Posted by rsrnotary on 3/20/05 6:05pm
Msg #26553

physical description

Here's what would seem to be an odd question but I am serious about asking. A lady needs something notarized. She clearly is dressed as a lady. Upon examining ID the picture is her, the name is a womans but the physical description says Male.

Also the signor is dressed as a lady, ID has mans name and says Male.

Now I know there are different reasons for this and I don't need a lesson on why. My issue is if the physical description (more so with the first example) differs enough to make me question it what do I do? As a notary I would tend to say that this is questionable and therefore I shouldn't do it. However I wouldn't want it to be misunderstood as discrimination when it's just me making sure that I am following laws and proceedures. What would you do?

I have come across this before in my previous job so that is why I ask.

Reply by BrendaTX on 3/20/05 6:12pm
Msg #26554

If I *believe* that the person before me is the person identified in the documents based on picture ID present (issued by a government entity), it will not be a problem to me if they appear before me as dressed as Androgenous Pat from SNL.

Clearly whether we are comfortable or not with their choice of dress is not the issue. I know an attorney who switches over and dresses as a woman, but is nonetheless the same attorney I know to be a man. Whether he's chosen to be Tom or Tommi on any given day is beside the point.

I'll be interested to see what others say to this.

Reply by rsrnotary on 3/20/05 6:45pm
Msg #26560

I too would be interested in what others have to say. I have a job to do and I just want to make sure that I do it correctly. My first example I did really question. The second example it was easy to tell that it was the person on the ID. It's not my business as to the why's but it is my business to come to a reasonable conclusion to protect against fraud.

Reply by Korey Humphreys on 3/20/05 7:31pm
Msg #26566

Agree with Brenda whole heartedly n/m

Reply by Jon on 3/20/05 6:42pm
Msg #26559

rsrnotary said:

"My issue is if the physical description (more so with the first example) differs enough to make me question it what do I do? As a notary I would tend to say that this is questionable and therefore I shouldn't do it."

You are the only one who can make that determination. One thing that may help you to decide is to check the signature. If I am not COMPLETELY convinced that the person before me is the person identified by the ID, I won't do the notarization.

As far as the "discrimination" goes, if a person wants to change their appearance that much, get new ID. As a notary I am responsible for making sure the person in front of me is who they say that they are. Since the primary means of ID is a DL or ID card, the description on it needs to be substantially similar to the person in front of me.

Reply by rsrnotary on 3/20/05 6:49pm
Msg #26561

I agree with the get a new ID. I had a client who had lost over 200 pounds and I really had to examine the facial features. I did come to the conclusion that it was him.

Reply by Northern CA signer on 3/20/05 8:56pm
Msg #26570

I have a question for your question. Did the "lady" offer anything in the way of an explanation. Did they notice your concern? I would think if they wanted to smooth the process over, they might have shared with you some critical details (like they were a cross dresser, or what have you.) It almost makes you wonder if it was a test, to see if they could fool someone or that may just be my devious mind.

Reply by CA on 3/20/05 10:55pm
Msg #26576

Re: physical description-Solution "tongue-in-cheek"

I might have looked the person in the eyes and asked in a serious tone of voice: "When using public restroom facilities, do you frequent the men's or women's room?"

Reply by jj/ca on 3/21/05 12:32am
Msg #26584

People can dramatically over time for one reason or another but I think if you have a legitimate question of his or her gender, then you should ask as politely as possible "Is this you?". You will probably get a brief explanation for the change. Also, make sure the signature match.