Posted by Mysti_FL on 3/10/05 1:49pm
Msg #24778

I think I am being bamboozled!

Remember, I am new at this!!! Well, I get a call to do a 1st and 2nd. The call comes at 5:00 or 6:00 in the evening for the next morning at 10:00 AM. Half of the first pkg she sends me that night. I think "my goodness, so this is what it means to truly prepare pkgs!!!". Next morning, she doesn't get in until 8:30 (title company) and starts sending the rest of the docs.

Note, in an earlier post, that I mentioned since this was my first 1st and 2nd, I only charged a total of $130. Although I realized I messed up, I figured, well, this is the third assignment she has sent me, so, I'll take the loss.

Well, I ended up not being able to make the 10:00 but they were nicely willing to wait until I got there at 10:30. The closing took 4 HOURS!!!!! I tell him at the beginning about the RTC and explain that while I am setting up, he review his pkg. He throws it aside claiming "don't worry, I'll give that to my lawyers"! But when we start signing, he analysis each page and makes various calls to the loan officer and because of those calls, changes figures (margin and prepayment penalty info).

Afterwards, I asked my contact to please allow for some consideration on this. She advised she couldn't go over $150. Not to lose her, I said fine, you can only do that, I'll deal with it.

Then she says "well, also there are some things you did incorrectly". She then advises that the mortgage wasn't signed by both, etc. I started a slow simmer!! I am new. I don't know all the details of this job. But I would never miss the docs she mentioned, of which the mtg is one!!! But, then, I thought. OK, someone here said "Live and Learn" so I'll deal with it.

As she starts sending me the docs to "fix" in a new email pkg, I realize "wait a minute, they are having me actually take him the changes he requested!!!" I was so upset!!! I called her and told her "listen, you are having me go to his job, then their home (for the wife's signature) and all of this stuff is for his changes!". She did try, poor thing, to get the company to agree to pay me. They offered $25. I said fine (although that is unfair since the current print out of my copies alone is about 50 pages!!!).

I only did three jobs for them within the last week or so. They haven't paid me for one yet. What do you think?????

Mysti

Reply by Claudia_NJ on 3/10/05 2:15pm
Msg #24787

Misty,

what company is this - it might help to know

Reply by CarolynCO on 3/10/05 2:34pm
Msg #24792

If I find that when the Borrower has numerous questions and wants them answered *right now* -- what I suggest is that they get a notepad and begin listing questions as we move through the docs and then make one call to the LO with all the questions. Many times they just want some assurance and after the LO begins calming them down, they will settle on getting answers to just a few of their questions.

As for your e-docs, usually when you get a call between 5-6 p.m. for an early to mid-moringing signing, depending on where you are and where the docs are coming from (because of the different time zones), you may not have the docs in time for the scheduled signing.

You say the mortgage wasn't signed by both husband and wife -- was the wife present at the signing and was her name printed on some, if not all of the docs?

Yes, we were all new at one time or another. However, to use the fact that you are new and don't know all the details of this job as an excuse when the SS tells you that there were some things you did incorrectly, is not justified.

If you have to go back because of *changes* the borrower requested during the phone calls with the LO, then I would say you are entitled to another signing fee. However, if you must go back because of things you missed, then the *re-sign* is something you have to eat and not get reimbursed. I don't understand why you have to go to the borrower's place of employment in addition to his home for his wife's signature. Why can't it all be done at Borrower's home in one trip?

Reply by Mysti_FL on 3/10/05 7:14pm
Msg #24831

Re:Residential Title Services - Clearwater - Bad Choice

Never mind! I answered my own question! (PS, I always tell them to have paper handy for questions/notes)

Well, next chapter: I put together the two refi's, both the mortgages, the Continuous Marriage Affidavit (they said I didn't make borrower complete it-basically true - he "blew" it off and said they have it already) and the assignment page. They wanted the compliance agreement to be part of the pkg but because of the way they sent me the docs (a portion via pdf, another via docmaster and another via softview) I just couldn't find that one form, so the local office of this company (Grace is in Ft. Lauderdale and is the one that contacted me for all jobs) said she would contact Clearwater and get the info from him because he had the package I sent and would have it handy. Twice she tried this (for different forms) but each time he advised he was busy and that she should locate and send to me--she is either unorganized or had the same issues finding the doc as me because of the format of the files. Still, this sounded very weird, considering he had handy access.

Anyway, I told her I needed to go eat something and once she got that one doc, to fax it to me and I would go from there. In the meantime, I had contacted the borrowers, told them that once I finished the download I would call them to schedule the meeting (he tells me he'll have his wife meet him at his job, which was very helpful of them). Within the conversation he lets loose that he knew we would have to meet up again. So, I asked "really, why?". He says, "well, George (the guy he kept calling while at the signing table) said we would have to redo the paperwork because of the changes I wanted."

Well, when he said that, my stomach started to roll. But again, live and learn, I kept saying. Finally, at about 4:30, the local RTS office calls me. She tells me "well, I have bad news and I have good news". I said "uuhh, what is the bad news?". She replies "the borrower refuses to sign bits and pieces so you are going to have to do the complete job again". I almost cried! Then remembered there was a 'good news'. When I asked, her comment was "well, you don't have to worry about printing out pieces from all of the different emails"!!!!!

I told her, no, Grace. No way can I redo a 1st and 2nd for a couple of sheets that they did not complete (all signatures were there as were notarizations except for the supposed missing signature on the one mortgage or maybe even allegedly on both) when you well know that the real reason for this is that the borrower made changes at the signing table!

She said, well, the company (Clearwater office) says that if you don't do it, they will not pay you for the jobs you have done for us (all three within the past 8 or 9 days). I told her that if that is the way they do business, then I will just chalk it up to experience and they can get someone else to do the job.

So, bottom line is, I may have made a mistake by not understanding certain documents, but I feel strongly that they lied to me and that I was pretty much set up with this last one. It didn't feel right from the beginning (again, I specifically learned to do the RTC, mortgage, note, etc - so I might miss something on other docs but I would never have missed anything on those---however, since I don't keep copies, I had to give them the benefit of the doubt) but I felt it was probably my newness in the industry. Now I realize, it is my naivete that made me easy prey. I thought, my goodness a local company likes my work cause they keep calling me for more jobs.......NOT.

Sorry for the length of this post.
Mysti

Reply by Mysti_FL on 3/10/05 7:26pm
Msg #24833

Re: PAW_FL - Pls Comment!!! Sorry for Length - n/m

Reply by PAW_Fl on 3/10/05 8:09pm
Msg #24838

Not sure what you want me to say...

Yes, this is probably the worse learning experience you have for your first time out. But these things do happen, not too often, but often enough.

You must learn to pace the signing and keep control. Of course, that's easier said than done is some situations.

You did your job, so the company should pay you. Keep after them. You can call the Clearwater BBB, and they will probably tell you they can't help you since you aren't the "consumer" in this circumstance. You can explain the situation to the Florida Division of Corporations ([e-mail address]) and see what they recommend as a course of action as well.

Reply by Mysti_FL on 3/10/05 8:32pm
Msg #24842

Re: You answered - pacing myself

Now that they spoke to me this way, I guess then I will "pace" myself as you suggest, which I guess means if I get two assignment calls from a company, say, within the week, possibly wait to take the job? Or? If they rush me too much on the docs (which I felt did open me up to making mistakes), then don't take that particular assignment?

Thank you so much for your attention.
Mysti

Reply by Bobbi in CT on 3/10/05 7:36pm
Msg #24834

Mysti - you probably have alot of company ....

If they did this to you, how many other NSAs do you think they pulled or are pulling the same scenario on?

My guess is the loan officer screwed up by scheduling a fast signing to get his commission in quickly without checking that this was the deal the borrower would sign, probably hoped borrower would sign anyway rather than make a fuss and change the documents to what the borrower thought the deal was. The loan officer can't pay more because he can't get it from the borrowers (if you were the borrower, would you pay a second signing fee for your loan officer's mess). The lender won't pay for your 2nd trip and the loan officer doesn't want it coming out of his pocket. The signing company doesn't want to pay for your second trip (it wasn't the signing company's fault) and it doesn't want to lose that lender as a client - so it won't press the issue with them. If the signing company doesn't pay you for the work you have done, they can use YOUR money to pay someone else to finish this job and have extra left over to pocket.

Anything that was your error, then you re-do for no additional fee. Anything that was NOT your error or not under your control (multiple errors in document text and missing documents) you should be paid for your time.

I feel for you. If it were me: I would continue to bill them for the three I did. I would write off this bad one as "a learning experience" (others will disagree). Don't let them rip you off for those three. You have already decided not to work for them again, so if you have time and persistence go after the money for the jobs well done.

Reply by Mysti_FL on 3/10/05 7:56pm
Msg #24836

Re: Thank you for your kind words

When I tell you, Bobbi, that this has been a tough day for me (my first, therefore, my worst), it was bad. I felt bad that I made an error, felt better when I thought they were messing with me (I know....sick!) and felt bad again when they gave me the last blow.

I want to take your advise about the other amounts. However, a) today is not the day for me have enough energy to think of how to word my invoices and b) I'm feeling pretty negative about all of this right now.

Lucky for me, I'm on vacation next week (just taking a course on another side business I am doing) and Saturday, I have a quick afternoon signing. When I get back, I will attend to this issue, and sign up with more companies.

Thanks again!
Mysti

Reply by Happy_in_Fl on 3/10/05 9:25pm
Msg #24859

Re: Thank you for your kind words

Mysti..You stated in the third paragraph;

"I tell him at the beginning about the RTC and explain that while I'm setting up, he review his package. He then throws it aside -" etc, etc.

Can I make perhaps a beneficial suggestion- in all honesty not meaning to be critical okay?

I leave the Borrowers copy in my briefcase, until after the signing is completed. (It does not come out of my case until that time) I do tell them, I have a copy of all the docs they are signing, and remind them periodically of that as the event comes up. (RTC-- maybe the first payment certificate- what ever).

They do not get a copy (or even see it) from me, unless all docs have been signed- and I have a package ready to be returned. Many Title Companies and Signing Services include that in the instructions to me for the signing.

The questions should have been handled on the phone to the contact person given on your instructions. And if they can not give proper answers etc., you have to ask the contact-"Do we go on- stop- tell me what you want- but the docs are being marked up by the borrower and you need to know that.

What your borrower probably did- was after you left, mark everything up the way he wanted it, and your client company made it appear as "all your fault" to get you to return for no charge.

I'm really sorry you had this happen early on- but as Paw said- experience is costly- chaulk up the one signing to experience- go after the others- they all from now on only get easier. Problems--of course-- different--yes--but you will fine tune yourself to handle this business just fine.

Best Wishes!!!

Reply by Ernest_CT on 3/10/05 10:54pm
Msg #24870

I'm with Happy_in_FL

I also keep the borrower's copy in a manilla folder in my briefcase until 1) I need to swap a borrower's page for a lender's page on which the borrower made a mistake (wrong date, signed RTC in wrong place, etc.); or b) the signing is complete and it's time to leave.

As you've already seen, we all have sympathy for you! None of us are perfect. Just keep reading your manual and other reference works. Good luck!

Reply by Happy_in_Fl on 3/11/05 9:25am
Msg #24927

Re: I'm with Happy_in_FL

10-4 Ernest.

Come on down!

The Robins are back- the Mockingbirds are building nests- the daffodills are 8 inches high- Azaelias are in full bloom- Spring has sprung- like a beautiful work of art unfolding.

(Heard it's heading your way as well- once it chips it's way thru the ice and snow, hey?)

Makes one feel- Life is great, and worth the Living!

Love this time of the year!

Reply by Mysti_FL on 3/11/05 4:34pm
Msg #25023

Re: I'm with Happy_in_FL

Thanks again all!
I was taught to pull out but not give the copy to the borrowers until we are done (via NNA) but the trainer also said he has them go through the docs while he prepares.

From now on, beginning with the one tonight, I will do as you do and not give it to them until I am done. Besides, if they refuse to sign, I'll need it if I want to gracefully walk away with ALL copies.

Thanks again for your empathy.
On to the next, I should have said.....and am following now!
Mysti