Posted by Cora/nc on 5/17/05 10:23am
Msg #38285

signature/name affidativ

Did first signing last night. Everything was fine. But I have a question about the notarizing part on this doc. Wording as follow: and that are one and the same person.
State/Commonwealth of
County/Parish of
Subscribed and sworn (affirmed) befoe me this day of (no other wording afterwards)

Notary Public in and for
the State/Commonwealth of
bla bla bla

My question do I need to do an acknowledge because the wording seems to be incomplete or do I just fill in the blanks and leave as is?

Reply by Ernest_CT on 5/17/05 10:29am
Msg #38288

Oh, oh. You're going to get flamed for this one!

Just be prepared. Your question leads us to believe that you do not have the basic notarial skills down pat, and that you should not be doing closings.

The notarial block that you have there is NOT an acknowledgement. Nor do you need to attach a loose ack to it.

Seriously, Cora/nc, you need to study your notary manual / handbook!

Reply by cora/nc on 5/17/05 10:31am
Msg #38290

Re: Oh, oh. You're going to get flamed for this one!

To be honest, I did not do an attachment nor did I think that I should have. But I was set back after reading several thread that lead to this question.

Reply by Sam I am CA on 5/17/05 10:36am
Msg #38293

Cora - I hope you don't think I am being a bi*ch for what I'm about to say. I don't think everything went fine last night at all.

Unless the laws in NC are 100% different than CA - in which case I will apologize on bended knee - the wording "Subscribed and sworn (affirmed) before me" indicates a JURAT not an acknowledgment. Did you put this person under oath? What do you mean by incomplete wording? What kind of blanks are you referring to - the borrower's name & the date?

We need more information in order to help you - but I'm afraid it might be too late!

Reply by cora/nc on 5/17/05 10:40am
Msg #38297

Did you put this person under oath? Yes
What do you mean by incomplete wording? After "on this day" there were no other words. The blanks were the wording stoped after "on this day" The borrower's name and date are already correctly on the document. Its the part of the notarizing that was incomplet. I hope this clears it better. Thanks in advance for your reply.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/17/05 10:43am
Msg #38299

Read Sylvia's reply below n/m

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/17/05 10:39am
Msg #38295

Please study your notary handbook.

Subscribed and sworn (or affirmed) before me this (16th) day of (May) by (borrowers names)

It is not an acknowledgment, subscribed and sworn is a jurat. This is basic notary knowledge, which every signing agent should know before attempting to do signings.

Reply by Ernest_CT on 5/17/05 10:42am
Msg #38298

Sylvia and Sam are being way too kind. n/m

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/17/05 10:48am
Msg #38303

Re: Sylvia and Sam are being way too kind.

Believe you me (as grandma would say) - if Cora had not already accepted this signing and placed the borrower's in such a precarious position; I would not be assisting in filling out a jurat with a 10 foot poll.

Reply by Ernest_CT on 5/17/05 11:00am
Msg #38308

Either somebody is janking our chain, ...

... or this is a new low for newbies (sorry, YourHughness)! It does look like she's serious from the tenor of the post. That scares me. The potential damage to borrowers is huge. The fact that the newbie notaries are not aware of the possible repercussions is frightening.

There are many posts on this Forum about new notaries not knowing the difference between a jurat and an ack, but this takes the cake.

Given that a number of us have weighed in aready, and received reples that we're mean, this may get to be a ten-foot poll.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/17/05 10:45am
Msg #38300

Cora - how long have you been a notary?

Are you intending to work as a Notary Signing Agent or was this signing a fovor for a friend?

Reply by cora/nc on 5/17/05 10:47am
Msg #38302

Re: Cora - how long have you been a notary?

No samiam ca. i am a newbie. you guys have no mercy. it seem like a logical question to me.

Reply by oldhippie on 5/17/05 10:49am
Msg #38304

Re: Cora - how long have you been a notary?

I can't stop from laughing!!

Reply by Ernest_CT on 5/17/05 10:52am
Msg #38305

It only seems like a logical question ...

... because you had no idea what you were doing! I tried my best to be kind, but now the gloves are off.

You MUST study your state's notary handbook (or manual, whichever your state calls it) and know the basic notarial acts COLD before you consider acting as a Notary Signing Agent. If you cannot tell immediately that what you had was a jurat, then you have no business doing closings. You are running the risk of damaging the borrowers by not having their loan fund.

Get help.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/17/05 10:54am
Msg #38306

Re: Cora - how long have you been a notary?

It is a logical question for a new notary - not for a notary Signing Agent. You could be putting the borrower's at risk for losing their rate if your mistakes cause the loan not to fund in time.

Did you give each borrower two copies of the RTC to keep as their own? Did you notarize the note/mortgage/DOT correctly? If you didn't YOU could be liable for a LOT of money!

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE read post 33325 dated 04/22 before you try to further your career as a NSA you must educate yourself!

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/17/05 11:01am
Msg #38309

I changed my mind...

Actually - there is too much info in that message that you're just not ready for! Just start with these suggestions...

(3) Make sure to learn your state notary laws well. (REPEAT AS NECESSARY)

(10) Ask your state's Secretary of State office if they recommend any courses for you.

(16) Read forums and email a notary from your state, but don't pick someone from your own backyard or you may be disappointed. For instance, I would never train my competition. I think it's foolish to be trained BY your competition. A notary four hours away might be willing to chat awhile on the phone with you about how to get started for YOUR area.

(17) Peruse used book stores/thrift stores/library used book sales and pick up books on related industries such as mortgage, finance, real estate, property law.

(18) Consider a real estate finance class (Thanks Joan OH)

(20) About documents - Learn what these documents are:

AFFIDAVIT FOR HOME EQUITY TRANSACTION-
AFFIDAVIT OF MARITAL STATUS-
AMORTIZATION SCHEDULE-
APPLICATION FOR P.A.I.D. PROGRAM-
AUTHORIZATION TO CANCEL CREDIT LINE-
BALLOON NOTE ADDENDUM-
BALLOON RIDER-
COMPLIANCE AGREEMENT-
CONDOMINIUM RIDER-
CORRECTION AGREEMENT LIMITED POWER OF ATTORNEY-
DESIGNATION OF HOMESTEAD AFFIDAVIT-
DOCUMENT CORRECTION AGREEMENT-
ESCROW ACCOUNTING ADDENDUM-
ESCROW DISCLOSURE FORM-
FIRST PAYMENT COUPON-
ID LETTER –OR-IDENTITY STATEMENT-
INFORMATION PRIVACY ACT-
INITIAL ESCROW DISCLOSURE STATEMENT-
MORTGAGE OR DEED OF TRUST-
NAME AFFIDAVIT-
NON-IDENTITY AFFIDAVIT-
NOTE-
NOTICE OF ASSIGNMENT, SALE OR TRANSFER OF SERVICING RIGHTS-
NOTICE OF PURCHASER-
NOTICE OR RIGHT TO CANCEL OR RIGHT OF RESCISSION-
ONE AND THE SAME NAME AFFIDAVIT-
OWNERS AFFIDAVIT-
PAY OFF DEPARTMENT-
PAYOFF AFFIDAVIT-
PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT RIDER-
QUIT CLAIM DEED-
REAL ESTATE ESCROW AFFIDAVIT-
REFINANCE AFFIDAVIT-
REQUEST FOR COPY OF TRANSCRIPT OF TAX FORM 4506-
SECOND HOME RIDER-
SETTLEMENT STATEMENT & SETTLEMENT CHARGES-
SIGNATURE CERTIFICATE AFFIDAVIT-
SURVEY AFFIDAVIT-
TRANSFER OF LIEN-
TRUTH IN LENDING-
UNIFORM RESIDENTIAL LOAN APPLICATION-
W-9
WAIVER OF ESCROW ACCOUNT-

Reply by Ernest_CT on 5/17/05 11:01am
Msg #38311

If Cora doesn't have E&O insurance, kiss her butt goodbye!

Reply by cora/nc on 5/17/05 11:12am
Msg #38314

Re: If Cora doesn't have E&O insurance, kiss her butt goodbye!

I have insurance. I know the difference between a jurat and an ack. You guys had to start from some point also. So unless you have not made any mistakes than kiss off. and I am saying that with a smile.

Reply by Ernest_CT on 5/17/05 11:23am
Msg #38324

Not knowing how many mistakes ...

... Kiss Off has made, I don't know whether I have made more than Kiss Off or not.

Yes, we all started somewhen. Yes, we all made mistakes. But we didn't start signing loan documents before we knew how to fill in jurats correctly.

We're concerned about the borrowers here, and about your future. The signing service not using you in the future is the least of your worries, or at least it should be. Because you asked such a simple question, we're concerned about what else happened at the signing. It sounds as if you want to correct the AKA form, which is good, but if something like the jurat was not done correctly, then SamIam's question about the RTC, et cetera, looms large. The possibilites are myriad.

I'm glad that you have insurance. You may need it very soon.

Reply by Bill/CA on 5/17/05 12:42pm
Msg #38341

Hang in there!

You are right, we all started out not knowing anything. If you learn from this, good. Don't let any of the responses on the boards stop you from asking questions. You seem to be able to take the brutality of some answers, that is also to be admired. Sometimes it depends on how the question is worded the response that you'll get.

I hope you have taken some courses on your notary law for NC and also the signing agent course. There are several other courses on the internet that you can purchase on signig agents. I have them all, I wouldn't recommend one over another as they all have something to teach us.

Hang in there, I think you'll make it.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/17/05 1:51pm
Msg #38362

Re: If Cora doesn't have E&O insurance, kiss her butt goodbye!

Cora
Forgive me for disagreeing with your statement that you know the difference between a jurat and an acknowledgment.
If you knew the difference you would not have been asking if you should attach an acknowledgment to what is obviously a jurat.

Most of us were experienced notaries when we began loan signings. We "cut our teeth" on regular notarizations.

This is the reason why some companies are now requiring a couple of years experience before hiring new signing agents. There are too many out there that became notaries just to do loan signings and they have no idea what they are doing and are hoping to get by on a wing and a prayer. Playing Russian Roulette with people's finances (loans) is not a good idea.

And I am saying all this with a smile too!

Reply by johcal on 5/17/05 2:23pm
Msg #38385

Re: If Cora doesn't have E&O insurance, kiss her butt goodby

Newbie here. From reading the posts on this site, I gather you are the "wise one" and I say that as a compliment. This string of messages got my attention, though. It scares me to think that I will never get the chance to prove myself as a LSA because of companies being scared to hire "newbies" like me.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/17/05 3:11pm
Msg #38421

Re: If Cora doesn't have E&O insurance, kiss her butt goodby

Glad you didn't say "Old and wise" LOL

All I can say, is to study your state notary laws, join a reputable professional organization like the Signing Registry. As you are in California, I can recommend the book How To Be A Wildly Successful Signing Agent. I believe it is available from www.notaryclasses.com.
It is an excellent training guide that is geared towards California signing agents.

Reply by johcal on 5/17/05 3:45pm
Msg #38436

Re: If Cora doesn't have E&O insurance, kiss her butt goodby

Thank you for the advice. I did take a loan signing class and have been reviewing my manuals for fear that when I do get that first loan signing, I will draw a major "blank." I'll check out this website that you recommended, though. I figured additional education can't hurt. I'm sure it will ease my anxiety over that first loan signing that I haven't done yet.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/17/05 3:52pm
Msg #38437

Re: who are you?

Is your 'name' Jo H. from California or Joh C. from Alabama?

Reply by johcal on 5/17/05 5:06pm
Msg #38446

Re: who are you?

It's J. Oh from California.

Reply by SamIam_CA on 5/17/05 5:29pm
Msg #38451

Re: who are you? THANX! n/m

Reply by johcal on 5/17/05 5:37pm
Msg #38452

Re: who are you? THANX! n/m

You're welcome! Nice picture, BTW. I was starting to think Green Eggs and Ham. Sorry, I have small kids and that's what "Sam I am" meant to me. Nice to meet you, SamIam.

Gotta run. My kids found me!!!

Reply by Ernest_CT on 5/17/05 10:36pm
Msg #38515

For JOh_CA JOh/CA: Welcome! You've got it right.

Sylvia is very wise. She, PAW, BrendaTX, HisHughness, CaliNotary, sue, and some other people who post here give us all an education, in notary stuff, NSA stuff, and (especially Sylvia) manners.

In this thread you've seen one of the reasons signing services are reluctant to give newbies a chance. Why should a signing service risk ITS reputation by risking using a "notary" who doesn't know the most basic fact: The difference between an acknowledgement and a jurat?r If the borrowers knew that they were the newbie's first-ever signing, that the newbie did not have a clue about basic notarial acts, and that their loan funding (or possibly their rate lock expiring) depended on the newbie, how do you think the borrowers would feel?r

What scares me is that the newbies doesn't know that they don't know!

Reply by Joh on 5/17/05 10:48pm
Msg #38520

Re: For JOh_CA JOh/CA: Welcome! You've got it right.

Reply by JohCal on 5/17/05 11:20pm
Msg #38529

Re: For JOh_CA JOh/CA: Welcome! You've got it right.

Everyone had to be a newbie at some point--even the "wise ones." What did you do different to avoid costly mistakes?

Reply by Sam I am CA on 5/17/05 11:24pm
Msg #38531

Re: For JOh_CA JOh/CA: Welcome! You've got it right.

I am still very new and aspire to be a 'wise one'. I read each and every post on this message board. Started with number one and kept going until I was completely up to date. Took several weeks and was more than worth the effort. Gotta log off now - tomorrow we're going to Disneyland!

Reply by BrendaTX on 5/17/05 11:56pm
Msg #38544

Joh...

Joh...

Start with studying your handbook...if you know that, then look for mobile notary work doing affidavits...even hang up a shingle like old time notaries did...and if it is possible, get work in a title company or a law office part-time. But, always learn how you are supposed to do your own state's notary work.

While and after....read this forum every day and you'll start seeing the reasons why and things will make sense. Pretty soon you'll get a job or two. Find a CA notary at least four hours from you to call and ask a couple of questions, but only after you really know the right questions to ask so you'll be taken seriously.

There's a big difference between: What the heck do I do with this place that says "Settlement Agent? Do I sign that????" (Sincere Question) and "Tell me how to be a signing agent." (Lazy question.)

I have talked to a CA NSA who did not have a lot of experience and picked up the phone and called me on his first time heading out. HOWEVER, God Bless his heart, before he headed off to sign, he'd gotten his notary rules down cold and had read EVERY post on this board. He's only posted one or twice...but if he's out there...Hi RP - Email me! (As it turns out...we think we might even be related! How cool is that?)

Reply by JohCal on 5/18/05 11:46am
Msg #38643

To BrendaTX and SamIam

Thank you both for your advice. I do have people that I can consider mentors. Of course, there is always this forum. I've already learned a lot just from reading the posts here including stuff they don't teach you in the notary or loan signing class. Yes, I did take them. I'm not saying the loan signing class didn't help. I'm actually glad that I took it. But, there's a lot to be learned from other people's experiences since I don't have my own.

Sam...HAVE FUN! We'll be going to Disneyland in July so we can go when it's really hot and crowded and have lots of fun.

Brenda...NICE MEETING YA!

Ciao! My 3-year-old found me!

Reply by Roger/OH on 5/17/05 11:12am
Msg #38315

No Mercy?

Think you're not being shown any mercy HERE? See how merciful the ss, title company and borrowers will be if your apparent lack of knowledge causes delays in this loan being able to fund.

It may sound mean, but the folks here speak the truth and are only trying to help you. Do listen to their advice and make sure you know what you're doing before you attempt another. Good luck.