Posted by Robert Williams on 7/26/12 5:59pm
Msg #428183

Question about an affadavit...

Did an affadavit the other day for an out of state company, not a closing, just a single doc.

The Aff was for a NC law firm and the notary section did not include a venue, so I wrote it in.

The firm called and said they need it re-done, as sent, without any corrections, it had the venue at the top saying it was to be filed in so-and-so county, North Carolina at the top of the document. The bottom simply says "Sworn in my presence this day, and a signature line...

They don't want me to put the execution venue on it at all, which, to me, makes it read as though it were executed there.... since I'm thinking this is incorrect and their lawyer says it's fine I wanted to get some feedback from others.

Any thoughts?

Reply by Jessica Ward on 7/26/12 6:14pm
Msg #428185

Check your state rules

Here in WA, I have to have a venue, so I would have added the venue above my notary section, or added a loose certificate. But there's no way I'd sign under their venue. The venue is where the signer's feet are.

Reply by Roger_OH on 7/26/12 6:53pm
Msg #428189

Re: Question about an affidavit...

You were correct, Robert.

You're in Ohio, you follow OUR notary rules, not whatever they do in NC. Ohio subscribes to the Uniform Act on Acknowledgements, which includes venues.

The state/county venue is an essential part of the notary certificate, since it determines where the document signature was notarized, and thus the court that has jurisdiction should it be challenged.

The notary certificate is always YOUR sole domain, and YOUR sole responsibility for its content; no one can dictate to you what goes in it but you.

I would refuse to sign an incomplete notary certificate.

Reply by Robert Williams on 7/26/12 8:29pm
Msg #428203

Re: Question about an affidavit...

I tried to explain it that way to the lawyer, but he kept insisting so I told him I'd check and call back tomorrow... hopefully he grows a brain cell before I have to talk to him again...

Thanks for the feedback gang.

Reply by HisHughness on 7/26/12 7:07pm
Msg #428192

If I understand correctly, you unfortunately did indeed execute the affidavit incorrectly. I gather you did not change the venue at the top of the affidavit, so it had TWO venues. That obviously is incorrect. I would have changed the venue attached to the body of the affidavit to reflect the venue of notarization, and not added one to the certificate.

Reply by bagger on 7/26/12 7:16pm
Msg #428193

I think Robert was correct

The Aff was for a NC law firm and the notary section did not include a venue, so I wrote it in.

Sounds to me like he changed the venue

Reply by Robert Williams on 7/26/12 8:25pm
Msg #428201

I checked before I wrote it in and the venue is separate for the top of the form (prepared for and filed in..." and the notary section.

I simply inserted the venue where it was executed above the "Sworn before me..." language, leaving the top entry intact. The aff WAS prepared in North Carolina and to be filed in that venue, it's the affiant's signature affirming the facts that required an execution venue. I put it where I normally see it in non-mortgage affadavits. I just hadn't seen one where it didn't have the venue in both spots...

Reply by HisHughness on 7/26/12 8:37pm
Msg #428206

My understanding of the venue statement is that, wherever in the affidavit it is, it is the venue of execution. What happens, for example, if that affidavit winds up not being filed in North Carolina, but in Alaska?

I don't know that this question has ever been addressed on NotRot, but my practice has always been to consider the venue statement, wherever it is placed in the affidavit, as establishing the venue of execution.

This will come as one enormous surprise to him, I suspect, but my guess is that the closest you're going to get to a definitive answer is from my favorite notary public instructor, Robert. That is the sort of question that turns him on like a septugenarian lawyer at a sorority party. If Robert doesn't know the answer, he'll give you one anyway, and quite emphatically.

Reply by HisHughness on 7/26/12 8:41pm
Msg #428207

Should have included this in the earlier posting

What function do you believe the venue statement preceding the body of the affidavit serves? What is it supposed to be the venue for?

Reply by Robert Williams on 7/26/12 9:04pm
Msg #428211

Re: Should have included this in the earlier posting

It indicated that it was prepared for and to be filed in a particular county court....

I think it simply shows that the affadavit was prepared in one place, whereas by adding the venue in the notary section I document where it was actually executed.... my local courthouse has forms formatted this way.

I thought this was the best middle ground to take, since the affiant gave the info over the phone, the lawyer there typed it up and sent it here for execution....

this is why I ask, Hugh, even my wife says I don't know it all

Reply by Lee/AR on 7/26/12 7:35pm
Msg #428196

Lawyers are lawyers. Many don't understand notary regs.

Check your handbook and see if you can find your state's rules/code/statute to back up what you did and send 'em a link to show that what you did was correct. They won't appreciate it, but they will get off your back.

Reply by Robert Williams on 7/26/12 9:06pm
Msg #428213

Re: Lawyers are lawyers. Many don't understand notary regs.

Getting awfully tired of having to correct the overpaid lawyers on this stuff, and you should here some of the arguments I get...

Reply by Jodith/WA on 7/30/12 8:37pm
Msg #428711

Re: Lawyers are lawyers. Many don't understand notary regs.

I had one lawyer stand me down that it was okay to notarize his client's paperwork even though the name did not match his ID. Client's given name was Baltinder, but he went by Bobby. All the documents said Bobby, and all the IDs said Baltinder. The lawyer told me that as long as he added Baltinder to the AKA statement, it was okay. He absolutely refused to believe that I couldn't notarize as Bobby without an ID showing that name *rolls eyes*.

Reply by enotary/va on 7/26/12 8:28pm
Msg #428202

I would have added at the bottom.. ( Acting in county of xxxxxxxx , state of xxxxxxxx.
And I would have not changed the top part... I would make sure my part was right... In Va. you have to have the venue.... I think Robert did the right thing....

Reply by Robert Williams on 7/26/12 9:05pm
Msg #428212

Just what I did, sorry I wasn't more clear in my earlier post, been a long day here in Ohio

Reply by LKT/CA on 7/26/12 9:17pm
Msg #428214

<<<.....the notary section did not include a venue, ***so I wrote it in.***>>>

If Ohio notary law requires a venue, then by all means, follow that. However, the real problem could be that you hand wrote the venue instead of either using a jurat stamp or a loose leaf jurat. It may LOOK sloppy and tacky on the nice typewritten form.

Reply by Robert Williams on 7/26/12 9:21pm
Msg #428215

I don't think that was the problem... but I don't carry a venue stamp, so the only options are:
a. re-type the form
b. hand write it

Reply by MW/VA on 7/26/12 9:55pm
Msg #428217

I change venues all the time, and handwrite them in.

Unlike CA, we don't generally attach loose acks as SOP.
I don't know how the Affidavit was written. If it said, for instance, State of NC, County of Dare, John Doe appeared before me an was duly sworn and said (blah, blah, blah).
His signature
Notarial statement (including venue).
Then I would have changed the venue in both places. He was appearing before me in a certain place, making the statements in a certain place, and notarized in that place.
From what I read of your dilemna you did the right thing.

Reply by LKT/CA on 7/26/12 10:59pm
Msg #428221

Re: I change venues all the time, and handwrite them in.

I didn't say anything was wrong with handwriting the venue.....just that maybe THAT attorney didn't like the way that looked on HIS particular affidavit.

Reply by CarolF/NC on 9/8/12 8:09pm
Msg #433691

Found this post while searching my problem. Odd thing is I'm in NC and we require county and state venue, but I'm dealing with a bank on a project here and they want their form which does not have it and do not want their form altered. Ahhh, maybe the same attorney drew up their affidavit