Posted by Elizabeth Rinert on 8/20/12 11:46am
Msg #431120

FLORIDA QUICK CLAIM DEEDS

I live in So Cal. I did a loan signing for someone purchasing a home in Florida. I didn't know that their were two witness needed to sign with her on the quik claim deed. Is this normal? Also, now the loan company wants me to go back and get 2 witness signatures along with her.

1st problem, she is elderly I dont think she has anyone like this around.
2nd probloem, they didnt tell me nor her this is what is needed so can I charge them for my time.
Anyone ever worked with E Notary Pro before?

Thanks for your help,
Liz

Reply by Philip Johnson on 8/20/12 11:50am
Msg #431121

The word is quit, and yes bill them for the time. n/m

Reply by HisHughness on 8/20/12 11:55am
Msg #431124

About the quickest way I know of ...

... to convey the message that you are not a real professional is to use a term like "quick-claim deed." If I were a lender/TC/SS, and you used that term, I would immediately be aware that you are someone who is not schooled in the basics of what you are doing, and I would find someone who was.

Reply by reba on 8/20/12 11:58am
Msg #431125

It is the borrowers duty to get witnesses. Check with SS because in some cases you the notary can be one of the witnesses. Also check w/ SS because in some cases w/ real estate the witness cannot be a spouse or family member.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/20/12 11:59am
Msg #431126

Is this normal? Yes, two witnesses required for deeds of conveyance in Florida.

"1st problem, she is elderly I dont think she has anyone like this around."

All she needs is someone to pop in and see her sign it or hear her acknowledge that she signed it - you can be one witness, the other person the second. I've pulled people out of a pizza line (with the signers' consent) and asked them to be a witness. They don't need to know what the person is doing, they just need to see/hear her do it.

IMO when you saw it was Florida property you should have questioned title about witness requirements - However, that being said, since they did not advise you properly on how to get this done, if it were me I'd request a fee to go back simply because it is not your job to know the witness requirements of all 50 states and their counties.

JMO

Reply by Elizabeth Rinert on 8/20/12 12:04pm
Msg #431130

Re: FLORIDA QUIT CLAIM DEEDS

THANKS, NOW DO YOU KNOW CAN i CAN DELETE THIS POST?

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/20/12 12:08pm
Msg #431131

No, don't delete...this information is useful to others n/m

Reply by Elizabeth Rinert on 8/20/12 12:11pm
Msg #431132

Re: No, don't delete...this information is useful to others

thanks, but some people are rude on here becsuse I posted this. Honestly there isn't that much training for Notaries and if someone knows of more training please I am all ears. I took a loan signing class and it didnt help me at all really.

Reply by JPH13/MO on 8/20/12 12:20pm
Msg #431134

Elizabeth look for my private message about schooling...

And as far as deleting this entire posting, you can see if Harry, the owner of this site, would be willing to do that by contacting him. I'm guessing since they are saying the info will help others he may not want to, but if it is upsetting to you to keep it on here it is worth a try.

Reply by Philip Johnson on 8/20/12 12:21pm
Msg #431135

Rude? Ms. Rinert, you used the wrong term.

You worked with an elderly woman who I assume from your post gave up a claim on a piece of property she was titled to. Doesn't she deserve the diligence of a professional who at least knows the name of the document in which she was presented?

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/20/12 12:27pm
Msg #431137

I sent you a p/m...but

"if someone knows of more training please I am all ears. I took a loan signing class and it didnt help me at all really."

Then I would respectfully suggest you get better training in loan signings, including purchase and sale transactions, before you go putting yourself out to the public as a closer/signing agent. That's just fair for all parties involved - including you.

JMO

Reply by Stephanie Santiago on 8/20/12 12:27pm
Msg #431138

Elizabeth - I live in CA, took several Loan Signing classes

and read all messages on this forum and have learned so much information about being a Signing Agent.
Going on 13 successful years for me.
Stephanie

Reply by Frank/NC on 8/20/12 12:37pm
Msg #431142

Re: No, don't delete...this information is useful to others

The onus is on you to learn everything you possibly can prior to representing yourself as a professional signing agent. There is a big liability on the part of the signing agent and lack of knowledge can be costly. Go on line and also buy specific books and study items prior to accepting assignments. Every one wants to make money but it is most important to get as much information as you can. As far as this forum is concerned, most of the people who contribute to it have been around a long time. You can get tons of information if you just go back and read as many postings as you can on here.

Reply by MW/VA on 8/20/12 12:25pm
Msg #431136

I wouldn't worry about it too much, Elizabeth.

Someone was nice enough to correct you & leave it at that. It's a common mistake. These Deeds are known as Quit Claim Deeds, Grant Deeds, Gift Deeds. What they do is change how title is vested on the property.
As far as the witness requirement, you can serve as one witness & you should be able to come up with another person somewhere.
Unless you were advised in the original instructions about the requirements for witness, charge them for the 2nd trip.

Reply by Elizabeth Rinert on 8/20/12 12:31pm
Msg #431141

Re: I wouldn't worry about it too much, Elizabeth.

thank you all, I now will go and get a list of states that are witness states... live and learn,,,,

Reply by janCA on 8/20/12 12:39pm
Msg #431144

Re: I wouldn't worry about it too much, Elizabeth.

E-Notary Pro is not so PROfessional because I believe they are the ones who dropped the ball on this. I agree with Linda, we are not required to know any other state's laws, only the state we reside in. If you are a SS, and you are giving an assignment to a SA, it is YOUR responsibility to know what is required. Don't pass the buck onto the SA.

Reply by Jack/AL on 8/20/12 12:59pm
Msg #431149

No worries, Elizabeth! It will be very from days from now

that you'll notice that some other poster (probably/hopefully a newbie) has not been reading this forum and learning, and they'll ask about a QUICK claim deed. You'll feel better, then.

Reply by MW/VA on 8/20/12 12:59pm
Msg #431150

Agreed. It's their job to give us COMPLETE instructions,

including witness requirements. I've heard mixed reviews on the witness requirement for FL. It apparently only really applies to Deeds of Conveyance (sales) in some counties.
I did a signing last week for a property in Pompano Beach & got no instructions for a witness requirement.

Reply by desktopfull on 8/20/12 1:11pm
Msg #431154

Re: Agreed. It's their job to give us COMPLETE instructions,

Here's a hint, look at the mortgage or quit claim deed before going. Does it have "Witness in the presence of: " with lines underneath for witnesses to sign? If so, you need witnesses, in FL the notary can be one of the witnesses, the other must be non-related to the signer.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/20/12 1:17pm
Msg #431157

" the other must be non-related to the signer"...says who?

And why? Where is this requirement?

Reply by LKT/CA on 8/20/12 6:40pm
Msg #431217

Re: " the other must be non-related to the signer"...says who?

Linda, do you still work for an attorney? Not sure what type of law he specializes in, but ask him if he uses witnesses that are related to the signer by blood, marriage, or adoption. If he does/doesn't then why and what precedent is he following. I'd be interested in his take on the issue, (regardless of whether it's a written law). The estate planning attorney I network with does not use family members as witnesses. Brenda/TX said it best - the cleanest transactions are those where witnesses are not related.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/20/12 6:52pm
Msg #431220

Yes it's better if not related...but not a necessary

requirement. And IMO it depends on the nature of the document being signed...

BTW - he does commercial litigation.. (ugh)

Reply by desktopfull on 8/20/12 10:06pm
Msg #431256

Re: " the other must be non-related to the signer"...says who?

For the same reason you don't notarize documents for family members, potential for conflict of interest. Plus every one of my instructions from TC's state witness can not be a family member or related to borrowers in any way. I've also been told by attorneys not to use family members as witnesses on health directives, wills and other documents that I have notarized.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/20/12 1:15pm
Msg #431156

Not quite true Marilynn..

" I've heard mixed reviews on the witness requirement for FL. It apparently only really applies to Deeds of Conveyance (sales) in some counties."

Not quite.

In all of Florida, all deeds of conveyance require two witnesses - that would be all Quit Claim Deeds, Administrator's/Executor's Deeds, Warranty Deeds, etc etc (not just sales) - any deed that conveys title to real property. (even if the conveyance is only to change a name)

Mortgages are the ones that vary. Pursuant to Florida law, mortgages do not require witnesses (as they are not considered deeds of conveyance). However, some individual counties have enacted ordinances that require witnesses on mortgages that will record in their counties. Those Counties are, to my knowledge, Dixie and Suwannee counties; I believe there's one more but it escapes me right now. So, the discrepancy is in the fact that although Florida law does not require witnesses on mortgages, certain counties do require them. And that's why each closing has to be treated independently. I, for one, now get witnesses across the board....forewarned is forearmed. Having witnesses where none is required - on mortgages - will not result in it's being rejected for recording; however, lack of witnesses will do just that.

Hope this helps.

Reply by MW/VA on 8/20/12 1:21pm
Msg #431159

Thanks, Linda. :-) n/m

Reply by Stoli on 8/20/12 1:04pm
Msg #431152

Take the free course offered under Notary Public 101 tab. n/m