Posted by NCLisa on 6/12/08 6:53am
Msg #250970

What to do about the Witness Requirement?

I've got a closing at 7pm Friday evening for an SC property. I need a witness to the mtg signing. Borrower refuses to call a neighbor, and called the Lender, and TC to say that I must bring a witness or have someone meet me there. I asked the borrower to please meet me at a Starbucks or fast food for witness, they refuse because they have 2 small children and will not hire a sitter for an hour.

I don't know anyone willing to drive 50 miles round trip to witness the mtg signing. My daughter is not old enough at 17. I can't bring anyone with me, as I have 3 closings prior to this one, and none of them are close to home.

TC would really like me to find a solution. I don't have one as the borrower will not work with me.

Reply by Lee/AR on 6/12/08 7:01am
Msg #250971

B's have a problem. You don't. JMO n/m

Reply by Lee/AR on 6/12/08 7:12am
Msg #250975

Possible solution

As long as they've dumped this on you, got a friend who wouldn't mind driving 50 miles---and getting paid for doing this? Figure Time--even at min. wage-- & Mileage--at gov. standards-- and dump it back in Bo's lap. Maybe hiring a babysitter or calling in a neighbor won't look so bad to them then.

Reply by GA/Atty on 6/12/08 7:02am
Msg #250972

I would tell the borrower that I will call the neighbor and

ask if they had a preference as to whom I call.

Sounds kind of odd, but what else ya gonna do with difficult borrowers.

Also sounds like borrowers may not want to sign but don't want to come out and say it?

Good luck.

Reply by LKT/CA on 6/12/08 7:09am
Msg #250973

<<<Borrower refuses to call a neighbor.....they have 2 small children and will not hire a sitter for an hour. >>>

They are going to great lengths *not* to cooperate. I agree with GA/Atty - they probably don't want to sign and are looking for a convenient way out of the deal.

Reply by PAW on 6/12/08 7:10am
Msg #250974

Explain to the borrower(s) ...

... that witnesses are required by SC statute. If they don't provide an accommodating witness, that the closing can not be facilitated and their loan may be canceled. IOW, you need to impress on them that it is THEIR problem. This may also be needed to be stated to the hiring agency (SS, title company and lender).

Reply by NCLisa on 6/12/08 7:37am
Msg #250978

TC just emailed and said that BO is willing

to pay for a witness. So that will make things a bit easier. I'll get my daughters 18yo friend for $50. That will pay for gas and the movies for both of them (including popcorn and a drink).

Reply by Les_CO on 6/12/08 10:35am
Msg #251005

Re: TC just emailed and said that BO is willing

So are they going to change the HUD to include this additional cost to the borrower? If not is it a RESPA violation?

Reply by NCLisa on 6/12/08 10:42am
Msg #251012

Re: TC just emailed and said that BO is willing

The TC said they'd have to put the charge on the hud so witness would get paid. They don't have a agreement with the lender that covers witnesses, only NSA's.

Reply by nolanotary on 6/12/08 8:37am
Msg #250983

In Louisiana, 2 witnesses are required for every mortgage signing. I always contact the borrower immediately after I receive the order and confirm the appointment and explain the process, including what will be required in order for the closing to be successfull:

1. All signers must be present
1. All signers must present a vaild ID.
2. 2 witnesses - which they will be responsible to provide.

Most have never heard about the witness requirements until I call, and they are skeptical about bring witnesses to the closing table. I explain to them that they only need to show up at the end to witness their signatures on the last page of mortgage...then the closing is complete. I suggest family, friends, neighbors, etc. Some have asked me to bring the witnesses; however, I refuse because I don't want the liability of bringing people into a strangers home or business. Ultimately, the witnesses are the borrower's responsibility and if they cannot provide them, the closing appointment must be cancelled/rescheduled. If they really want to complete the deal, they will get the witnesses.

Reply by sue_pa on 6/12/08 8:43am
Msg #250984

...Some have asked me to bring the witnesses; however, I refuse because I don't want the liability of bringing people into a strangers home or business...

Every time I read about someone being asked to bring a witness this is one of my thoughts. The borrowers will assume that the witness is a paid employee of someone.

The other thought is that this is BIG business and why any signing service, title company or lender assumes the notary will bring an unpaid individual along is totally beyond my comprehension.

Reply by Maureen_nh on 6/12/08 9:02am
Msg #250985

I don't know if you have done a SC closing before but in case you haven't you will be notarizing the witnesses and not the borrower. I was very confused first time.
Are they having a lawyer on the line to make it legal?

Reply by NCLisa on 6/12/08 9:44am
Msg #250993

Actually, a SC DT can have 1 of 2 types of ack. One where you only notarize the witnesses, or one where you notarize just the borrowers. I have examples of both of them, and that is about the only thing the attorney on the phone talks about, is the ack.

Reply by Julie/MI on 6/12/08 9:08am
Msg #250986

I detest mortgagors like them....

MI used to be a two witness state until 2003, and what a pain in the patootie that used to be for us. In the title company it was no big deal, someone was around, but in the field, that was sometimes the most difficult part for me.

The mortgagors always felt wierd that their neighbor had to see their personal business, so I always just had the signature/witness/notary page visible when the witness got there, but then I had to kick them out because they wanted to make small talk.

Glad the 18 year old can make a quick $50.

Interestingly enough, the Michigan title companies got together and lobbied their state reps/senators and said that no one really witnessed the document anyway....

Reply by NCLisa on 6/12/08 10:37am
Msg #251007

To clarify, the Lender & TC were aware that BO

refused to find a witness. That is how it became my problem along with their problem. Borrower has refused each and every suggestion about how to do this, other than I bring someone.

Borrower has now even offered to pay for a witness, and not a babysitter!

Reply by Lee/AR on 6/12/08 10:41am
Msg #251011

Make sure they understand it's CASH/Now! n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 6/12/08 10:44am
Msg #251013

I know you have it resolved, Lisa, but how about

telling the LO he/she needs to be there with another witness...just a thought.