Posted by Tom on 12/24/04 7:19pm
Msg #14500

Have Some Compassion

I am taking this opportunity to talk about something that has been bothering me. Often I a new and inexperienced notary will post a valid question hoping that some of you with years of experience will provide some guidance. Too many times the responses chastise and condemn the person for not having experience and fail to provide any useful answer. I thought one of the purposes of this and other boards was so notaries of varying levels of experience could help each other.
Each of you should think back to when you were just getting started and some of the questions you probably had to ask. Hopefully you were fortunate enough to have a mentor who could guide you at those times.
I have only been a notary for a year. Unfortunately I live in a state that has no provision for training its notaries. You want to be a notary? Find several people that will attest that to the best of their knowledge you aren't an axe murderer, send a check for $60 and magically you are a notary. When I went on my first loan signing I didn't have a clue what I was doing. Fortunately for me someone had neatly tabbed the document package with stickies that said "Sign Here", "Initial Here", Sign and Date Here", "Notarize Here". Since then I have put quite a few signings and other notarial work under my belt but each time I am confronted with something new I have to try and find out what to do on my own. If I discover it before I go to the signing I go through some of the books I have or do online research. If I hit it when I am with the borrowers I don’t hesitate to call the lender, title company, or signing service.
I consider myself to be a reasonably intelligent person. I have an MBA and spent 30 years negotiating and managing multimillion dollar Government contracts so I understand how critical it is that any contractual document be correct. However, learning the notary business has been frustrating because I could not get the kind of formal training that was available to me when I was a new contract negotiator. When I stumbled upon this and some other boards I made it a point to regularly read the questions and answers that were posted so that I could learn.
If you have made it this far in my rambling dissertation I would ask that instead of condemning a question you provide an answer that will help the person who posted it. If all you can do is post a derogatory comment please just keep it to yourself as it helps no one. As one of my first bosses said to me, the only dumb question is the one that didn't get asked.
I hope each of you has a blessed Christmas and a peaceful and profitable new year.

Reply by Susie/OH on 12/24/04 9:03pm
Msg #14505

Merry Christmas Tom

Nice letter. We all were beginners. I personally have had excellent response to my questions. But, I have seen negative answers. I just hope the seasoned notaries were having a bad day. If it wasn't for the novice then this forum would not be near as interesting. If it wasn't for the oldbie's it wouldn't be interesting. You post a question to get it answered quick. Which in many cases it receives several replies. Besides asking questions we read hoping to be able to answer a question or two. Keep reading the newbie questions, and then before long we all will be oldbies. MERRY CHRISTMAS to all. And, have a very Happy New Year.

Reply by CaliNotary on 12/24/04 9:03pm
Msg #14506

This seems to come up again and again. I'm just copying and pasting a portion of my reply from the last time I addressed a similar question.

******************************************************

And there is a reason I have such tactless moments. It's not just to be a jerk, it's to provide emphasis for something that I consider to be a huge mistake or a huge problem. If somebody is accepting $25 for a signing, like I thought you were doing, they need to be told in no uncertain terms that they're doing something VERY wrong. If somebody is accepting signings without knowing how to complete an acknowledement, they need to be told in no uncertain terms that they're doing something VERY wrong. If somebody asks how to set their fee schedule I suggest that they use $1.25/mile and search the board for the previous threads that have discussed this. See the difference?

I don't know that too many people have noticed the distinction (although BrendaTX has, bless her Aggie heart) but when you see me being that "tactless" it's because I think it's a vital point that must be made. People may think I'm a jerk when I post that kind of stuff, but the point definitely stands out. And it's obviously standing out based on the number of replies I get from people who are annoyed or appalled by the way I say it. Shock tactics are a proven attention getter.

Reply by Lawrence Goodwin on 12/25/04 8:45am
Msg #14509

I agree with what CaliNotary states. Only once have I blasted someone on this board for the content of their post. If every Brand New Notary followed the advice that Hugh Nations posts for the Newbies (okey I'll get blasted for that word) then the folks on this board & others would not respond in a tactless manner. A simple search can revel a world of answers.
I have been on this board for over a year and I am not new to this industry, but I will come across a question & answer that makes me alert to a situation that I could run into and how to handle it. "Now..." to the $25 - $30 jerk in my area, If you read this board, you know who you are. You are undermining this profession. Two SS's that used to be regulars have stopped calling me for assignments, when I inquired as to why, they said they found a notary in my area that does them for $25 to $30. Thanks bud your a real ........

Reply by Ali-IL on 12/25/04 2:33pm
Msg #14514

Shock tactics are not an attention getter. You are just a person that is unhappy and likes to spread it.

In the beginning I posted a question about something that I was confused about. Your answer caused me tears. But, you know what? I certainly won't answer anyone else like that.

The Bible says:Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

Reply by CaliNotary on 12/25/04 11:48pm
Msg #14524

Are you talking about this thread? It's the only one I could find where I responded to you:

http://www.notaryrotary.com/forums/forumsbody.asp?id=BG677F6V&forumid=1AAA00000003&messageid=1AAA00026802&action=view&rid=&replytonbr=&replytoid=&subject=&format=flat

I'm assuming you used a different name when you started posting here because I can't imagine that bringing anybody to tears.

If you want to make ridiculous assumptions about my emotional state because of my responses in this group, feel free. You won't be right, but I'm not terribly concerned about your opinion of me so think what you want.

PS - What the bible says is meaningless to me. I'm an atheist.

Reply by Roger/OH on 12/25/04 2:41pm
Msg #14515

Tom, see my comments for new folks on the GMN board...

Reply by JanetK/CA on 12/25/04 7:40pm
Msg #14522

Excellent comments, well worth reading!!

I strongly recommend any new person go there to read Roger's thoughtful input. FYI, the GMN board is at: http://members.boardhost.com/gomobilenotary.

I posted some additional comments there, too.

Reply by Joan Bergstrom on 12/26/04 12:38am
Msg #14525

Re: Excellent comments, well worth reading!!

I agree with Brenda's post!.
Also if you are doing signings in Calif. for $25-$30 you won't be in business very long! We have (So. Calif.)among the very highest gas prices in the nation combined with $500,000 "fixer up homes." The traffic is terrible (91 Freeway Riverside to Orange County).

However, the weather was in the low 70's on Christmas day and that's the reason we all live here!!
Happy Holidays!!

Reply by BrendaTX on 12/25/04 9:17pm
Msg #14523

Tom,

Your insightful post is well received. Your experience and ability to realize the importance of doing your homework has probably given you the right questions to ask. Due to your own motivation to research and find out about the business, you are on your way!

I had zero other contacts in Texas when I very first started at the first of this year. I read this board through several times before posting. When I started posting, I asked some pretty lame questions about documents .(NOT about jurats and acknowledgments, however.) I got some pretty sharp replies, but I prevailed. If I had let sharp replies end my signing agent status, that would be all the more BETTER for the industry IMHO.

I caught on quick that if notaries think that their notary stamp gives them the knowledge to get started as an NSA, our gigs as NSAs is going to dry up. Sometimes, notaries don't do their homework and come here after a course from an organization believing that they have all the answers. I believe Roger/OH said it well on his GMN post "They come with a sense of ENTITLEMENT." They post with questions indicating they have not searched, or read this forum. (IMHO Indicating lazy--not willing to dig for the right questions to *ask,* much less the answer.)

Rather than reading their notary educational materials provided by their state, or searching the 'net for documents to look at, or reading what www.hud.gov has to say on the subject of loans (Just to name one of the many thousands of sites offering information on the loan process.) they ask questions which scare the rest of us for our positions in the industry as a whole.

Enough sloppy work due to lack of determination to get facts and answers will boot us right out into the cold. That's why some of the regular posters get so disturbed and may sound really put off in their delivery of answers.

So, there is a flip side to this as well. Just some of my thoughts.

----To address the situation of being "zinged" on a forum-----
In general, IMHO, for the notaries who are zinged on occasion - the best way to receive a reply you feel is unfair is to (1) Ignore it, or (2) Say "Thanks." (3) Or, if you have to respond, give yourself a cooling off period before replying so that you can reply comprehensively.

What you may find out is that the way you felt about it will not amount to a hill of beans in your overall success; and, you might have learn something from it, AND the calls will keep coming in.

From it, you can also learn to turn down your sensitivity level, look back on the situation and laugh. Perhaps I know this because I have been there, done that, and I am wearing a T-Shirt from the event this very moment! Learn from my mistakes. It's just not that important!

If you are hurt beyond getting over it on this forum, how long will you prevail in a business of your own? How easily will you cave into being bullied into doing something you should not by a hiring entity?

------and-----
When asked about her feelings on the subject of jeering remarks and naysayers, a wise woman named Dolly Parton agreed she was publicly mocked and ridiculed because of her shape, her wigs and her outlandish outfits on the Grand Ol' Opry. Her method of handling this kind of negative publicity and disrespect according to her: "I just laugh, and go on... all the way to the bank."

Lesson to be learned: Set your goals and remain focused. Sticks and stones... and, all that jazz.

------------------

IMHO, the heat on the forums is nothing compared to the heat in the field. This is true for dealing with borrowers and when dealing with those who hire us. This forum is a good place to find out if you can take the heat of being self-employed in any business. This is by far a kinder forum than many I have read (on any topic).
------------------

By this time next week, no one will even remember this was posted. Though I don't like it, I do my best to consider it a privilege to field negative feedback--It's helped me to grow and to be tougher for the field. It's taught me perseverance. (For those who are interested 'James 1' could be applicable.)

Reply by BrendaTX on 12/26/04 10:04am
Msg #14527

"Reader's Digest" Version

(1) If I had let sharp forum replies end my signing agent status, that would be all the more BETTER for the industry IMHO. IMHO Good riddance for the rest of notaries in the industry if I could not hang tough against mere words.

(2) I believe Roger/OH said it well on his GMN post "They come with a sense of ENTITLEMENT." They post with questions indicating they have not searched, or read this forum. (IMHO Indicating lazy--not willing to dig for the right questions to *ask,* much less the answer.)

(3) Sloppy notary work nationwide = end of signing agent business.
So, there is a flip side to this as well. Just some of my thoughts.

(4) If notaries are hurt beyond getting over it on this forum, how long will they prevail in a business of their own? How easily will you cave into being bullied into doing something you should not by a hiring entity?

(5) Dolly Parton laughed all the way to the bank no matter what anyone said to her. Lesson to be learned: Set your goals and remain focused. Sticks and stones... and, all that jazz.

(6) The heat on the forums is nothing compared to the heat in the field.

(7) By this time next week, no one will even remember this was posted. Hot replies in forum feedback has helped me to grow and to be tougher for the field. It's taught me perseverance. (For those who are interested 'James 1' could be applicable.)

Reply by JanetK/CA on 12/26/04 3:12pm
Msg #14534

Re: "Reader's Digest" Version

Oh, I certainly hope these comments - yours and Rogers - are remembered for more than one week!! They deserve reposting from time to time.... (After all, newly minted "NSAs" are coming out of classrooms all over the place on a regular basis...)

Reply by CarolynCO on 12/26/04 11:17am
Msg #14528

Roger's comments are great. They should be printed and laminated.

As for an inexperienced notary asking "valid" questions -- many times over, IF the time had been taken to read previous threads/posts, generally the answer to the question will be there. As Brenda pointed out, for an inexperienced notary/signing agent to not do the leg work first, and simply ask a question, is a sign of laziness. The replies that chastise and condemn are because the poster chose to take the easy way out and not to do their own research.

Yes, Tom you are right. We were all beginners at one point, but, I for one, chose to be a sponge and to absorb as much as I could on my own before I began posting.

**If I discover it before I go to the signing I go through some of the books I have or do online research. If I hit it when I am with the borrowers I don't hesitage to call the lender, title company, or signing service.**

BINGO! Why isn't the inexperienced notary/signing agent taking your lead and doing online research on their own before posing their questions?? At times, some of the questions posted are SS and/or lender/title service specific and the notary/signing agent *should* be calling the SS and/or lender/title service to get the answers.

**When I stumbled upon this and some other boards I made it a point to regularly read the questions and answers that were posted so that I could learn.**

BINGO TWO!! That is exactly why Hugh and Cali repeatedly post instructions to begin reading threads/messages from the very beginning before asking questions. And for the ones that don't or refuse to read past threads -- those are the ones that we have no compassion for.

Reply by HisHughness on 12/26/04 12:30pm
Msg #14529

CarolynCo explains:

***for the ones that don't or refuse to read past threads -- those are the ones that we have no compassion for.***

Actually, I don't have any compassion for anybody because I'm just a mean and sorry SOB.

Reply by BrendaTX on 12/26/04 1:44pm
Msg #14532


HUGH STATES ABOVE:

>>QUOTING: CarolynCo explains:

***for the ones that don't or refuse to read past threads -- those are the ones that we have no compassion for.***<<<

>>HUGH ANSWERS: Actually, I don't have any compassion for anybody because I'm just a mean and sorry SOB.
---------------------------

Now that we have that out of the way, somehow, I feel cleansed.

Group therapy works again.

Reply by Susan on 12/26/04 1:05pm
Msg #14530

Excellent comments! Thank you Tom.