Posted by RayWyatt_Cal on 12/29/05 8:43pm
Msg #85170
Lowering standard fees
First thing, thank you guys for all your positive and useful input and support here! I learn someting new everyday!
This last week I have lost 6 jobs because I would not reduce my fees for two SS's I have never worked for/with. I was thinking this AM that there must be someone in my area quoting lower fees as these guys never called back. I was working on some new figures for me to charge for the next job when I get calls from yet two more SS's that I have not worked for with jobs that met my fees right from the start.
Here I was just ready to give in when I get reassurance that I am doing it for the right price! I am now very famillar with the "Lo-ball" workings of some of these SS's. So far it has only cost me airtime on the cellphone. I now have a list of SS's that I will just say no when they call me.
Thanks again everyone....
| Reply by patricia on 12/29/05 9:26pm
Msg #85183
there really isnt a need to lower your fair fees, usually when I turn down a low offer I either
get another better paying job for the same time slot or sometimes original ss calls me back and accepts my higher fee. I wonder how much money some of the companies are spending having people call and call trying to find the $45-50 notary.
| Reply by peterole_MN on 12/29/05 9:40pm
Msg #85188
Just remember that "Low Ball" signing services do not care if you go the hole helping them to stay out of the hole. One of the most often overlooked business cost is the "real" cost per mile for driving your car. The "real cost" would include depreciation, insurance, maintenance and then gas. Last time I calculated it for my Chev Malibu, it was around 60 cents per mile. The other killer with some SS is the number of fax backs they sneak into a job.
Have a Happy New Year!!!!
| Reply by TCMN on 12/29/05 11:51pm
Msg #85215
Peterole....
I know this is off topic, but...how do you like your Malibu? I have one also, a 2004. I wouldn't trade it for the world and I'd buy another one in a second! I call it my "pocket-rocket" I have the 6 cylinder and I can squeel the tires so easy that I have to watch it sometimes. I can "take" a lot of cars and it's funny how many high-schoolers jaws hit the floor when they act like they want to race and when I've just had a crappy day, it's fun just smokin them sometimes. Makes the long drive home after a 6-signing day more enjoyable. 
LOVE MY CAR!
| Reply by Nate_MN on 12/30/05 12:28am
Msg #85224
I am curious how you calculate that real cost. Can you break it down better. 60 cents per mile would mean that every 100,000 miles you drive would cost you $60,000. So if I give you the following:
Purchase Car = $20,000 (assuming after three years the car has no value)
Gas @ $2.50/ga = $12,500 (assuming 20mpg)
Insurance = $6,000 (assuming $1,000 every six months, if you drive the 100,000 in 3 years)
This totals $38,500, which means according to your calculation you had $21,500 in repairs and maintenence. That seems like a lot of repairs. It seems even more likely that it would not be 60 cents per mile because I have been very conservative with those numbers. Clearly your car will still have some value, I would hope a Malibu get's better than 20mpg, and if you are paying $1,000 every six months you have probably been very naughty. What is your calcuation? I don't mean this to be argumentative, just have been thinking a lot about this lately. I am going to actually keep a log in 2006, marking down starting milage, logging all costs during the year, and then dividing total costs by miles.
As for fees, certainly avoid low-ball fees and charge as much as you want to make.
| Reply by Art_MD on 12/30/05 7:36am
Msg #85248
Re: Lowering standard fees re: car costs
NSA, like many salesmen, are outside the norm when it comes to actual cost of vehicle operations as used by the government in figuring mileage allowance.
I believe that they use 15000 miles as the average per year.
so, .40/miles is based on
1. 7 year life
2. Car is bought on time and you are paying interest on loan.
numbers by gov might read like this:
Cost - $450/mo payment on loan - $5400/yr
insurance $1000/yr
inspections - $100/yr
Tags - $50/yr
Gas - if 30 MPG - 500 gallons/yr [e-mail address] = $1250/yr
repairs - $500/yr
Total -- $8300
less value after 5 yrs/5 say 7500/5 = 1500
total cost $6800
6800/15000 = .4533
BUT, with 30,000miles/yr
Cost - $450/mo payment on loan - $5400/yr
insurance $1000/yr
inspections - $100/yr
Tags - $50/yr
Gas - if 30 MPG - 1000 gallons/yr [e-mail address] = $2500/yr
repairs - $1000/yr
Total -- $10,050
less 4500/5 = 900 (value is less because of high mileage)
total cost $9150
9150/30000 = .305
So, your cost/mile decreases the more miles you put on per year.
Don't hold me to the numbers, they aren't exact, but may be close.
Art
| Reply by TCMN on 12/30/05 9:09am
Msg #85261
Nate...& Art...
My Malibu gets more like 32-38 miles per gallon. As long as I'm not racing it.
But seriously I put more than 15000 miles on per year, it was more like 31000+, so Nate was close to the 100000 in 3 years. (I did very well in 2005).
I don't have loans on cars. That's a depreciation loan and not good business sense. It's better to have the money against your home and pay cash for the car. (Tax write off and generally lower interest on home, NOT on a car loan)
THEN not getting into a completely separate topic but networking is where you will make the best money because of effeciency. That's all I'm saying on it so this post isn't too long. Anyone wanting to go into that can leave me their email and I'd be happy to go into that subject. I think with conversations I'vd had with Charm and others, we get that whole concept well.
| Reply by peterole_MN on 12/30/05 11:44pm
Msg #85406
I based my numbers per mile on AAA and Motor Trend info. The actual number was a little more than 56 cents per mile. Check: motortrend.com/features/news/112_news050322_fuel/
Also check AAA web cite via google, enter per mile cost for 2005.
| Reply by BrendaTx on 12/30/05 11:59pm
Msg #85408
Peterole - great article. Thanks. nm
| Reply by ReneeK_MI on 12/30/05 4:48am
Msg #85236
Ray - I don't assume that SS's lowering fees is 'evidence' that my local competition has lowered their's, or that I should follow this imaginary trend. What I believe is that SS's are struggling to compete with direct-marketers, and that both ends are squeezing the middle. The refi boom created fertile ground for the middle-man, but that ground is just no longer very fertile.
Now, if you were an SS, and you were trying to score a competitively-priced closing assignment, and you were calling SA after SA but were being quoted fees that price you out of the market - what would YOU say in response:
A) "Gee, EVERYONE I call wants as much as YOU do for this assignment, but I'm not ready to give in yet. I'll call YOU back if I can't find someone cheaper."
B) "You know - EVERYONE else is doing these for $40, I could NEVER pay what you want, we won't be able to give YOU any business ...."
It's a marketing tactic. If you want all the SA's to THINK they're charging above the going local rate ... how would you accomplish that? NEVER hand over bullets to someone with a gun aimed at you.
If there's someone in your market area that's snatching up $40 closings - how long can their 'business' remain viable? Even a 'Wallmart' mentality can't keep paying the bills on $40 signings - there just aren't enough hours in the day for that. How many Huds does anyone need to look at to know that fees are NOT going down? How many closings is anyone willing to do for low-ball fees when they're SEEING Settlement Fees for $400, 500, the other day I saw $500 PLUS $200 to SS - total $700 in JUST closing fee.
I know my worth. I know there are a LOT of SA's who are a roll of the dice for everyone involved, and a lot of SS's who will roll that dice for as long as they can. I also know there are plenty of title agencies and lenders who will NOT.
Whew - ok, I feel better =)
| Reply by RayWyatt_Cal on 12/30/05 8:34am
Msg #85258
Thanks Reneek and others
I am so glad to have this board to ask questions and get valueable answers
| Reply by PA_Notary_II on 12/30/05 8:50am
Msg #85260
ReneeK.....exceptionally well said...you hit the proverbial nail on the head. And on the query as to how much is spent on the time used to find a cheap Notary, I've always wondered how much a new car would cost if the makers cut out just the cost of TV advertising.
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