Posted by Brenda_NC on 9/28/05 4:00pm
Msg #67857

HELP! Replys needed

I have a signing tomorrow where Mr. Bwr does not have a state or federal issued picture ID. I will need a credible witness. How do I utilize the witness in the signing? I have checked the NC Notary handbook and cannot find an attachment for a jurat or acknowledgment for the credible witness as to the Bwr's Identification. I'm also not sure how to go about using the witness for purpose of identification. TIA!

Reply by NorCalDar on 9/28/05 4:16pm
Msg #67861

You might want to call you Secretary of State's office. In CA, no addtional document is needed however, we need to document the identity of the CW in our journal.

Look at it this way. Insted of having a DL in his wallet, the Borrower reaches in and pulls out 2 credible witnesses. They then reach into their wallets and insted of pulling out a credible witness, give acceptible picture ID. Insted of putting the Borrower's ID info in the journal, the credible witness's ID info goes in the journal.

From the CA notary Handbook:

If identity was established by satisfactory evidence pursuant to Civil Code section 1185,
then the journal shall contain the signature of the credible witness swearing or affirming
to the identity of the individual or the type of identifying document, the governmental
agency issuing the document, the serial or identifying number of the document, and the
date of issue or expiration of the document (e.g. driver’s license, [State] Department of
Motor Vehicles, #X00000, 00/00/00).

Reply by droman_IL on 9/28/05 5:38pm
Msg #67873

You may want to check your State's handbook regarding the definition of credible witness as well. Sometimes a credible witness is defined as a person YOU personally know that ALSO knows the borrower. If that's the case, you might really be in a bind. In either case, agree with NorCalDar that you would record credible witness's info in your journal.

Reply by Brasring_Ca on 9/28/05 10:00pm
Msg #67892

Reading in on this and knowing that someday I might find myself in this situation...... who would then be the person to sign in the journal....... borrower or credible witness(es) or all?

TIA Michelle

Reply by MistarellaFL on 9/28/05 8:55pm
Msg #67886

Be sure to check with the agency that hired you first

When this situation has happened with me, the lender was not okay with credible witnesses.
The brw had to get his own pic id in order to obtain the loan. Credible witnesses were ok for identifying the brw, but the lender was not so easy.

Reply by OnTheGoInFla on 9/28/05 10:38pm
Msg #67903

I have had to use credible witnesses twice and called the state to get confirmation. Since Florida does not require a journal but does require the witnesses to swear to the identity I had to make up a document with a jurat using the wording in the FL law and have the witnesses sign this document. In addition I do keep a journal and had the witnesses (2 required since I did not know them) sign the journal as well. And for those of you who say it's not required in Florida, I know this, It is my choice to keep the journal and as yet I have not had anyone refuse to sign or refuse to give a thumbprint. Like others said, confirm with the state to find out what NC requires.

Reply by NorCalDar on 9/29/05 12:21am
Msg #67908

I cannot speak on Florida law because I know not but in CA, :

California notaries are prohibited from performing any duties which may be construed as
the unlawful practice of law. Among the acts which constitute the practice of law are the
preparation, drafting, or selection or determination of the kind of any legal document, or
giving advice with relation to any legal documents or matters. If asked to perform such tasks,
a California notary public should decline and refer the requester to an attorney.

Reply by Brenda_NC on 9/29/05 5:17am
Msg #67911

I'm going to call my SOS office this morning. Thank you all for your help.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 9/29/05 11:43am
Msg #67936

Brenda
Be aware that the credible witness needs to be known by you.

From the NC notary handbook.


b. Identification by a credible person who is personally known to the notary and
who has personal knowledge of the individual’s identity.