Posted by christi so/cal on 4/23/05 7:21pm
Msg #33574

legal doc blanks

I think I saw a site here, thought I put it on my favorites, for templets of docs. What I need is a power of attorney. A friends aunt has cancer, and she wants to update that doc. She thinks she got it from a traveling notary, but can't remember. I know I can't tell her what doc to use. but is it okay to bring her the doc after she tells me what one. And if so is there a site I can download that from. I have tried to search both here and the net, but so far no luck
Thank you

Reply by Jay on 4/23/05 7:54pm
Msg #33579

www.uslegalforms.com/poweratty.htm n/m

Reply by Katie/ca on 4/23/05 9:09pm
Msg #33594

This maybe the one you wanted.

http://www.fntalameda.com/docs.htm

Reply by PAW_Fl on 4/23/05 9:42pm
Msg #33598

It is NOT recommended to provide the document, by the American Society of Notaries. The following is an excerpt from their recent "tips" email mailing:

----- ----- ----- ----- -----

Keep in mind that under no circumstances should you help a signer compose
any document, much less one as serious as a medical power of attorney or
advance directive. It’s also improper for you to provide preprinted
documents for such purposes. The proper document to use, as well as the
proper wording, is for the signer and an attorney to decide. Your
responsibility begins and ends with proper notarization-not with helping the
signer obtain the desired form, document or wording. Remember that you may
not comment on the contents of the document except to point out spaces that
may have to be filled, crossed out or have N/A or not applicable written in
by the signer and initialed by the signer.

----- ----- ----- ----- -----

A Power of Attorney should be drafted by an attorney since it is a very powerful instrument and needs to be explicitly worded to encompass exactly what is needed, nothing more and nothing less. I strongly urge those who wish to draw up a POA to seek legal counsel and not use an "off the shelf" form. Personally, I will not notarize a POA that is not drafted or at least approved by an attorney, except in rare circumstances where the POA is a fixed instrument provided by the state (as in an DPOAH).

Reply by Jay on 4/23/05 9:49pm
Msg #33599

Thanks paw. This one I printed.

Reply by BrendaTX on 4/23/05 10:01pm
Msg #33600

I agree totally, Paul.

I had a person in an assisted living center ask me for a power of attorney the other day. She definitely has all her faculties, but this is a no can do.

I told her that I could give her a few forms to consider but that under no circumstance would I notarize any document that I brought to her from my own computer/printer...even if it is a "form" job, for me.

I think this is one of those situations where because I know a little about that area of Texas Law it is even more important for me to keep my hands off of it for purposes of being a notary public or I could be seen as using legal secretary knowledge to practice law.

...and nothing would annoy a Texas lawyer (specialized in RE/Probate) more than to find out a notary w/ just enough knowledge to be dangerous had done such a thing.

I get scared just thinking about it.

Reply by BrendaTX on 4/23/05 10:05pm
Msg #33603

...wait a minute...

Christi did not say she was thinking about notarizing the docs. Overkill on my response about the notary stuff.

Also...any form like this I *would* give her would be one of the state forms that Paul mentioned. Nothing more.

Period.

Reply by PAW_Fl on 4/23/05 10:41pm
Msg #33609

Re: ...wait a minute...

Granted she didn't explicitly state that she would be doing the notarization, but the implication is there that since she is a notary, that she would know and have access to the forms that would be needed, whether or not she did the notarization is immaterial. It was her "position" that generated the request.

Reply by BrendaTX on 4/23/05 10:53pm
Msg #33610

Re: ...wait a minute...

Paul, You and I are in agreement about this...just trying not to single-handedly start a riot over being insensitive.

Sounds like Christi was approached like I was (because she's a notary)...and Paul is correct...staying away from this kind of thing is really important for notaries.

You know...now that I think of it...the lawyer I used to work for would say that he chose not to notarize wills and poas, etc because he had drawn them up.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/24/05 12:36am
Msg #33615

Re: ...wait a minute...

Brenda
I did a loan signing with an attorney once, who was also a notary.
Not only did he draw up the wills and notarize them, he had his wife, who worked in his office witness the wills he was notarizing! I actually had to point out to him the illegality of this, and show it to him in writing!

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/24/05 9:27am
Msg #33627

Re: ...wait a minute...

The lawyer I worked for knew that whether or not Tx law specified he should not notarize something he drafted, he did not want to get himself into a problem. I miss that man. He died four years ago.

I learned an awful lot from him about doing not using the "Make 'em do right" Law which has helped tremendously in being a notary.

My boss's clients always wanted to "Make 'em do right" and sometimes the law does not necessarily provide for that.

Notaries should be aware that the "Notaries Do It All the Time" rule does not exist for notaries.

Reply by christi/socal on 4/25/05 3:08am
Msg #33742

P.S.

I was approached because I'm a notary, and when my friends mom was dying a traveling notary brought her the docs she needed so she thought it would be something I just had on hand. I told her I'd have to check on it ( I knew you guys would set me straight!) I wasn't sure if I could do the preprinted forms or not.---> (NOT)
And just to let you know, I thought your responces were fine, I don't get upset easy. I have 5 kids and they wore me down aaages ago... Again thanks

Reply by Paul2_FL on 4/23/05 11:45pm
Msg #33612

Thanks Paul - another keeper!

Reply by Paul_IL on 4/23/05 11:58pm
Msg #33613

Hey Paul,
I bet that was drafted by their attorney!

Reply by PAW_Fl on 4/24/05 6:23am
Msg #33621

If you're referring to the ASN excerpt, I wouldn't doubt it.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/23/05 10:21pm
Msg #33608

Christi
I would advise your friend to have her aunt consult an attorney.

Reply by Ernest_CT on 4/24/05 10:44pm
Msg #33719

Unless you've got a strong desire to lose ...

... your commission and then get sued, don't supply any forms other than an acknowledgement or a jurat to be attached to a signer's document. What seems innocent is really unauthorized practice of law (UPL).

A Power of Attorney is way too important to be downloaded from the 'Net.

Reply by christi/socal on 4/25/05 2:53am
Msg #33741

okay, I told her she'd have to get her own doc and

That she should talk to a lawyer. I guess the aunt already had done this with a nephew being the one in control, but he lives in another state so they all decided it would be better for my friend to be the "one". The aunt was told 3 mos or less, so they want to get it settled.
Thank you all for your help, I am very grateful the ya'll are out there : )