Posted by kwink/ca on 7/20/05 12:43pm
Msg #53366

Okay, why is this month so slow for me? This time of the....

month, my phone is usually ringing off the hook. I am in South O/C, CA, WAH!

Reply by calipat on 7/20/05 12:47pm
Msg #53367

It has also been pretty slow for me. I was gone for 2 weeks to visit family in Texas. Got back last week and it has been pretty slow. I have had only 2-3 a day. Today so far I just have 1 and 1 for tomorrow. Hopefully it will get better!

Reply by Los Angeles/CA/Notary on 7/20/05 1:00pm
Msg #53370

I have slowed down greatly this month as well. I have had several calls to travel farther then I choose to for 65.00. I have turned all of them down. I am resting. I have been busy for the last 2 years! I am enjoying the break but like everyone else I hope this is not a trend and I hope things pick up at least by August!

Reply by Liz on 7/20/05 2:15pm
Msg #53385

Kwink, I dont know if you work for signing services, but we just had one of our big clients move to California. I have three in Mission Viejo today, one in Newport, and one in Fountain Valley. Even tho we are in California, we never did a lot of biz here, but the last three weeks, we are busy in NO Cal, the Sacramento area, and So Cal.... we can hardly keep up...

Liz at THE Notary Biz

Reply by ColleenCA on 7/20/05 2:27pm
Msg #53387

To Liz

I am located in Southern Ca. Would you please list contact information so that I can sign up with your service? Thank you!

Reply by Merry_CA on 7/20/05 2:31pm
Msg #53389

Re: To Liz

They are listed under Signing Services right here on NotRot.

Reply by CaliNotary on 7/20/05 2:42pm
Msg #53391

Colleen

You might want to do a search on this board for "notary biz". There are definitely mixed reviews of this company. Liz is formerly of 24/7 NNN and I can personally vouch for one extremely unpleasant experience with her when she was there.

And apparently they're cheap too - $50 overnight, $75 edocs.

Reply by To Colleen on 7/20/05 2:49pm
Msg #53396

Re: Colleen

I would love to have you work with me. I am fair, and run a good business. I stand behind my reputation, and my actions. Of course, you will be paid more from a title company, it is ridiculous to think otherwise... but I do have a lot of business. I pay within 30 days max without fail, and we respect every notary who does a good job for me.

Reply by Sorry Colleen.... on 7/20/05 2:53pm
Msg #53400

Re: Colleen

That was from Liz.

Reply by CaliNotary on 7/20/05 2:54pm
Msg #53401

Re: Colleen

"Of course, you will be paid more from a title company, it is ridiculous to think otherwise... "

Duh. Did I say you were cheap because you don't pay title company fees? Of course we don't expect signing services to pay title company fees, but considering you're likely getting anywhere from $125 - $200 per signing, paying the notary only $50 is cheap. Ultimately you get what you pay for and you're definitely not paying for experience.

Reply by Liz on 7/20/05 2:57pm
Msg #53403

Re: Colleen

I love the notaries that work with me.... they are professional, qualified, and experienced. They do a great job!!! I am priviledged to say that many have quit their full time jobs to be notaries full time. I also work with new notaries, and help them thru a few. I do get what I pay for... nice, professional notaries, and lots of return business.

Thanks for your outlook though... always a pleasure.

Reply by CaliNotary on 7/20/05 3:05pm
Msg #53406

Liz

Since you're posting here, I'm sure there are quite a few of us who would love to know why you think what we do is only worth $50 a pop. I'm assuming that number is accurate since you haven't disputed it.

We all know what the title companies pay and it would be interesting to hear the signing service perspective of why you're only willing to pay us approximately 1/3 of the fee you're receiving when we're doing most of the work on the signing. I know that you're not putting 2 - 3 hours into each signing like we are.

I certainly don't begrudge the signing services their share of the fee, but in most industries the middleman isn't receiving the bulk of the money per job, they're making their money by the volume that they do.

Reply by Liz on 7/20/05 3:07pm
Msg #53408

Re: Liz

I am not paid $200 per signing from ANY client. Not for overnight docs, not for email docs. Volume, volume, volume.

Reply by Merry_CA on 7/20/05 3:11pm
Msg #53409

Re: Liz

If you just think about what you ask NSA's to do and ask yourself if you would do the same thing at for the fee you are willing to pay... I think you know what the answer is. ;)

Reply by Merry_CA on 7/20/05 3:16pm
Msg #53413

Re: Liz

This post is directed to Liz

Reply by CaliNotary on 7/20/05 3:12pm
Msg #53410

Re: Liz

OK, now that you've evaded the question would you care to answer it?

I'll bet you're making $125 to $150 per signing, so if you're making your money with "volume, volume, volume" why are you paying us only less than half of what you're receiving?

Reply by Liz on 7/20/05 3:24pm
Msg #53418

Re: Liz

Cali,

I am sorry you are so upset about whatever you are upset about. I do NOT make even $100 a signing, not that it is any of your business. If you dont want to work with me, or other signing services, dont. That is your option.

I work my behind off, and yes, I do it to make money. I am offering business to notaries who want it, if you dont, and you are doing well on your own.... good for you. I dont force anyone to work with me, I am honest about what I pay... between $50-100 per signing, depending on the signing. I pay on time, and I treat people with respect. If that doesnt work for someone, than it doesnt work. It is a business Cali, it is not personal. I am sure, even if you make $200.00 per signing, you are worth more than that... arent we all?

Best of luck to you.

Reply by CaliNotary on 7/20/05 3:33pm
Msg #53420

Re: Liz

I am not upset at all. It's not like it's any secret what title companies pay for a signing. Since we don't get a whole lot of $50 signing companies posting in here I simply figured it was a good opportunity to get an explanation of why you're not willing to pay us more when we know how much you're receiving for the signing and we know how much work we put into each signing vs. what you put into each signing. Completely on topic and something that is discussed in here quite frequently.

But you're obviously unwilling to answer that question directly. Can't say I'm surprised, but it would be nice to get an honest answer instead of a bunch of talking points about how much you respect your notaries and pay on time and stuff like that. It's all well and good, but it still doesn't explain why you think what we do is only worth $50.

Reply by MsRobboPA on 7/20/05 4:03pm
Msg #53423

Re: Liz

What is this a gang war but between just two. Give me a break. If you want to have a tug of war go into a chat room!!!

Reply by Mike/NJ on 7/20/05 10:17pm
Msg #53472

Re: Liz

Cali- When I use subcontractors I trust for signings I keep very little. Why- I want them to work for me again and I trust them to do the job right the first time.

Maintaining client relations is tough enough, mess up once with a TC and you're out of there.

Reply by CaliNotary on 7/21/05 4:25am
Msg #53522

Mike

I agree with you, quality work is definitely worth paying for. There are reasons why so many signing services use agents like me over and over again and have no problem paying decent fees. No, they don't pay me the bulk of what they're getting from the title company, but they damn well pay me more than a third of it.

I just searched the messages and found one from Liz about a month ago where she states she's getting about 700 signings per month. If she's getting in the neighborhood of $125 per signing from the title company (possibly more) and paying the notaries $50, that is over $50,000 per month that she's receiving AFTER paying the notaries. Obviously there are significant expenses that go along with running a business, but I find it hard to believe that a signing service could be racking up anywhere near that amount in monthly expenses.

She obviously wants more money in her pocket at the end of the month. Which is fine, it's business and we should all aspire to make as much as we can, but there's smart business and then there's greed.

I just wish she had the courage to give the true explanation for why she only pays $50 per signing - because there are enough suckers out there willing to take it so she doesn't have to pay more. She'd rather keep a bigger slice of the pie than pay above what essentially amounts to minimum wage in this industry. All the rest is just lip service to make herself look better on the boards.

I'm sure McDonalds has a spiel about how great they treat their employees, and they quite possibly live up to it. That still doesn't make it a decent place to work for anybody with any sort of career ambitions.

Reply by ColleenCA on 7/20/05 2:49pm
Msg #53397

Re: Colleen - CaliNotary

Thanks for the info. I will definately keep that in mind.

Reply by Liz on 7/20/05 3:28pm
Msg #53419

Thanks!!!

And to everyone is just signed up....Thanks so much!!! We will send out your login and passwords in the next day! We really appreciate it!

Reply by parrotia-oregon on 7/20/05 4:31pm
Msg #53427

Re: Thanks!!!

Liz,

I signed up with your company but never received a login or password. Should I sign up again?

Reply by To Parrotia on 7/20/05 4:46pm
Msg #53431

your sign up

If you could email me your name, I will check...

[e-mail address]

Reply by SherryB on 7/20/05 5:29pm
Msg #53440

Hi all...I am just not sure why people have to be attacked...I thought Liz was trying to be nice by offering some work to someone who was in need. I posted here the other day. I too own a signing agency. As I stated in my prior post, things are not always as they seem. I will flat out tell you..I charge my clients $150 and pay my closers $100 for edocs...after schedulers and bills are paid, I probably profit about $10-$15 per closing...(UGH, never thought about it that way before)..Believe it or not I STILL HAVE closers who question me...The other day I had a closer lets call him "JAMES BROWN" accuse me of jipping him out of $50 because the HUD stated that settlement fee was $150 paid to "JAMES BROWN"..In error the TC put his name on the HUD versus my companies name.. I tried to explain this to him but he still thought I was trying to short him....I think it is unfortunate in this industry that signing agencies are "GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT". It really isnt fair to those of us who do try to be fair. As far as payment, I feel that it is up to the signing agent as to whether or not they want to take the $50 closings. Dont get mad at Liz... If she can get quality closers who will work for her, than who the heck really cares........

Reply by Liz on 7/20/05 5:55pm
Msg #53446

Thanks Sherry. Appreciate it.

Reply by SherryB on 7/20/05 6:10pm
Msg #53448

I am just really tired of being beat up for no reason...I agree that there are a ton of BAD ( I mean really bad) SS's out there but what a lot of SA's dont understand that things are JUST as tough for SS's as they are for SA's..that does in no way justify how some SS's treat SA's (non payment, etc...)..Instead of all of us fighting about things, we all need to find away to make things better for all of us in this industry. I for one, feel that we (the SS's and the SA's) are at the bottom of the bucket...we are underpaid and overworked.....We all know that the mesely $150 that is collected for settlement services is a heck of a lot less than what the broker is making on the deal (and half the time the broker doesn't even "close" his own loan). SA's have to come in and do the job of the broker...Why are we all not getting paid the big bucks? I dont think we need to be mad at eachother, I think we need to redirect that energy into setting higher standards in the industry so we can all reap the benefits!!! OK YOU CAN KNOCK ME OFF MY PEDASTAL NOW>>>Thanks

Reply by Liz on 7/20/05 6:16pm
Msg #53449

Hallelejuh Sister.

Reply by Anonymous on 7/20/05 10:55pm
Msg #53477

To Liz and SherryB

Since you have posted your opinions from an SS point of view-allow me to give an opinion in regards to the $50 signing issue from an SA point of view.

I am not a big fan of low paying signing services, trip fees, fax backs or companies that don't pay on time BUT I am not going to say anything more about that.

What I will say is this- If you are going to be a $50 SS, here are some pointers:

I work for only ONE $50 agency - $75 E-doc within 10 miles of me and mileage after that. The reason that I work for them is that their packages are relatively SMALL, they are ALWAYS on time, the packages are ALWAYS tidy, they DON'T handhold, they DON'T want faxbacks, they PAY THE FULL FEE for a no-show or no-sign, they give me VOLUME and they PAY within 7-10 days EVERY TIME! These jobs are quick and pay so quick that they can get me through the 4-6 weeks that it takes to get my $300 from Countrywide!

A $50 signing service that has regular to large size packages that are messy, late from the lender, faxbacks, no repeat business and not timely pay are not worth it on SOOOO many levels. And BTW Liz, payment in 30 days is not great! It is barely mediocre. We have just gotten to where we are thrilled if companies pay within 2 months or at all!

So, IMO, if you are going to be a $50 SS- don't be mediocre or float by on what you can get away with. BE GREAT! Be the BEST $50 SS out there and at least provide TIDY, ON-TIME, FAST PAYING jobs!

I have worked with the Notary Biz and although Liz was nice - the package was late, huge, messy and a PAIN in the BUTT! Now maybe that is the client's fault and not hers, but maybe it justifies a larger cut to the Notary.

With notaries, you get what you pay for (Low pay, low quality). With Signing Services, from what I have seen, it is pretty much the same. (Low Pay, Low Quality)

I also think that if you are going to surf these boards and watch for posts that you can jump on for a 'plug', which although shrouded in concern or helpful comments, is still a plug, you should at least be honest and forthright in your answers to direct questions. Don't come on this board and then insult us by dancing around the questions. JMO

Reply by CinSignsNY on 7/20/05 11:48pm
Msg #53497

To Anonymous

Could I just have the name of that SS??!! I thought that was some great feedback that you've supplied the SS's with. But seriously if your company is nationwide, could you email me at [e-mail address]?

Reply by CaliNotary on 7/21/05 3:49am
Msg #53521

Re: To Anonymous

Wow, you obviously didn't take much from the Sunseri Settlement Services thread (msg 53456). Begging for people to share their good companies with you is just plain tacky.

Reply by BrendaTX on 7/20/05 9:47pm
Msg #53464

Re: Okay, why is this month so slow for me? This time of the

"Why are we all not getting paid the big bucks? I dont think we need to be mad at each other, I think we need to redirect that energy into setting higher standards in the industry so we can all reap the benefits!!! "

=====
The reason the lenders make the most money is because they have the money. We all support the industry. Like it or not, they are the ones with the money and they get to keep the money.

And as much as I respect myself and my work/business, I also know why I am here working as an independent contractor/notary/inspector:

MY choices put me here.

Your choices put YOU where you are--in the position of middle man between lender/title and the notary. The SS owner brokers notary services and they use the most economical service so that the profit margin is higher.

It is none of my business what an SS makes. Likewise, it's none of your business what the title companies/ lenders make.

I have no problem with your function, your fees, or your profit. If I don't like a fee, I don't work for the company and I am full aware that someone else is glad enough to do it.

What I worry about is my profit and reaching my financial goals. If the SS can be a part of me reaching my goals, I'll work for them. If they do not offer enough to make the trip a profitable one, then we won't do business.

If being offered a low fee without a profit margin for the notary makes me/notaries have less respect for the SS function that's just part of a choice to broker notary services. It won't help to blame the lenders' who pay a "measly $150" - you accepted it, right?

If you really feel $150 is measly, it seems like you have the same attitude as the notaries who resent signing services. Don't take jobs that make you resent your client. A professional notary never does.

Your idea to raise the standards is a good one. But, in all honesty, I think 90% of signing services do not want to engage in raising standards. It sounds good, but I don't buy it.

The only way to do that is to revise the standard signing service business model industry-wide and stop finding the cheapest notary to to do the job. Don't bid on jobs at a lower rate then try to keep the profit margin the same by lowering the quality of notary you contract with by not providing a reasonable fee.

Also, raising the standards might require having to develop loyalty to the *professional* notaries who will put an appointment on their calendar for your $65-100.00 fee when they accept it, and not remove it even when a $200 fee is offered from a lender or title company.

SherryB and Liz, I have no beef with you, or SSs. I do a lot of work for SSs, but let's just tell it like it is. Sherry, will you put actual effort into raising the standards if it harms your business? And, the SS fee paid is the "measly $150" because you accept it.

Maybe your clients would pay more if they were assured qualified, experienced notaries were going to take care of the job. The way I hear it from TC insiders, it's a crap shoot with many SSs because they never know if the notary is going to get there and get the documents signed.

As long as the notary game is one where the cheapest notary wins, and there is no loyalty to a notary professional who is always going to do the right thing at the right time...there's not going to be harmony between the SS and the notary.

And, in reality, some notaries won't be happy no matter what you pay them. They'll gripe because they have to go to the bank with their check...but they still get jobs because they like to be miserable and take fees that don't cover their expenses.

As long as the standard SS business model is to utilize the first cheap notary available to dispatch, rather than building real client/vendor relationships on a professional level between the SS and their contractors, notaries will gripe about the SS.

Your choice is to be an SS...you just have to take the heat of the notary resentment and smile while you are on the way to the mailbox with your profit.

However, if you really want to be popular with your contractors, then develop some loyalty to them. Just send a reasonable check with the agreed upon fee to a *professional* notary and you'll be respected.

Reply by TinaG_CA on 7/21/05 1:33am
Msg #53514

Bravo Brenda!!!!!!!! n/m

Reply by BrendaTX on 7/21/05 7:37am
Msg #53531

Re: Bravo Brenda!!!!!!!! n/m - Tina...

Thank you. I don't mean to be at all derogatory to SSs, readers!

I just feel we all choose what our business model is and we don't need to be resentful of clients. It's our choice who we work for and the fees we accept. Middlemen serve a purpose in all businesses of contracting.

SS ownership apparently comes with a degree of notary resentment toward them. It's part of what comes with the territory.

Not saying it's right! Some notaries won't be happy with winning the lottery.

However, raising the industry standard of notary signings is not possible if you don't qualify the contractor, respect and establish loyalty by calling them first, then pay them enough to profit them and keep them in business.

The SSs I work for know that. I appreciate that very much and jump through hoops to accommodate them. However, when they begin to balk at a fee that covers my expenses and yields a small profit for me we should then part company. It's not personal, it's business.

As far as $50 signings, there are some situations and some companies that make a $50 signing here in town worthwhile. For instance, a two signature collection on trailing documents and re-signing them. I just did a one signature assignment on a note for Your Notary on the Go (or run?) and got $50 w/i 27 days. (This is not the older company NOTR. ) She offered the fee, I accepted and worked it in at my convenience, and she sent the check w/i 30. Great! I don't care how much SHE got paid for my assignment. She had the contacts, I did not - win win. It was gravy on the particular day.

Reply by PA Notary II on 7/21/05 9:52am
Msg #53565

Re: Bravo Brenda!!!!!!!!

Thanx, Brenda. We can always count on you for a short and concise reply ; )

Reply by BrendaTX on 7/21/05 7:24am
Msg #53530

Re: Okay, why is ...| slight correction to my response |

**Your choice is to be an SS...you just have to take the heat of the notary resentment and smile while you are on the way to the mailbox with your profit.**

Should have been "on the way to the >>BANK<< with your profit."

Reply by MsRobboPA on 7/20/05 4:05pm
Msg #53424

I don't know what's going on Southern CA but this has been my busiest of the year so far. Since the 5th. non-stop. June was slow here though.