Posted by Newbee in CA on 6/20/04 9:27pm
Msg #3250

Invoicing

I was wondering what kind of payment terms I should have with signing companies and direct customers. Any advice is appreciated.

Reply by Liz/MD on 6/20/04 10:29pm
Msg #3253

Signing Companies, except for last minute e-docs, usually pay me between 75-125. I won't except anything below 75.00 and then I will ask if it is a heloc or a refi.
I will do a heloc for 75.00 if it is e-docs than 125.00. Refi's take longer so 100/150.
As for direct customers I am assuming you mean what happened to me about a month ago: I was on my way to signing and a man called me and asked if I could notarize his loan papers. I was kind of thrown off after realizing this was an individual and not a signing or title co. I asked him how he got my name and he said he found on the notary rotary. Because he had the paperwork and would be responsible for returning it and there was no faxing anything back I charge him 50.00. The signing lasted like 10 minutes and they were nice people. We met at a diner.

I live for the last week of the month when Title Companies call me between 8-10 and will beg me to do a e-doc closing for that evening. Usually they make me an offer I can't refuse and I rarely have to negotiate.
Be ready and willing to get up and out of bed when they call.
Hope this helps.

Reply by Roger/OH on 6/20/04 10:59pm
Msg #3254

Re: Liz - correct fees?

Liz, it would seem to me that since this man contacted you himself and there was no contracted ss involved or duty as a courier for you, that this signing would fall under the category of general notary services and be subject to your normal state notary fee requirements for each stamp and allowable travel fee, rather than what you'd charge an ss. If there were 5 stamps (@$2 each) and you traveled 10 miles each way ($5 + .31/mile in MD), the total charge would be more like $21.

Otherwise, where does the line get drawn?

Reply by Liz/MD on 6/20/04 11:18pm
Msg #3255

Re: Liz - correct fees?

I am not sure what you mean.
I traveled a total of over 80+ miles, between 2 signings, to help these people. Are you implying I did something illegal or improper?

Reply by Roger/OH on 6/21/04 12:44am
Msg #3256

Re: Liz - correct fees?

When you accept a signing assignment from a ss or title company, it is as an independent contractor, at a negotiated rate (paid by the borrower's closing costs as noted on their HUD) that you have agreed upon with them to cover the signing and all the details (faxes, FedEx, etc) that go with it.

When you're dealing with the general public, however, you are not functioning as an independent contractor thru an ss, but strictly as a notary public providing a service the person has requested. Given that, you'd be restricted to charging the applicable fees allowed by your state.
In this case, and again assuming five stamps (@$2) and 80 miles ([e-mail address] + $5 in MD = $29.80), the appropriate fee would have been about $40. My point is that in the view of the state, loan papers are no different than any other documents that you might be asked to notarize from the public, and you cannot automatically charge the public the same as you would an ss. Check with your SOS, but I think they will say you overcharged this person.
No offense intended to you; I only call this to your attention because overcharging is grounds for losing a notary commission. I have seen this issue arise before, especially with lenders such as Wells Fargo who tell the borrowers to find their own notary.

Reply by sue on 6/21/04 6:30am
Msg #3258

Re: Liz - correct fees?

Roger, in my state, PA, we can charge anything we want for travel, as long as it's disclosed and agreed to up front. I too wouldn't do one of these for less than $50 plus my $2.00 notary fee per doc (soon to be $5.00 hopefully) and they would have to have the pages to be notarized ready and on top. I wouldn't touch anything else in the package. Naturally, I have no idea what Maryland allows their notaries as travel fee. I haven't done one of these WellsFargos yet because all my calls come at month end and I am too busy with my regular customers to meet with 'regular people'.

Reply by Roger/OH on 6/21/04 7:59am
Msg #3261

Re: Liz - correct fees?

My comments were based upon the notary and travel fees for Liz's state of MD as noted in the May '04 edition of the NNA magazine (I know, probably not the best info, but it was all I had handy). In the case I was discussing with her, MD indeed limits her travel fees, according to the NNA graphic.

My concern for her was, that if the person for some reason complained to the MD SOS, she might have a difficult time explaining why she charged him a flat $50, when about $40 would have been more in line with the 80-mile trip she made at MD travel rates ($5 plus .31/mile) Again noting the point that her execution of the borrower docs was not an ss assignment with a set independent contractor fee; she was not acting as an IC/signing agent in this situation, but only as a notary, and these docs would be considered just routine notary work by her state since she was serving a member of the public at their request, consequently subject to the MD per stamp fee of $2.

Reply by Liz/MD on 6/21/04 9:24am
Msg #3263

Re: Liz - correct fees?

Thanks for all the insight.

Reply by Dennis D Broadbooks on 6/21/04 7:34am
Msg #3260

"Semantics" Can Come Into Play...

When the issue of "travel fees" was addressed in a bill passed in this past session of our Missouri legislature, it made reference to limiting the amount a Missouri Notary could charge to the IRS standard mileage rate (36 cents in 2003, down from 36.5 in 2002). I queried our state's Notary commission officer on this subject extensively & gave her the example of what if I traveled 100 miles to Jefferson City for a simple notarization. Based on the mileage rate, combined with our limit of $2.00 per signature; the most I'd be able to charge under those conditions would be a measly $38.00. Her reply was that the "travel fee" ONLY applied to our actual automobile expenses incurred. She said we could then add in to the overall fee whatever we agreed with the signer for our time spent getting to & from the location. In other words all all we need to do here in MO to satisfy the spirit of the law is break the charges down into separate categories for invoicing purposes. Needless to say the foregoing is limited to how our Missouri Notary Division is advising us to proceed & shouldn't be applied to any other state. It might be worthwhile for Notaries in other states to give their Secretary of State's office (or whatever branch governs Notaries) a call for clarification.