Posted by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 9:05am
Msg #253235

Question

Hello, I've been a notary now for 4 yrs. and new as a Signing Agent and have received my first closing assignment on Wednesday, June 25th. I received the call from the client around 3 p.m. for a closing that was suppose to take place between 5-6p. I received the documents, we agreed on my fees and I waited up until 7 p.m. and was then told that the borrower didn't get off from work until 7:30 p.m. I said okay I would still make the closing. Then, just as I was preparing to print the documents the client called and said that the lender said not to close that evening.

This was truly an inconvenience to me and was wondering if its appropriate to charge a late cancellation fee and if so, what time frame and amount would be appropriate? Please help!

Reply by Loretta on 6/27/08 9:12am
Msg #253236

Most companies do not pay a cancellation fee. It happens, not often, but it does and we have to take the hit. That's the way this business works. Be thankful that you did not print the package because I haven't had one company in 12 years reimburse for printing docs on a cancellation.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 9:31am
Msg #253246

Thanks! Do you have any suggestions as to what amount to establish as a print fee if I happen to print documents before they cancel?

Reply by nolanotary on 6/27/08 9:13am
Msg #253237

I would bill them for a print charge. Depending on the company, they may or may not pay it. If they weren't willing to pay, I would tell them to remove you from their call list...I personally don't want to work for companies that aren't willing to reimburse me for actions or mistakes that were not my fault.

Reply by Dave_CA on 6/27/08 9:16am
Msg #253239

I've always charged a print fee on a cancellation.
So far there has only been one time that a company refused and I just don't take assignments from them anymore.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 9:29am
Msg #253243

Thanks!

Reply by Carolyn Bodley on 6/27/08 10:09am
Msg #253266

Re: As long as I've printed out the docs,

I always send an invoice for the printing charge on cancellations. Additionally, I give them the choice of me returning the docs, or add a shredding fee on top of the printing charge. I've only had one company that stiffed me on the printing charge, and they were a fly-by-night company that lasted less than 6 months.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 10:11am
Msg #253267

Re: As long as I've printed out the docs,

Thanks! This is helpful to know. Take care!

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 9:16am
Msg #253240

Re: Bill for a print charge??? She didn't print. Why bill? n/m

Reply by Dave_CA on 6/27/08 9:18am
Msg #253241

Re: Bill for a print charge??? She didn't print. Why bill?

I was responding to this. " Be thankful that you did not print the package because I haven't had one company in 12 years reimburse for printing docs on a cancellation." from Loretta.

Reply by Loretta on 6/27/08 9:32am
Msg #253247

Re: Bill for a print charge??? She didn't print. Why bill?

It was signing services that have refused to pay me when I printed the package and the deal was cancelled. I asked to be taken off their list when they refused. Since things have slowed down, I usually do not print until just prior to the closing and I confirm with the borrower and the loan officer before I print and leave the house. I carry my laptop for last minute stuff.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 9:38am
Msg #253251

Re: Bill for a print charge??? She didn't print. Why bill?

Thanks!

Reply by LynnNC on 6/27/08 9:47am
Msg #253256

You carry a laptop for last minute stuff...

...I assume that you also carry a printer.

Reply by Loretta on 6/27/08 10:11am
Msg #253268

Re: You carry a laptop for last minute stuff...

I do carry a printer. I don't like to do it because my car looks like a ufo when I plug the printer in. The lights flash off and on while the docs are printing. It is sucking the life out of my battery.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 9:30am
Msg #253244

Thanks, but what amount would you suggest for a print fee?

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 9:34am
Msg #253249

YOU need to figure out what a reasonable fee is for YOUR business. What does it cost you to print a set of loan documents? That is the place to start.

Reply by LynnNC on 6/27/08 9:55am
Msg #253258

Most NSA's charge $25 to print a standard refi package. I have begun charging an additonal 25 cents per page for documents over 125 pages due to the fact that FHA loans have become the norm and often have many pages...I had one last week with 190 pages! We used to have piggback loans (a refi and a HELOC), and we would get two print fees, but, the FHA loans seem to have replaced them. FHA's can have as many pages and be as much work as two loans.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 10:06am
Msg #253265

Lynn, I truly appreciate your advice. This is all I was asking, but it seems I was misunderstood in what I was asking. This sheds much light on my question.

Take care!

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 9:15am
Msg #253238

Welcome to the wonderful world of the NSA business. Hurry up and wait it is the standard in most cases.

If you think this experience was an inconvenience you really need to look for another way to beef up your income. Not trying to be harsh, but being realistic.

There is no way you will be paid a cancellation fee, what for? You didn't even print the documents. You just took up a little of your time.

This is the nature of the beast.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 9:34am
Msg #253248

Thank you, I appreciate your input. I am a professional consultant by trade for more than 15 years so I do have a steady income, however since this was the first time I received an assignment I needed to know how to respond.

I'm not concerned about cancellations because I know they will occur I just wanted to know from someone else with experience in the NSA field as to how to respond when it occurs.

Thank you!

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 9:38am
Msg #253252

"I'm not concerned about cancellations because I know they will occur I just wanted to know from someone else with experience in the NSA field as to how to respond when it occurs."

That isn't how you came across, it sounded more like you wanted to be compensated for your time.

This is a very hard time to be breaking into this business. For most of us this is our full time job. We don't want to give advice or teach someone that uses this as a part time income to take what little business we have left. Sorry that is just how I feel.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 9:46am
Msg #253255

Hi, don't take this personal but being selfish is one of the things that may hold you back from obtaining the business you could have. For me personally, it doesn't matter if another NSA needs advice or not because I believe if I help them--I will be blessed in the process. No one can really take something that God means for you to have.

Actually, I wasn't going to take the assignment I was going to pass it over to an instructor I met at the NNA conference last month in New Orleans. She and I because became close friends and she lives within walking distance from my home. She didn't at all feel intimidated by my questions and concerns. Actually, we have collaborated our services.

This is how you will be blessed! Stop worrying about what someone else may take from you and if someone will get ahead of you. What's for you, is for you and no one can take it from you, but you can get in your own way by being selfish.

Take care!

Reply by LynnNC on 6/27/08 9:56am
Msg #253259

I agree! n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/27/08 10:00am
Msg #253262

You agree that Bev was being selfish??...wow.,..

She was stating a fact...MHO

Reply by BrendaTx on 6/27/08 10:05am
Msg #253264

Putting my money on Lynn/NC agreeing with Beverly.

I think that's what she meant.

I'm sure Lynn will let us know.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/27/08 10:12am
Msg #253269

Brenda, that would be more in character for Lynn...I hope

(and am optimistically sure) that I read that post wrong..

Reply by Becca_FL on 6/27/08 11:07am
Msg #253278

Bev, a selfish person? Lady, you know not of what you speak. n/m

Reply by LynnNC on 6/27/08 3:18pm
Msg #253375

Helping those in need

I should have been more specific - my comment had nothing to do with Bev being selfish, because I know that she is not...I think her post was misunderstood. What I agree with is that you can be blessed by helping others--not spoon-feeding newbies - but, helping people in general in life when they have a reasonable need. Bev and many others do that on this forum, and I try to when I can.

I believe the original question had to do with what to charge for edocs when a loan is cancelled prior to closing and the thread got off topic.

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 9:56am
Msg #253260

"Hi, don't take this personal but being selfish is one of the things that may hold you back from obtaining the business you could have. For me personally, it doesn't matter if another NSA needs advice or not because I believe if I help them--I will be blessed in the process. No one can really take something that God means for you to have.

Actually, I wasn't going to take the assignment I was going to pass it over to an instructor I met at the NNA conference last month in New Orleans. She and I because became close friends and she lives within walking distance from my home. She didn't at all feel intimidated by my questions and concerns. Actually, we have collaborated our services.

This is how you will be blessed! Stop worrying about what someone else may take from you and if someone will get ahead of you. What's for you, is for you and no one can take it from you, but you can get in your own way by being selfish.

Take care!"


Oh I see we are all looking at this wrong. Thanks for letting me know. Now I can change everything I've been doing and start running my business as a charity.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 10:03am
Msg #253263

No, of course not that's ridiculous. Over the years I have collaborated and established many partnerships and this is why my business is successful. If I were only thinking of myself and how (I) could get ahead I wouldn't be where I am today.

But since you're doing as well as you are you don't have to change anything. I wasn't implying that you should change anything. I just know that selfishness doesn't get anyone, anywhere FAST!

Good day to you!

Reply by Becca_FL on 6/27/08 11:13am
Msg #253280

Again, Helen, you are talking out of the side of your head. n/m

Reply by Becca_FL on 6/27/08 11:38am
Msg #253288

Re: Again, Helen, you are talking out of the side of your he

I just don't understand how you can come to this forum, as a self professed newbie and start telling long standing, successful NSA members how to run their business. You say you are a business consultant, but you can't even figure out how to set your prices? Where's your business plan, Ms. professional business consultant? I guess what they say is true...those that can DO, those that can't TEACH.

Reply by desktopfull on 6/27/08 11:48am
Msg #253293

This is a perfect example of why I don't respond to newbie's

very much anymore. "Catch 22" situation, they blast you if you tell them the truth and blast you if you don't respond. Becca, if someone is really bad at doing something do you really want them teaching the subject, because they are going to teach you to make the same mistakes they are.

Reply by desktopfull on 6/27/08 10:48am
Msg #253274

Why didn't you just go to your NNA instructor friend for

the answers to your questions since you've collaborated your services? OOPS!, I forgot the NNA doesn't do anything for free. You might also try reading the forum using the "ORANGE " search key before posting questions, your question has been answered many times on this forum. Welcome to the world of hurry up and wait!

Reply by Matilda Archer on 6/27/08 11:03am
Msg #253276

well said

Hi, don't take this personal but being selfish is one of the things that may hold you back from obtaining the business you could have. For me personally, it doesn't matter if another NSA needs advice or not because I believe if I help them--I will be blessed in the process. No one can really take something that God means for you to have


I honestly agree that when you help others you will be blessed regardless!!!!!!!! It is not just this business that is slow. That is the case with a lot of companies today. The economy is a mess right now.

Reply by LKT/CA on 6/27/08 12:43pm
Msg #253322

Helen..... 5 STAR POST !!!

Very well written!!! Excellent!!

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 1:22pm
Msg #253337

Re: Helen..... 5 STAR POST !!!

LKT you remind me of someone that used to post here....went by the name of FlawedMac. LOL
LOLOLOL!!

Reply by LKT/CA on 6/27/08 1:48pm
Msg #253354

Re: Helen..... 5 STAR POST !!!

It's jokers like you, hscamper, that tarnish the professionalism of this board.

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 2:00pm
Msg #253358

Re: Helen..... 5 STAR POST !!!

That's the funniest thing I've heard today! Thank you so much for the laugh!!! What a great way to start off the weekend.

Next on my list is to polish up on the CA state hand book to decide if I need to use an Ack or Jurat for any affidavits I have to notarize from CA.

After that I will go and take a look at who is working for Cornerstone Escrow.

Just a little busy work....

Reply by LKT/CA on 6/27/08 2:09pm
Msg #253362

Re: Helen..... 5 STAR POST !!!

Your post was funnier and I got a bigger laugh wondering why on earth you would think I should care at all who I remind you of....

Reply by JanetK_CA on 6/28/08 3:12am
Msg #253440

I think there's a big difference between being an unselfish, generous person by contributing to one's community (being a volunteer, donating time and money to worthy causes, etc.) and posting for all the world to read, information that one might consider part of a proprietary business plan. Companies that want to stay in business don't do the latter (that's why there is such thing as non-disclosure agreements), nor do they freely train their competition. As a profit-making enterprise, that's just smart business. Would you give out whatever consulting expertise you have for free to anyone just because they asked? If not, I don't believe most sensible people would consider that a selfish act. They might consider it a foolish act if you did otherwise.

I just find it interesting that it is nearly always the ones asking for help who complain that others who don't jump to respond are selfish. I also believe that God expects us to work to the best of our ability for what we receive, not to expect it to be given to us from the sweat of someone else's brow... so to speak. ;>

Some of the very people whom you are "dissing" here have, over the years, given beyond belief on this board. And the amazing thing is that it is all still here for the finding, if only people would be willing to put forth the effort to look!

BTW, here's a freebie for you: if you DO decide to do some reading on this board, it won't take you too long to find out that most of us are not exactly fans of the NNA any more...

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 9:19am
Msg #253242

I double checked, she didn't print....

"Then, just as I was preparing to print the documents the client called and said that the lender said not to close that evening."

Reply by MW/VA on 6/27/08 9:37am
Msg #253250

Welcome to the world of closing loans. This is not the only time you will be "inconvenienced".
It is a tough business. There are situations when you will get a signing for say 6:00 & not get docs until 7:00. Unless you are prepared to be very flexible, this may not be for you.
Someone said to me early on, "this business will make you crazy if you let it". It would be normal to charge a "trip & print fee" if you went to the appointment, but the borrower didn't sign. Some notaries charge for cancellations within 2 hrs. of the appointment, but I have no idea if they actually get paid for those. That being said, this business can be very lucrative.
I figure if I make $100 for about 3 hrs. work (print, go to signing, complete & drop package) that is good money compared to what I could make at some $7/hr. job. It's not for everyone. The choice is yours. I wish you success.

Reply by Helen Gill on 6/27/08 9:41am
Msg #253253

Thanks for your comments. I'm a professional consultant for more than 15 years so I'm used to cancellations, however--by the NSA field being new I needed to know how to respond. Yes, the fee is good although as a consultant I can earn more than that in a days work. I am very interested in this field and believe it can work, this is why I added it as a component to my consultant business.

Thank you again and have a blessed day!

Reply by hcampersFL on 6/27/08 9:50am
Msg #253257

MW/VA before I assume and make an ass out of you and me

are you saying you make $100 profit for a closing? Or are you getting $100 and have not taken into account paper, toner, gas, insurance, advertising, cell phone, internet, marketing, listings, office space, car expense, car insurance, and all the extra expenses that I can't think of off the top of my head.

Reply by MW/VA on 6/27/08 10:16am
Msg #253270

Re: MW/VA before I assume and make an ass out of you and me

I didn't say it was $100 profit & was using that as a example. I'm not a newbie & have my business set up as an LLC.
Even with all the expense factors, which also greatly reduce the amount of taxable income I have, it is still more profitable for me than a "job". That was the only point I was trying to make. I do get very tired of the "knit-picking" that goes on at this forum. I take the time to participate in the discussions, but don't have the time to analyze/criticize someone else's post.

Reply by ZeeCA on 6/27/08 10:29am
Msg #253273

ANOTHER HOBBYIST/PART TIMER who is going to splain to us

how to run our business and of course an NNA grad.

Helen you will be outta luck if you really need help w/ your attitude. Your rudeness to some of the best will come back to bite ya later on. You will post a help question and the silence of the best will be deafening. Of course the ones who know nothing will gladly answer.

JMO

Reply by desktopfull on 6/27/08 10:50am
Msg #253275

Great response Zee! n/m