Posted by Ilene C. Seidel on 1/13/11 6:43pm
Msg #368551

When a company discloses payment in 60 days

I have a company (the only client) that sent me a notice I'm to send a monthly statement eom and will be paid eom of the following month, meaning I probably won't see the money til end of first week over sixty days out if there are closings completed beginning of any given month. Do any of you charge more for this service, they are using our fees for their cash flow? It's a title company not SS.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 1/13/11 7:00pm
Msg #368555

I just asked a Title company if I could send them 1 invoice at the eom for the entire month and if they would pay it by the 10th of the following month. I do a lot for them and quite frankly am tired of sending invoices with the pkg. If I forget or don't have time to get into quickbooks and do the invoice and I want to drop the pkg after the signing, the invoice doesn't get sent with the pkg. Then I don't get paid on time, which isn't their fault. It would be so much easier to bill once a month. I am waiting to hear back on if they will go for this. It would be so much better to get 1 big check a month than a lot of little ones.

Reply by Ilene C. Seidel on 1/13/11 7:47pm
Msg #368568

That's not what I asked Linda. If you do work in January are you willing to wait for payment til the 1st or 2nd week of March? And for your regular fee or would you charge more because you had to wait so long for payment. Most of my companies pay upon funding.
fyi before leaving my house I print an invoice so the pkg is mailed complete or sometimes will email it to the processor at the title company.

Reply by LKT/CA on 1/13/11 8:03pm
Msg #368570

<<<If you do work in January are you willing to wait for payment til the 1st or 2nd week of March?>>>

NO...*my* terms are net 30. If it means I get less loan signings then so be it.

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 1/13/11 8:12pm
Msg #368571

There is no good reason for a TC to hold payment after

funding. If they wanted to do that I would charge more to allow them to use my money for 45-60 days beyond the date I should be paid.

If they want a "discount" on the price, they can cut (& send) the check Net 15 like they should in the first place.

My fees are higher for companies that pay Net 45 and I have only one that I deal with that pays Net 60 which is also charged more than the companies that pay Net 45. My normal payment terms are Net 30.

Reply by Ilene C. Seidel on 1/13/11 8:15pm
Msg #368572

Re: There is no good reason for a TC to hold payment after

Thanks Moneyman that's what I'm looking for. I plan on charging more "if I do their work"

Reply by Alice/MD on 1/13/11 8:30pm
Msg #368574

Re: There is no good reason for a TC to hold payment after

The trick is to bill them at the end of each month so they can then take 30 days to pay. If you closed a loan on the 1st of the month and then they ask you to invoice them on the 30th ..then you will be waiting another 30 days to be paid. I don't like companies that do that. I will charge them more.

Reply by MW/VA on 1/13/11 8:54pm
Msg #368579

I've had a few companies try to play that game and found that it doesn't work out very well.
It's not my job to do their record-keeping for them. I have to keep track of my invoices & so should they. You're right that you end up waiting 60-75 days for payment. I charge a considerably higher fee for cos. that want that additional service & payment terms.

Reply by Ilene C. Seidel on 1/14/11 4:45am
Msg #368604

Thanks everyone, this is exactly what I was looking for. They are great to work with, it will limit how much work I do for them.

Reply by Ann ABC notary on 1/14/11 8:48am
Msg #368610

All of you are independent contractors, no need to worry about paying employees, over- head costs or anything of that nature, so not understanding the process that is involved with funding, you have to realize it's not all as simple as you all might think. Unless you work directly with a title company, you won't get paid in less than 30-60 net days. A lot of SS companies have contracts with title companies and they won't get paid as soon as a loan funds, because there are other costs involved. Until you own your own company, with employees and such, none of you will understand the systematic process involved in payment. You all can charge whatever you want, but at the end your name will speak for itself and the company will have to determine whether or not you're worth it.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 1/14/11 9:04am
Msg #368611

Ann, though I can respect what you're saying

You underestimate the business experience and knowledge of the posters here..most DO know what they're talking about - they've been there, done that...

The point has been made many times in the past...a company that is going to hire IC's should have the working capital to back them and enable them to pay their contractors once the services are rendered and not IF or WHEN they're paid. The payment agreements SS's make with their clients should not be our concern nor should it impact when we're paid when our invoices are net 30. We didn't agree with the title company to get paid once per month and/or wait 45-60 days to be paid - they did. And our fees should not be contingent upon them being paid.

MHO

Reply by Alice/MD on 1/14/11 9:36am
Msg #368613

Re: Ann, though I can respect what you're saying

I agree with you Linda, we know that a business must have a line of credit against their account receivables in order to pay employees and vendors. That is the way it is done in the real business world. No employee will work for you if they have to wait until you sell your products before they get paid.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 1/14/11 9:51am
Msg #368618

Re: Ann, though I can respect what you're saying

I agree with you Linda.

Ann, I had my own signing agency from 2003 until last year when I decided to retire.
As anyone on this forum who has worked with me will tell you, they did the signing and I sent out the check the next day. They did the signing, they earned that check.
Title usually sent my check on funding, on loans that did not fund I had to wait a lot longer to be paid, however the signing agent's check was still sent out the next day.

When one goes into the signing agency business, one must have the capital to pay their signing agents without having to wait until title pays for the signing.
This "You get paid when we get paid" is ridiculous and bad business.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 1/14/11 10:01am
Msg #368621

Re: Ann, though I can respect what you're saying

Ann, Before I got into this business my husband and I owed and operated 6 gas stations. I ran one of those. My employees got paid on the 2nd and 16th of EVERY month no matter what. We had the working capital to do this and in the rare occasion that we didn't, we used our line of credit and then paid it back immediately when the funds were available. I can bet my bottom dollar that you and your employees get their weekly, bi-weekly, however you do it, paychecks without fail.
Granted, these are tough times. I could write a book. When we close these loans, it is OUR paycheck. We should not be treated different than any other "employee" of yours. I am more than willing to wait 30 days (and I do), but any other company like a credit card company or utility company or mortgage company etc etc tack on late fees and charges if they are not paid in 30 days. We are extending credit to you. We should be tacking on late fees and and charges for anything past 30 days. You are forgetting that we are a business too, we have bills to pay just like everyone else does.

Reply by Ann ABC notary on 1/14/11 10:45am
Msg #368628

Re: Ann, though I can respect what you're saying

As much as I understand what you're saying, you are not extending credit to the SS companies, you are performing a service. That's what a credit card company is for and that's why they charge high interest rates. When you perform a service and agree to fee, you can't just arbitrarily decide to raise your fee or charge late fees, if that's the case, then you should disclose it at the time you take the assignment. You're not being treated any different than any other independent contractor. You're not an employee of the company. Anyways, you're all missing the point, it's not about capital, it's about the fact that you agree to the terms to get paid in 30-60 business and yet you are on these sites still voicing an opinion about you disagreemtns. If you can't wait that long, then you should deal directly with someone you know will agree to your terms. Anyways, this is my opinion, i don't go on these sites often, so if I don't respond again, it's only because I don't have the time to go back and forth. I understand EVERYONE has bills to pay, everyone should be glad they have any work, because by the end of this year, we'll be getting less than we did last year or that's what my sources tell me.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 1/14/11 11:00am
Msg #368631

Bull puckey

"As much as I understand what you're saying, you are not extending credit to the SS companies"

Those that wait 30-60 days to get paid are extending credit to the SS companies, otherwise they would be paid on the spot.

"so if I don't respond again, it's only because I don't have the time to go back and forth"

No, it's because there is no credible response.

Reply by Linda Juenger on 1/14/11 11:23am
Msg #368636

Re: Bull puckey Amen Sylvia n/m

Reply by Ann ABC notary on 1/14/11 11:46am
Msg #368644

Re: Bull puckey Amen Sylvia

Bull Puckey??? Really??? And you all call yourselves, business minded professionals? Everyone applauds??? You all proliferate the same ignorance day and day out! It's understandable why everyone here looks for each other for support on these ill minded websites, because no one else cares and no one else with a business sense will listen!!! Sylvia I give you credit for having so many followers. Everyone needs someone to guide them.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 1/14/11 12:04pm
Msg #368646

Re: Bull puckey Amen Sylvia

"It's understandable why everyone here looks for each other for support on these ill minded websites, because no one else cares and no one else with a business sense will listen!!!"

Hmm I guess you do have time to respond!

If this is an "ill minded" website why are bothering to be a member here.

I have a good business sense. It is very good business sense to take care of your independent contractors and pay them promptly instead of 30-60 days. Where is that bad business?.
It is good business sense to pay your independent contractors whether you get paid or not. Where is that bad business sense?

But, you seem to think it is ignorant. You just don't see that the independent contractors are extending credit to the signing services by waiting 30-60 days to get paid.

I have never had any notary hesitate about working with me, they always knew that they didn't have any concerns that they wouldn't be paid promptly.

Reply by rengel/CA on 1/14/11 1:28pm
Msg #368677

ABC Notary

My "ignorance" just got you put on my no-no list due to my "lack of business sense."

Reply by James Dawson on 1/14/11 11:39am
Msg #368641

Re: Bull puckey - Ditto n/m

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 1/15/11 8:17am
Msg #368765

Re: Bull puckey - 100% correcrt!

Anything other than immediate payment IS issuing credit. How this much learnerd "business owner" cannot see this shows just how little she really understands about business.

Reply by Les_CO on 1/14/11 10:31am
Msg #368626

Re: Ann, though I can respect what you're saying

Well said!
The overhead, expenses, and cost of doing business of a Title Company have absolutely NOTHING to do with us. They contract with us for a service, we perform that service, and we should be paid for that service. Simple.

Reply by James Dawson on 1/14/11 11:41am
Msg #368643

Like the phone co, gas, cell phones, lights, groceries, etc n/m

Reply by Barbara Taylor on 1/14/11 12:49pm
Msg #368662

Re: Ann, though I can respect what you're saying

Slyvia...

I am a work minded person and have worked for myself since I was 9 years of age and with 60 years under my belt I can truly say I have never experienced anything like this. I have been in this Industry business for well over 15 years that is quite sometime and I agree, when a person perform a service for you they should not have to wait for 15-20-30-60-90 days to get paid. You as a business who contract a person to perform a service should pay that person upon delivery of your product. So at the most that person should be paid at the most within 7 days to assure that your product was performed without error. This waiting game is unreal and cost the Signing Agents in the long run because they are putting out, travel to and from, gas, toner, paper, electricity, phone time and time with the clients and for some signing agents to be a true business person you should learn what your worth in the business consist of and how to get paid when service is rendered. All of this is unethical when it comes to paying the way it should be. This is why the economy is in the position it is in today. Because of tight fisted money holders who will pay out big money, but when it comes to paying out small money they hold onto it so tight, it forces small business out.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 1/14/11 1:12pm
Msg #368673

I think you meant Ann..not Sylvia... n/m

Reply by Barbara Taylor on 1/14/11 1:28pm
Msg #368678

Regardless of who it is Paying on Time is what it is about n/m

Reply by Les_CO on 1/14/11 3:29pm
Msg #368694

Re: Regardless of who it is Paying on Time is what it is about

We are in a ‘service industry’ there is no economy of scale, manufacturing time, shipping time, etc. In a ‘normal’ service business you pay when you receive the ‘service’.

Somehow this Notary Signing Agent business got upside down/backwards.

How it should be is that ‘someone’ contacts us about a signing. We call the borrower/seller/buyer. We say “I’ve been contacted to bring the loan/sale/real estate documents to your home/place of business/or choice for your (and your spouse) review and signature. My fee is ($150). We can do this at your convenience anytime, anywhere (depending on the documents date sensitivity). Or I can have the Title Company send you the documents directly and you can get whatever notary you want to witness your signatures, and you can then send the signed/notarized package back to the Title Company. Keep in mind these documents, and their correctness, and timely receipt will effect whether or not you get your loan, or consummate your sale/purchase. I will need you both to bring to the signing a (2) valid ID, a copy of such to sent back to Title, and my check….any questions?”

WE do the signing; the signatory pays us on the spot. If we get “referred” by a SS, we then pay them a percentage of our fee…in 30/60/90 days. We pay Title nothing, we are facilitating them earning their closing fee, escrow fee, (in some States) and their insurance premium.

How did this happen, because the Borrower usually pays all the fees out of the loan proceeds, and that funding, happens AFTER we’ve done our job. If the borrower had to pay out-of-pocket all the ‘closing costs’ we’d all be out of business.

And it gets worse every day, at one time Title put us on the HUD (as should be) and the borrower paid out of proceeds at funding. We were a great convenience to Title, and in most cases without us their business would have gone to a local TC, and our service to them was FREE!
Now many want to not only use us for free, but make a little extra on our efforts, and then KEEP our money for 90 days interest free?
Total BS!

Reply by Moneyman/TX on 1/15/11 8:11am
Msg #368764

Re: Ann ABC notary

The contracts that an SS company makes is none of my business as an independent contractor. The SS has stepped in as a middle-man in the process. Everyone is paid upon funding. If the SS company has decided to allow the TC to hold the money and pay them at a different time, that is their decision. They should not hire anyone else if they cannot pay them on time regardless of when they have decided to allow others to pay them.

Some of us have owned other businesses with both employess and IC's in which we operated as a business should, which means that we paid for services as agreed regardless of when our payments arrived. If you, or any other SS, cannot afford to pay as agreed you need to stop hiring people and making agreements with them for payment terms which you cannot achieve.

Companies that Net 15 or Net 30 (as agreed) will, in the end, be determined to be worth it themselves in the eyes of the NSA's.