Posted by Anonymous on 10/21/05 7:32pm
Msg #71798

Crazy Situation - FORGERY



I received a call from a SS to get a few docs signed that the "previous" notary forgot.

I get to the borrower's home to find the borrower tell me that they received a call from the mortgage company asking them "why they 'back-dated' " their docs'..... the borrower was confused, so the mortgage company faxed over about 20 docs (including notarized docs) that a line was put through the actual signing date and back-dated it by one day [so it would fund by month end]. They both the husband's and wife's initials were placed next to the 'corrected' date.

It is quite obvious that it was the same person who initialed in all places including the notarized areas.

I had the borrower sign the new docs with the original date, then a clause was put in with them signing with the new date (almost 2 months later).

During the signing, the borrowers became very uncomfortable and extremely upset that their initials were forged...... to make matters worse, the mortgage company called back the next day and said they found more docs that were 'back-dated' [of course, forged] and they would be obligated to resign those docs.

In all honestly, I "off the record" suggested to the borrower to report this to the Secretary of State and have their own attorney review the docs that were forged. The mortgage company also sent copies of the other docs that were backdated -- so it seems that the borrower has all docs that are in question.

Now after the fact I'm sitting here thinking if there is anything I can do -- or have I taken it far enough?? Let me know your thoughts.

Reply by katca on 10/21/05 8:11pm
Msg #71802

While I can certainly understand your concern regarding the alleged forgery, here is my view:
1. The docs were returned to the mortgage company from the original notary.
2. Unless all of the docs were back dated, I find it hard to believe that the borrowers didn't sign one doc since in most signing I have done, the borrowers must sign and date the majority of the docs.
3. The docs that were sent to you were allegedly docs the original notary "forgot" to have signed.
4. In the interim the mortgage co. called the borrower to discuss the alleged back dating.

What I don't understand is why the mortgage co. had the docs for "2 months" before it was discovered that some of the docs had not been signed. Further, when the loan didn't fund within a reasonable period of time, why wasn't the borrower on the phone with the mortgage co. finding out why it wasn't funded. You took it upon yourself to draw a conclusion that it was in fact the "notary's" fault and that the "notary" was the one who allegedly back dated the docs when in fact the mortgage co. had the docs in their possession 2 months from the original signing. Unless you are a handwriting expert, I find it hard to believe that you could determine that the notary wrote the initials and not someone else. I think you were wrong when you "off the record" instructed the borrower to call the Sec. of State and contact an attorney. You should have simply completed the signing and left. The "back dating" issue and alleged forged initials was between the borrower and the mortgage co. It is not your place, either on or off the record, to give legal advice to a borrower or for that matter a mortgage company.

Reply by Anonymous on 10/21/05 10:32pm
Msg #71822

YOU REALLY HAVE TO ASK YOURSELF WHAT WOULD THAT NOTARY GAIN IF IT FUNDED BY THE END OF THE MONTH. THEY GET PAID WHEN THE SS PAY THEM. AND ARE THOSE FEW $$ WORTH THEIR LICENSE, I THINK NOT. JUST SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT

Reply by CaliNotary on 10/21/05 11:55pm
Msg #71830

I think you guys are misinterpreting the original post. She's not implying it was the notary that changed the dates and initialled the changes. She's saying that the dates INCLUDING the dates on the notarization were changed and initialled. Sounds like it was done after the docs were received back by the title company or lender.

Reply by B__CA on 10/22/05 12:57am
Msg #71839

I agree with you!

Reply by Nd_WA on 10/22/05 7:06am
Msg #71854

My commission serve two purposes. For signing, it's a business call where the request is made on behalf of the borrowers. Technically, it should be the business hiring entities' responsibility to make their client aware of our requirement and we would only perform the notarial act accordingly. On the other hand, if the request is made by the general public for personal needs then this is my duty to serve as a servant to the public where all possibilities (credible witness at last resort) must be exhaust before I deny such request.

In other words, if having to spend time waiting and searching for credible witness(es) effect the productivity of my business then I can refuse to perform such service until such requirement is met.

Reply by Anonymous on 10/22/05 10:10am
Msg #71877

I posted the original posting.....

The docs were signed by the borrower -- however, were backdated after they were returned to the mortgage company.