Posted by Becky on 3/25/05 11:43pm
Msg #27754

back dating

Had a closing that was rescheduled to today (with LO's approval). When we began signing...

borrower: we're going to put yesterday's date
me: why?
borrower: because I don't want to delay funding. I want to get it over with.
me: I cannot put yesterday's date
borrower: Loan officer says it's ok and I'm ok with it so we're in agreement. Let's get started. I've been a notary before, it's no big deal
me: Back dating is not ok with me, it is illegal.

CAN YOU BELIEVE THIS?

I couldn't get hold of TC. LO is POed with me.

Reply by Becca/FL on 3/26/05 12:25am
Msg #27758

I said NO three times today, twice yesterday.

EOM comes 12 times per year. You would think people (lenders) would be a little more prepared. It's not like it's a big suprise.

Reply by Veronica_CA on 3/26/05 12:37am
Msg #27759

I had to say no twice yesterday. It was the first time I had been asked by a signing service to do it. I like to be ethical.

Reply by Ted_MI on 3/26/05 7:36am
Msg #27772

Becky,

When you get right down to it, the loan officer is just being lazy. Now granted I am sure that the loan documents are date specific, but there is no reason why the dates couldn't be changed from Thursday's date to Friday's date.

I went through a comparable scenario yesterday. Loan officer wanted me to backdate docs to yesterday for a signing originally scheduled for yesterday which was not able to take place due to borrower's illness (and hopefully will take place today). I said no way. So the loan officer had the docs rerun with today's date. We shall see what happens.

And there still was time for your situation as the drop dead date for signing docs and having the funding take place by the end of the month is tomorrow (now granted tomorrow is Easter).

Reply by PAW_Fl on 3/26/05 9:15am
Msg #27775

There are lots of reasons you simply can't change the date. It has to do with money. Particularly, per diem interest and funding dates. For those loans that will fund upon expiration of the RTC, doing the signing a day later can have major impact on the closing costs, funds due from/to the borrower and escrow. For those loans that fund sometime after expiry of the RTC, there's a little leeway since the calculations are based on sometime in the future, further out than three days.

Reply by Ted-MI on 3/26/05 2:43pm
Msg #27805

Paul,

I stand enlightened. Your comment that it has to do with money is not that surprising.

I was under the impression that most loans funded the day after the expiration of the RTC. Is that not the case?

Also isn't there a major dollar difference between per diem interest which you mentioned and an interest rate that would be locked in by funding prior to the end of the month.? I was focusing on the latter in my comments.

Reply by PAW_Fl on 3/26/05 6:06pm
Msg #27828

Yes, **all** loans fund after the expiration of the RTC. But if the RTC expiration date shifts out, then calculated payoffs to the expected funding date will need to be changed, which affects the per diem amount, not necessarily the rate for the loan being paid off. Also, if the funding date shifts too much, then interest on the new loan for the "skipped" month has to be calculated and added to the closing cost. Of course, this is somewhat offset by the first payment date being changed to the following month.

I didn't even address the possibility of rate lock expiration. That too may be an issue if the rate lock expires on the expected execution date. Some rate locks extend past that date and some lenders provide lock extension guarantees, for a fee, of course, to protect the interest rate if unforeseen delays happen.

So, there are a lot of things that may need to be considered when signing the day after the expected execution date. It just isn't as simple as changing some dates. (I wish it were.) More often than not, shifting the execution date causes a new HUD to be generated because of the different costs involved, primarily in the per diem amounts. But also possibly in the note as well if the rate lock expires.

I just wish every signing service employee worked in a title/escrow/settlement office for 60 days before "advising" the signing agents what to do. We already know that they typically don't know notary laws for all the different states, and often not even their own. But the also typically are not aware of the consequences of simply changing the date of signing.

Reply by Reggie on 3/26/05 5:19pm
Msg #27822

I had one scheduled for Thursday night and got there and the loan was a 30 year loan and the borrowers wanted a 15 year loan so they stopped the signing I called the ss and left a message as to what had happened.
The next morning yesterday Friday the LO called and asked me to go back and do the signing the borrowers had agreed to the 30 years and They would sign the documents from last night. I told him I would have to print new docs because some of them had been signed and dated for the 24th. He said that it would be alright to sign all of them and date for the 24th I told him I could not and would not back date. He said ok print new docs and sign for 25th. I called and left another message for the ss wanting to know how the pay was going to be handled. She called back and asked if I would do just a trip fee and that it would be ok to back date the docs.
I told her it would be another fee because I had to drive the distance and reprint the docs again so it would be just like a new request. She agreed and asked again if I would back date I told her in very bold tone NO I WILL NOT BACK DATE ANY DOCS. She seemed suprised. But, she agreed to the second fee and not back dateing I am still concerned about using the same docs and having the date be different.

Reggie
Kansas

Reply by Ted_MI on 3/26/05 7:45pm
Msg #27842

Reggie,

Check out Calinotary's response in the thread directly below this thread. It seems to me that it is right on point.