:05pm
Msg #49395
Where would I find the training guide with a script in the Signing Registry. I looked but couldn't find it.
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Reply by PAW_Fl on 7/1/05 2:09pm
Msg #49396
You need to purchase it from the Signing Registry. Go to http://www.SigningRegistry.info, scroll down the page a bit, and click on the link for the Training Guide.
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Reply by Charm_AL on 7/1/05 2:32pm
Msg #49403
another link...
http://www.americannn.com/resources/resourcefs.html
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Reply by hcampers/fl on 7/2/05 8:35am
Msg #49537
Charm are you a member? If so has it helped you in any way?
Thanks,
b.
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