Posted by Cindy-PA on 5/14/05 9:14am
Msg #37751

Name on Docs didn't match D/L

I had a closing last night where the drivers license for the non-borrowing spouse was in her maiden name. She has been using her maiden name forever (because her kids names are the same). The license was issued in another state and the address didn't match the borrowers address. She was listed on the mortgage, TIL, Right to Cancel (not the note) and that's it. She did have a social security card in her married name with the correct SS# on it. What would you do? I had her fill out a name affidavit with all the variations and I notarized it, but now I am second guessing myself that this is sufficient.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/14/05 12:26pm
Msg #37781

Ive been waiting for that scenario to happen to me. SScard does not have a photo so you can't really 'know' that was hers. I would have told then to grab their neighbors and have the neighbors act as two credible witnesses.

Reply by sue on 5/14/05 1:24pm
Msg #37795

not in PA, those 2 credible witnesses you guys use aren't done here. Cindy, you are technically okay because we can use the ss card. I don't like it. I personally would have taken down her license info, her ss card info and the marriage license info. But, technically, for the state's requirements, the ss is acceptable.

Reply by Cindy-PA on 5/14/05 1:37pm
Msg #37801

Thanks to all of you for your help

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/14/05 2:04pm
Msg #37806

MY BAD!!! Should not give CA answer for PA - SORRY! n/m

Reply by missy_socal on 5/14/05 1:29pm
Msg #37797

neighbors/credible witnesses

Something funny (?) about that...

There is no way that you grab two of my neighbors, and have them swear under oath that I am who I say I am! Maybe it's my generation, or the secluded 'drive into your garage and then shut the door' So Cal mentality, but I have lived in this neighborhood for almost 3 years, and I don't really know any of my neighbors!
I don't think that I'm that unique in that anymore, either.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/14/05 2:07pm
Msg #37808

Re: neighbors/credible witnesses

Missy - that is so sad. I have lived in this house for about 7 years and we are still the new kids on the block. Everyone knows everyone. Sometimes I feel like Gladys Kravits for knowing so much about what is going on. I dare you to initiate a block party!

Reply by missy_socal on 5/14/05 5:06pm
Msg #37835

Re: neighbors/credible witnesses

Well, it's not really that sad for me! Trust me, we're *definitely* not the 'block party' type of people. :-)
We're the friendly, wave and smile sort of neighbors...but we tend to do our socializing with a small group of friends. We just moved inland, after living in South OC for 8 years, and we didn't really know any of our neighbors back in Aliso Viejo, either!

Anyway, to bring the thread back around (from my blatant hijacking), I just thought it was an interesting thought. I've just seen the 'grab two neighbors/credible witnesses' comment a few times lately, and wondered how many people were like me...and couldn't do that!

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/14/05 7:25pm
Msg #37843

Re: back to the credible witnesses

Okay - I'm stilled bugged about using a driver's license with a different last name and a SS card with the correct name an no photo. If credible witnesses can't be used - then how about their marriage license? Unless it is a really unique first name - how do you really know that it is her SS card?

Reply by SarahBeth_CA on 5/14/05 8:36pm
Msg #37851

Re: back to the credible witnesses

I agree with you Sam in as far as CA goes. ID must have PIPS, Photo, ID#, Physical Description, and Signature. The CA handbook lists the proper types of ID's and SS isn't one of them. In CA notaries only recognize the name that is proven to valid for identification which appears on the ID card. It would be ok if the package included a Name Affidavit containing both names on it. So then the signatures would go as follows: ID says Linda Hall, docs say Linda Jones
1. On the doc, Linda Hall AKA Linda Jones
2. On the notarial certificate, how name appears on ID
3. In journal, how name appears on ID

However it is up to the receiving agency whether an AKA signature is acceptable. I would still call and ask if they want the doc signed with an AKA. Then again some lenders may want you to have the borrower cross out thier name and write the correct one then initial, then other lenders don't. Let the lender decide how they want the docs done and do the certs and journal in the name which appears on the ID.

Reply by Teri-PA on 5/15/05 7:11am
Msg #37896

Re: back to the credible witnesses

In PA for a mortgage to record the vesting page, signature page and notary block must all match EXACTLY. So, your solution does not work. Whenever title cos or signing cos say just use the AKA affidavit I want to pull out my hair. I must acknowledge whatever is on the vesting page and signature page...and further must have id to support my acknowledgement....What works in one state doesn't work in another state....Our requirements are very different from CA....yet we have a lot of latitude for flexibility and good judgment (but not as much as we had before the law changed - can't remember if it was 2003 or 2004)

Reply by Teri-PA on 5/15/05 7:07am
Msg #37895

Re: back to the credible witnesses

In PA we can use ANY government issued id (with or without photo) to notarize. A marriage license is not acceptable. That said - I would not notarize off of just a Social Security card (although I could)...I would require the drivers license and a tax return or marriage license to tie it together with the social security card - so that I know the social security card is valid. Although, we do not have to do this! (I just choose to). Credible witnesses are useless in PA as the person has to be known by BOTH the notary and the person being acknowledged. So, PA notary law does not require that we KNOW the person has not provided a false SS card or other government issue ID, but good judgment requires that we can tie it all together.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/15/05 11:17am
Msg #37923

WOW! Shocked & Amazed by PA rules (no photo) n/m

Reply by Teri-PA on 5/15/05 2:09pm
Msg #37955

Re: WOW! Shocked & Amazed by PA rules (no photo) n/m

Before the law changed in 2003 we could use "good judgement" --- so there was no ID requirement per se...Most of us just used it...If we were satisfied that the person was who they said they were we could notarize....Old social security cards issued eons ago say specifically not to be used for identification purposes...but our state regulations allow us to...along with vehicle identification cards, gun permits, voters registration, etc. If it was issued by a governmental authority we can use it...Gives us lots of latitude....But I still require a picture ID to at least start the process - since you would not believe how often we see title still vested in maiden names- and the last thing people change is the social security - so we can notarize that maiden name legally....even with married name on drivers license (I just like to see the marriage certificate as a tie in- but not required!)

Reply by sue on 5/15/05 9:15am
Msg #37907

Re: back to the credible witnesses

I'm really bugged about the ss card too and that's why I use it to comply with the state's requirement but I need further id for my personal requirement. We can use the ss card because it has a signature and that's one of our id requirements here. We've had mandated id requirements for almost 2 years and our legislators just didn't use common sense when they took away our ability to use our own judgment. We need unexpired government issued id that contains a photo and signature or physicial description and an id number. A ss card has an id number & signature so it's acceptable. I for one am not a hand writing expert. How many people have signed that card at 16 years old and haven't changed their signature in the next ??? years.

As for your credible witnesses, I'm always amazed when you CA notaries talk about them. I can't imagine sitting in someone's kitchen waiting while they make phone calls to have people come to the house to id them for me.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/15/05 11:23am
Msg #37925

Re: back to the credible witnesses

***How many people have signed that card at 16 years old and haven't changed their signature in the next ??? years.***
My daughter signed only her first name and filled up the rest of the signature line with hearts.

***As for your credible witnesses, I'm always amazed when you CA notaries talk about them.***
Isn't it amazing how different the law is in each state. After they federalize how driver's licenses look (and the supporting documentation it will take to get a DL); maybe they will try to federalize the notary ID laws as well.

Reply by Teri-PA on 5/15/05 2:11pm
Msg #37956

Re: back to the credible witnesses

I sincerely doubt that notary law would change since it is under the auspices of the individual state secretaries of state...and don't want to mess with state rights....Can you imagine what federalizing notary law would do to Louisiana....where they have their own little fascinating world of notary law ----

Reply by Art_MD on 5/16/05 6:50am
Msg #38005

MD - No definition of proof of identity

Md requires the notary "receive satisfactory proof that the person making the acknowledgement is the person who signed the document"

Here is definition of satisfactory proof.

Satisfactory proof is that amount of proof which is sufficient to convince the notary public that the person making the acknowledgment is the person described in the document, and the one who executed it. A good rule for a notary public to follow would be to require such proof of identification as he or she would require to cash a very large check for that person. ♦

Using this definition, a good yearbook photo would work.

Art

Reply by Teri-PA on 5/16/05 1:51pm
Msg #38055

Re: MD - No definition of proof of identity

That was similar to our old method until the law changed in 2003...I personally liked the old method....But, I don't think you'd use my old yearbook photo...I went to high school in the 60's and people looked VERY different then!

Reply by Art_md on 5/16/05 2:19pm
Msg #38061

Re: Teri

Class of '64 ! a few changes - less hair, more pounds, less energy, more bulges, etc.etc

Art

Reply by Teri-PA on 5/16/05 8:16pm
Msg #38179

Re: Teri

and I don't wear go go boots, bell bottoms, or show my belly anymore either!