Posted by BrendaTx on 1/1/11 9:24am
Msg #366636

Remote Hire Notary Forms

Problem forms (two of many of this type):
Apparently, awhile back I saved a couple of remote hiring forms to my computer. It took me a minute, but now I know why I saved them. The scary part is that if notaries were not completing them as requested, the forms would change to meet notaries lawful abilities.

From UCLA:
This form requests the notary's seal be placed on the document without a notary act.
The instructions state, "If the required forms are completed by a notary, the notary stamp should be placed on the Remote Hire Notary Notice form or attach a notary certificate."

Form: http://www.payroll.ucla.edu/forms/remote-hire-notary-notice-set.pdf

I guess for this one, I would print my notary name and commission information in the spot for the requested seal and then attach the part of the law that forbids using the stamp alone.

Instructions:
http://ptplv.ais.ucla.edu/portal/site/UCLA/menuitem.789d0eb6c76e7ef0d66b02ddf848344a/?vgnextoid=a98dd3c6c8a91110VgnVCM200000ddd76180RCRD

From UFL - This one is for the notary to complete. There is no signature line and the notary is supposed to complete it with a jurat. I guess the jurat is supposed to be an attestation to the statements in the document.

http://www.hr.ufl.edu/recruitment/forms/remote_hire_notary.pdf

With this one, I would attempt to attest to it as a regular person, a designated agent. I would sign it, and mark out the notary certificate. This one is pretty badly formed. It's hard to figure out how to fix it.

Reply by Lee/AR on 1/1/11 10:09am
Msg #366638

The scary part is that if notaries were not completing them as requested, the forms would change to meet notaries lawful abilities.

I'm trying to figure out what that 'change' would/could be and can't.

Reply by BrendaTx on 1/1/11 8:32pm
Msg #366692

Basically, I don't think these should be completed by a notary "as a notary". I think that the person as an individual should complete them. Not sure, but I think anyone who is a notary, lawyer, or accountant can complete the forms. But, who would pay for the fee in that case? If it is a notary fee, then it caps neatly at a few dollars. If not a notary fee, it could be more.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 1/1/11 10:22am
Msg #366642

In the FL form..

Who is completing Section 2 (I think it is?) as the university rep - that's the person who should be completing this form - I'd have them complete it, add a signature line for them to sign and then notarize their signature.

If it's the notary completing the applicable portion of the I-9, then I agree - cross out the jurat, notary signs, no stamp.

Reply by BrendaTx on 1/1/11 8:37pm
Msg #366693

Re: In the FL form..

*Who is completing Section 2 (I think it is?) as the university rep - that's the person who should be completing this form - I'd have them complete it, add a signature line for them to sign and then notarize their signature.*

Linda - it is a remote notary form. The notary is the person having contact with the proposed employee...the employee is remote, the notary is remote, they get together and it's match made in Heaven. J/k.

The form is so hard for notaries to look at because it's malformed. We don't attest to much of anything (yeah, Florida attests to copies) but (except for maybe Penn.) I don't think that many notaries can just look at something and swear that they did on a certificate.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 1/1/11 9:20pm
Msg #366696

Re: In the FL form..

I know....so if I'm completing Section 2 of the I-9 then I'm required to see the original identification documents - and have probably made the photocopies. Note #2 on the Remote Hire form states "(2) I have examined the original(s) of the document(s) presented to me" - I assume that means ID docs as well.

I agree though - no jurat here - UNLESS I'm meeting with a university rep who has completed section 2 and this form - I'm just the "remote notary" (as opposed to in-house notary) who notarized the university rep's signature.

Too much thinking for a holiday!!!

Reply by JanetK_CA on 1/1/11 11:37pm
Msg #366704

Great points, Brenda

Don't you just love the government-issued forms that are impossible to complete lawfully?!

I was asked to help with an I-9 form a few years back by someone who said she had to have one signed every year for her company. She'd been through the ringer several times with this. If memory serves, I ended up notarizing (with a jurat) her signature on a separate page that was attached to her photocopies, with a statement saying that they were true and correct copies. And I think I may have signed the I-9 form, stating that I had examined her ID, but without notarizing or using the title "notary public". Your basic document custodian type deal.

I'd like to hope that this is how other notaries are getting around this, but while my experience indicates that some are doing that correctly, I think it's hoping for too much to believe this happens all the time. I'm also guessing that companies don't care how it gets done, as long as they have a notary stamp somewhere on the attached pages. If not, I agree that it would have been changed by now - but it's beyond me how they'd go about doing it.

Seems to me that the instructions are what need to change. They should probably require the company to authorize the notary (or whomever) via a written document, to act as their agent and simply sign the form on the company's behalf. (I recall that Marian had an informative post on doing this a while back.) Another potential possibility, as more and more employees work remotely from a brick and mortar office and the emphasis on proof of citizenship becomes more pervasive, is for states to add this as another function that notaries are authorized by law to do. However, this would require a change in the laws of every state.

Yeah, sure, that's gonna happen! Unless, of course, the XYZ folks see this as the latest thing to use to sell more classes on a "new" career opportunity for notaries public:

"You too can make tons of money as an Authorized Representative for corporate I-9 form completion. Sign up right away for our half-day program to teach you how..."