Posted by C. Wayne Moore on 6/6/08 11:48am
Msg #250242

Certifying a Note?

Have a Wells Fargo note that requires the Notary Certify the note is for the property listed on the DOT. Anyone ever run across this?

CW

Reply by sue_pa on 6/6/08 11:54am
Msg #250243

I've completed A LOT of Wells fargo loans and have never seen this.

Many if not most states don't allow a notary to certify. PA does. I would NEVER do this certification - it's not what I'm paid to do - I am paid to obtain signatures on documents - not determine if the docs are compliant. Someone at the lender or title company should be certifying this.

Reply by C. Wayne Moore on 6/6/08 12:01pm
Msg #250245

Sue. WF says this is new. They want me to sign and place the seal. Never seen it before and neither has the SS that hired me.

Reply by WDMD on 6/6/08 12:03pm
Msg #250247

I've seen notes for Virginia properties that have a notarial certificate on them.

Reply by C. Wayne Moore on 6/6/08 12:08pm
Msg #250249

This is a VA property. The wording is "This is to certify that this is the Note described in and secured by a DOT dated ..... on the Property located in ......, VA.


Notary Publice; My commission expires ....

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 6/6/08 12:14pm
Msg #250253

I would let the notary at Wells Fargo take care of that one! I would not certify to anything.

Reply by CopperheadVA on 6/6/08 12:07pm
Msg #250248

This is common in Virginia. Not all Notes require notarization here (don't ask me why - I have no idea why some do and some don't), but when there is indication they want the Note notarized, this is always the wording. I always have to add the venue and also a separate sentence indicating the date of the notarization. If you don't notarize it, they will kick it back to you.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/6/08 12:12pm
Msg #250250

I've had a handful who required the note notarized

but according to the post, this isn't notarizing the Note - it's certifying that the property in the Note is the property secured by the Mortgage - MHO I wouldn't be comfortable certifying that at all....I don't feel that's our job - that's up to title. JMHO

Reply by WDMD on 6/6/08 12:27pm
Msg #250258

Re: I've had a handful who required the note notarized

" but according to the post, this isn't notarizing the Note - it's certifying that the property in the Note is the property secured by the Mortgage - MHO I wouldn't be comfortable certifying that at all....I don't feel that's our job - that's up to title. JMHO"

It may not be acceptable notary language in your state, but it may be perfectly fine for Virginia notaries to complete.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/6/08 12:29pm
Msg #250259

The original poster is in FL..:) n/m

Reply by WDMD on 6/6/08 12:36pm
Msg #250260

Re: The original poster is in FL..:)

True, but that still does not mean that the language is not acceptable for Virginia. You stated it is not a notary certificate. I only stated that just because it's not acceptable for you, does not mean it is not acceptable to another state.

As I recall, notes are recorded with DOT's in Virginia if I'm not mistaken. Maybe that is why Virginia wants both the DOT and note to be notarized.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 6/7/08 1:00am
Msg #250343

Re: The original poster is in FL..:)

Maybe we need some additional information here. To me, it didn't seem like the issue had to do with correct notary language. The issue appeared to be that they were asking for the *notary* to make a certification that they may not have information about and/or may not be allowed to do in their state. How are we to know for absolute certain that the Note and DOT are for the same property?

However, since we typically are notarizing the signature, and not the document, if the borrowers were signing a statement that said that THEY certified that those docs were for the same property, then the notary would be within his/her authority to notarize the signatures on that doc. jmo

Reply by CopperheadVA on 6/6/08 12:12pm
Msg #250251

Also, make sure that the DOT has the notary certificate on the same page as the signatures of the borrowers. The recorder may kick it back if it isn't. Definitely would get kicked back if notarized in Virginia - not sure what they would do when notary certificate is on a separate page and notarized in another state that allows that. I've heard they will kick back anyway.

Reply by MW/VA on 6/7/08 12:31pm
Msg #250381

Yes, I've had a lot of these also. I never even thought to question it. IMO it just ties the Note to the DOT. If the tc provided the wording, isn't it UPL for me to decide whether I will complete it or not????

Reply by MikeC/NY on 6/7/08 10:05pm
Msg #250410

" If the tc provided the wording, isn't it UPL for me to decide whether I will complete it or not????"

I think UPL is generally more a sin of commission rather than of omission, so failing to do something you were asked to do probably wouldn't qualify as UPL. Check your state statutes (or "statues", as some people seem to keep referring to them...); if you are allowed to certify and are willing to, it's not a problem.

But why would you certify something you have no personal knowledge of?

Reply by WDMD on 6/8/08 6:06am
Msg #250423

MikeC/NY asks:
"But why would you certify something you have no personal knowledge of?"






This is the language I have seen placed on some Viriginia notes.

This is to certify that this is the Note described in and secured by a Deed of Trust dated ________________________________, ____________, on the Property located in _______________________________________, Virginia.


My Commission Expires:

____________________________________________
Notary Public

Notary Registration Number:

Date of Notarization:

Place of Notarization:

Reply by MikeC/NY on 6/8/08 12:20pm
Msg #250438

I wouldn't sign that - it would require me to review the DOT and make a judgment about the authenticity of the Note. That would shift some of the responsibility over to me, and that's not my job as either notary or SA.

I'm not sure it would be legal for me to sign that in NY, but even if it were I wouldn't.

Reply by WDMD on 6/8/08 12:34pm
Msg #250439

"I wouldn't sign that - it would require me to review the DOT and make a judgment about the authenticity of the Note."


I read it as stating that that is the same note that was signed during the closing. My state handbook only prohibits certifying COPIES. It is silent on certifying original documents. Think I'll give my SOS a call on this one. I'll be interested in their take on this.

Reply by PAW on 6/6/08 12:43pm
Msg #250264

Certifying a Note, or the contents of any document, is not an authorized function or duty of a Florida Notary Public.

Bottom line is you cannot notarize the Note with that language. However, having been in this situation before myself, I was instructed to sign it as the signing agent, not notarizing it, and adding a loose acknowledgment with an explanation as to why the loose ack was attached. (Citing that certifying document contents is not authorized by Florida statutes, however the signers acknowledge that the Note references the correct DOT.)

I also recommend contacting Wells Fargo and explaining the situation. It may be that the loan officer or other Wells employee, in VA may certify the document.