Posted by Me on 2/16/05 7:03pm
Msg #20917

question

My husband and I did a refinace last July and I have been trying to reach the company who did our closing ever since in regards to a notorized copy of our mortgage. Well just today I finally found out why I can't get ahold of them. The broker company called P&L Mortgage of Minneapolis closed. Anyways the mortgage IS NOT notorized by the person that did the closing. She said she was going to stamp it at the office cause she didn't have her stamp with. Do you know if this is legal or what can be done ??
thanks for any info I can get.
PS I finally ended up getting a copy from the lender.

Reply by Korey Humphreys on 2/16/05 7:22pm
Msg #20922

On the paperwork you have it should contain the name of the notary public whom came to you. Therefore, contact your secretary of state and they should be able to give you the contact information of that notary public.

In Massachusetts it's the Secretary of State who "holds" or information. It could be different in your state though. But just check with your government agency that is responsible for Notaries Public. They will help you.

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Korey

Reply by Me on 2/16/05 7:30pm
Msg #20925

Okay thank you so much for the info. I don't think its legal. ??

Reply by Charm_AL on 2/16/05 7:49pm
Msg #20929

The notary that you appeared before to witness your signature and check your ID's should have been the same notary that notarized your documents

Reply by PAW_Fl on 2/16/05 8:29pm
Msg #20933

If another notary completed the certificate (not the one who witnessed the signature), then that notary performed an illegal act. However, in most states, if not all, an invalid or improperly performed notarization does not make the underlying document invalid or illegal. Conversely, if the notarization was done properly and legally, it doesn't necessarily make the document legal. That's not the purpose of a notarization.

Reply by c ca on 2/16/05 8:18pm
Msg #20932

I don't believe you can notarize a document with out your stamp. It sounds kinda fishy to me. But I'm still new to the game I will have been a notary for a year in July.

Reply by PAW_Fl on 2/16/05 8:35pm
Msg #20934

Some states require a stamp or impression seal. Some only a stamp. Some only require a notary's signature, and identifying information.

Reply by Me on 2/16/05 8:43pm
Msg #20938

This notary that was at the closing didn't even sign the docs. I would think it would be illegal. That would be like one of us going to a closing, and bringing the docs back for someone else to sign and notorize. If that was the case we could send our spouse or kids to do a closing in place of us. ???

Reply by Charm_AL on 2/16/05 8:52pm
Msg #20941

like we replied....if one notary was at the signing and another notary later notarized...it's illegal - curious - what state are you in?

Reply by Me on 2/16/05 9:00pm
Msg #20942

Minnesota. What actions should be taken ?? I got a couple of ideas from the first person that replied, anymore feedback on this would be of help?? Thanks

Reply by CarolynCO on 2/16/05 10:37pm
Msg #20958

A few months back I had a signing where the purchasers purchased their house about 6 months previously. When they purchased the house, there was no notary present to notarize their signatures, but when they received their signed copies, they were notarized. They did not say anything to anyone, but somewhere down the line six months later, someone or something brought attention to this particular loan and it had to be started over from square one. Incidentially, the original signing occurred at the real estate office and not through a NSA.

Reply by Becca/FL on 2/16/05 11:14pm
Msg #20963

Carolyn - I have heard some stories that would make any reputable Notarie cringe.

JUST SAY NO. TO ILLEGAL PRACTICES!

Reply by PAW_Fl on 2/16/05 9:00pm
Msg #20943

If a notary notarizes a signature without the signer being in their presence, then the notary performed an illegal act. But again, an improper or illegal notarial act does not make the underlying document invalid or illegal in most cases and in most, if not all, states.

Reply by Me on 2/16/05 9:07pm
Msg #20945

So are you saying you don't think anything can be done about it ??

Reply by Jon on 2/16/05 10:29pm
Msg #20956

The notaries involved may be disciplined, but that is about it. Paul's point is that the document, in most cases, will still be a valid document even if it was improperly notarized. If you are looking for some sort of compensation, you probably won't get any. What exactly are you wanting to happen?

Reply by Shane_IN on 2/17/05 12:11am
Msg #20976

Just my 2 cents, but it sounds like someone wants to try and get their home free and clear of a mortgage.....

Unfortunately, more than likely that won't happen, and there will be no monetary recourse for them. Bad Notaries abound unfortuantely, but a bad notarization doesn't get you out of the document, nor does it get you a free and clear house... it gets the notary to lose his certification, and possibly a slap on the wrist or fairly small fine....

Reply by Bobbi in CT on 2/17/05 7:23am
Msg #20997

Same answer as PAW ..

Why are you pursuing this? Do you want to invalidate your mortgage loan so that you can pay it off and refinance with another lender? If so, you need an attorney to help you. An improper notarization may not be enough to do this.

If you want to punish the Notary Public who came to your home and punish the Notary Public who notarized the document later: You need to call your state's Notary Public commissioning office with the names of BOTH notaries - the one that took you acknowlegment and didn't sign and the one that didn't come to you home but signed the notarization block. The staff person at the Secy. of State's office can tell you how to file a written, formal complaint against each notary, including the "evidence" or proof that you will need to file a complaint.

IF this were Connecticut, the Secy. of State after receiving a complaint will 1) in writing, notify both notaries of your complaint, 2) schedule an Administrative Hearing for the notaries and you to appear to present each side of the story, 3) listen or read the evidence presented at the hearing, 4) make a decision. Assuming it is decided both notaries did not follow proper procedures, the Secy. could give them a written warning or revoke their notary commissions.
In many cases, the notaries just resign their commission prior to the hearing: end of story, no further action is taken.

If you have suffered financial damage because of an improper notarization, you can hire an attorney to file a civil lawsuit for the monetary damages you suffered plus costs. Doesn't sound like you suffered any financial loss because of this.

NOT an attorney. NOT giving legal advice, just my personal opinion from a CT perspective.

Reply by Paul_IL on 2/17/05 4:17pm
Msg #21078

You cannot get out of the loan because there may have been an illegal notorization.

Reply by Ernest_CT on 2/17/05 2:23am
Msg #20992

Go to the office where your mortgage is recorded (e.g., town hall). Look at the document. You can also get a copy there.

You should report the illegal notarial act, if there was one. While you may not get compensation, you will be helping the public at large!