Posted by Anonymous on 9/29/03 8:55pm
Msg #102

UP YOUR PRICES IN PA

I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY THESE SIGNING COMPANIES WANT TO PAY
ONLY $50.00 FOR ME TO CLOSE A MORTGAGE DEAL. I AM VERY EXPERIENCED, TALK TO THE BORROWER, EXPLAIN THE DOCUMENTS, HUD SHEET, TIL, RR ... ETC. I AM THE ONLY PERSON THEY GET TO SEE AFTER, MOST OF THE TIME, BEING PUT THROUGH HELL TO GET A NEW MORTGAGE!!!!
IF YOU ARE A CLOSING AGENT, PLEASE RAISE YOUR PRICES, DONT CUT YOURSELF SHORT, YOU WILL JUST WARE YOURSELF OUT AND RUN OUT OF GAS!
I UNDERSTAND CLOSING COMPANIES HAVE OVERHEAD, BUT SO DO YOU AND I !

Reply by Anonymous on 10/7/03 7:09pm
Msg #116

You've got a point!

Reply by anonymous on 1/5/05 5:54pm
Msg #15546

Anonymous:

I am not sure how long you have been doing signings for, however; you mention a price that you are offered, but as the owner of a signing agency, I offer $50 for a HELOC within so many miles, and $60 for a Refi within so many miles. That does not include a standard fee of $25 additional for email docs. The the agent, and the agency assigning this work, all have overhead involved. The borrower is the person as far as I am concerned, that we need to keep happy, as well, of course, the title company that the work is being scheduled through. I pay the agents that I sub contract, the national average fees provided to me through the NNA. Of course, the title companies can pay you more, but the majority of signing agencies are not making an arm and a leg off closings. The majority of the signing agencies keep their prices somewhat lower in order to recieve volume. Most of the agents that whose services that we utilize, get more than our agency gets.

I quess that in this competitive day and age, most of the agents that I work with, more often the experienced ones than the newbies, want the national average prices. I do not know of many people who can make $50 for an hours work, which is what a HELOC basically, even with driving time, usually takes.

I have to say, I love this site. People are so helpful and ready to give information to the newbees, and I think thats wonderful. The best thing that I can say to any of the signing agents out there, is that most companies are not out to rip you off, and if you are getting the national average, is that not fair? I always tell the signing agents that I work with that if not for them, we wouldn't be in business, and the work that the agents do is very, very much appreciated. Please understand also, that many times, as in any profession, you have to prove your worth. I have only been in business a little over a year, but for the agents who do quality work with us, I have been able to pay them a little more after they have proven to me that they do quality work and I will not have to send them out to get missing signatures or other correct other errors. Please keep that in mind also!!

Reply by HisHughness on 1/5/05 6:49pm
Msg #15551

Anonymous claims:

***I do not know of many people who can make $50 for an hours work, which is what a HELOC basically, even with driving time, usually takes.

I'm not going to respond to the question of whether $50 represents adequate compensation for a typical signing. But the allegation above that even with driving time a typical HELOC takes only an hour is poppycock. This is what is involved:

1. Initial discussion and acceptance of assignment via phone/e-mail
2. Review order upon arrival
3. Insert into computer calendar, traveling calendar
4. Assign a file number in computer tracking program
5. Create file
6. Fill out order information form for file
7. Create map with computer program, place in file
8. Call borrower to confirm appointment, give instructions on ID
9. Go to appointment, execute documents
10. Prepare fax to closing/title company confirming closing and providing invoice; send fax
11. Write letter to title company detailing any problems with the closing, soliciting future business
12. Prepare overnight courier package if one is not provided; get overnight package to courier
13. Fill out order information form in file with tracking number, start/finish time of closing, etc.
14. Note closing completion in tracking program, change from pending order to account receivable
15. File file
16. Record check in when received
17. Deposit check

Of course, this is for a closing in which everything goes smoothly without a single hitch. That may be one closing out of five. You may be stuck with a closing that cancels, in which case the effort put into steps 1-8 are wasted, uncompensated effort. Or, you may have to place several calls to the borrower before you finally get him. You may find that your computer map program does not recognize his address. You may get lost going to or coming from the closing. Your printer may run out of ink or paper, and you discover that despite your best planning, you have neither on hand. Your computer may crash, adding another glitch, and so on, ad infinitum.
But wait, there’s more!
The above outline does not include the time spent trying to collect a belated or unpaid fee, the time spent occasionally correcting an oversight, etc.
In short, anyone who claims that a signing fee of $50 translates into an earned $50 an hour either has never run a business, or is blowing smoke up somebody's unmentionable bodily orifice.

Reply by sue on 1/5/05 7:01pm
Msg #15554

the very reason I would tell you to pound sand if you dared

to call this PA agent. We don't make $50 an hour just because it takes us an hour to close the loan. if you think we do you have no idea what a fulltime signing agent does. My BUSINESS might make $50for that hour but that business has expenses too - big ones are health insurance, taxes, higher car insurance, higher homeowners insurance, life insurance, disability insurance, 4 phone lines (2 cells, 1 business, 1 fax), etc. What about gas and wear & tear on my vehicle? I must get a new vehicle every 2 years due the mileage I put on - 3000 to 4000 a month. I pay high maintenance costs - oil change every month, tire rotation, new tires, things others only pay for every year or so. I've got office supplies - granted they don't cost an arm & a leg but they add up, including having up to date computer/high speed printer/monthly dsl, etc. I could go on and on. Oh wait, I don't get paid for sick days, holidays or vacation so those are factored in. Then, there is the time spent wearing the hats of Marketing VP, Receivables VP, Payables VP, etc. None of the time spent doing office work to run a business is compensated. Oh, it's January, time to visit the CPA and my annual visit with my lawyer (both of whom charge me). So, if you think we make $50 an hour, I'd just as soon you stay out of the state of PA entirely 'cause you don't know what you're talking about.

To the first poster, I charge some of the highest fees around and I get them continuously - some of us understand what it truly costs to run a business.

Reply by PAW Notary Services on 1/5/05 10:31pm
Msg #15564

I usually do not respond to "anonymous" posters, but I'll make an exception here. You unskillfully stated, "I pay the agents that I sub contract, the national average fees provided to me through the NNA."

First, the NNA does NOT set prices. If they did, they would have a law suit on them so fast their head would swim.

Second, they "suggest" (and I use the term loosely) fees that are ludicrous. It is not a "national average", it is what someone in the NNA decided would be a good fee. They didn't ask, they just went ahead, in their infinite wisdom, and published their misinformation as is their typical style. I don't think anyone person or organization has actually derived a "national average fee". If they had, I would bet it would be above the NNA suggestion.

Others have addressed the "$50 per hour" figure that you throw around so loosely. Did you learn that from the NNA too? Just for the record, my "average" driving time for all the signings I did in 2004 was 42 minutes, each way! Add to that at least 30 minutes per signing, even for HELOCs, to complete the notarizations at the table, complete AIV docs and the journal. Add to that the time it takes in pre-signing and post-signing activities.

Oh, never mind, you just don't get it.

Reply by HisHughness on 1/5/05 10:47pm
Msg #15566

What Paul and I are trying to say, Anonymous, and saying it with our IDs attached, is, "We've upped our prices. Up yours!"

Reply by anonymous on 1/5/05 11:22pm
Msg #15569

I guess I feel that you just don't get it either!!! I won't take that personally because at least I wasn't being rude!!! I get it quite well actually. When all is said and done, after all of your costs, we still are able to average a net pay of about $25 per hour. Obviously, we have to provide our own insurance and car maintenance, which is par for the course, and a basic sop for anyones general expenses. The point is, though, that we are our own boss, which is why many of us got into this field. I love what I do, and I've been very fortunate to have gotten signed up with good companies from the start. When I first started out, I didn't get paid a full fee for one of my signings due to an error on my part, and it did state in the paperwork, that I would have fees deducted if all instructions were not followed! Let me tell you that that has not happened again! My point is that we still make decent money, and for those of us who get into this profession, it is something that we enjoy doing. Everyone will always have expenses in every day that they are in this world. Theres nothing wrong with making a buck, and I for one, definetely know how valuable time is, but I also know that for at least one of the signing agencies that I work for, they split the difference that they get paid down the middle, and work for a lesser fee to obtain volume, and when they obtain volume, I get all that they can give me in my area and that works just fine for me!

Reply by Anonymous on 11/4/05 9:16pm
Msg #74481

Re: explaining the docs...

Your not allowed to explain the docs unless you are a licensed Mortgage Broker/Attorney