Posted by Robert Young on 3/15/04 7:12pm
Msg #1161

Massachusetts Signings

Anything new on this subject? I get all the NNA info which points to a negative for those of us who are not a member of the bar. I am getting conflicting stories. Not sure if non-lawyer notaries are eligible to conduct real estate signings or not after 4/16.

Reply by Tom_in_MA on 3/15/04 9:49pm
Msg #1162

Robert, I'm in the same boat. Went to an NNA seminar in Worcester and they said not a member of the bar, can't do signings. Talked with a couple of other notaries and they said the E.O. didn't change any existing law and that a 1991 law esentially said non-lawyer notaries can't do loan signings but no one has paid any attention to it. I'm a very new notary and am not sure what I should do. By the way, it's April 19 that we must comply with the E.O. Hope some of you EXPERIENCED MA notaries out there can shed some light on this.

Reply by Marlene on 3/17/04 8:13am
Msg #1171

Here is the contact person we've been working with to get more information about Massachusetts requirements. Her office is charged with interpreting the executive order.

Judith Goldberg
Executive Department Legal Counsel
Commonwealth of Massachusetts
617-725-4030

If more people could contact the Counsel, I think we'll start seeing definitive information coming from them.

Marlene Miller
United States Notary Association
www.enotary.org

Reply by Tom_in_MA on 3/17/04 10:31am
Msg #1174

Marlene, can you share the information you have received from this source. Thanks.

Reply by Robert Young on 3/25/04 7:05pm
Msg #1293

Thanks Marlene. I have attempted to contact my state senator but to date I have not heard anything. Will give Judith a call. Thanks.

Reply by Robert Young on 4/3/04 8:30am
Msg #1383

I recentlly spoke with Ms Goldberg and essentially received a reply that while EO 455 does dictate new requirements for Notaries Public commissioned to practice in the Commonwealth, it does not change the law on closings.

Indeed, it does reflect sound Notary Practice [which I agree with; it is based on the Model Notary Act] and it restates those practices for notaries in the Commonwealth. With the exception below, I have no issues with the EO, only in its interpretation.

The issue is with the terminology of item 6(k) "A notary public who is not an attorney licensed to practice law in Massachusetts shall
not conduct a real estate closing and shall not act as a real estate closing agent."

And this in turn appears to be based upon a court ruling involving "Massachusetts vs Colonial Title" in which the court ruling, extended to Signing Agents, is clearly not in our favor.

I must indicate here that this is what I am understanding from my brief study of the matter; I am not a licensed attorney in any state. I am just trying to learn the details of this and to see if there is some possibility or opening for change.

As it stands now, the only people who can legally pick up this work here in Massachusetts are licensed members of the bar. And this is not good ... not for us, not for the citizens of the state.

Reply by Marlene on 4/13/04 1:14pm
Msg #1485

"The state has posted proposed amendments to the Executive Order that "respond to feedback that we received from the legal community and public."

Information here: http://www.enotary.com

Reply by Tom in MA on 4/13/04 6:43pm
Msg #1486

Went to the url you posted (www.enotary.com) but couldn't find anything that seemed to be related to MA EO.

Reply by Marlene on 4/14/04 2:29pm
Msg #1493

My apologies, should be www.enotary.org

Reply by bob on 4/23/04 11:51am
Msg #1627

Supposedly the "revision" to the EO "clarifies portion of Executive Order on non-notaries conducting real estate closings".

The only statement I see that is attempting to clarify this is the following now added to par 6k. "A notary public who is employed by a lender may notarize a document in conjunction with the closing of his or her employer's real estate loans."

Is this it? Can one replace the word "employed" with the word "contracted." In my mind, that is still the issue. Comments ?

Reply by PAW Notary Services on 4/23/04 4:43pm
Msg #1632

There is a BIG difference between being an employee and hired as an outside independent contractor. Having been both in Massachusetts for many years, believe me, there's a lot of difference.

To be employed by the LENDER, you must first be considered an employee, either exempt or non-exempt (salaried vs hourly) and receive or have access to certain corporate benefits.

Also, consider that for the most part, we are not contracted by the lender. The title/settlement/escrow company is. We are then contracted by them, either directly or through a signing service (agency).

Reply by Tom on 4/27/04 11:56am
Msg #1684

Are any of you continuing to do loan signings? I'm afraid my take is that unless you are a licensed attorney you can't do them. Also, has anyone else stopped receiving calls to do signings. I don't think I've had a call in three weeks.

Reply by Anonymous on 5/4/04 6:41pm
Msg #1823

I don't see it any other way Tom! And yes, I believe the word is out as calls have all but dried up.

I have contacted my State Senator and his staff is looking into it further. It appears that he is concerned. I am not giving up; it just may take some time. I enourage all to contact State Senators and Representatives. That's how things get done!!

Reply by Anonymous on 5/28/04 7:30pm
Msg #2496

The market has dried up anyway. Time to find another job, I guess.