Posted by Jahari Davis on 4/28/06 11:22pm
Msg #116709

EOM Hell!!!!

Hey everyone, I got a question. My stupid @$$ took two eDoc signings for this evening and one didnt happen because I was still printing the docs and the docs for the one that didnt happen totaled 490 pages for two sets of docs. This signing originally started at $125 sight unseen for a 1st and 2nd. Then became $140 before the job was finished printing. Now I have to go to the BO's house at 8AM in the dingdang morning with my friday night blown all to hell. My question is...should I charge more and if so how much more for my time, anguish and printing costs. I am now completely out of paper!!! Grrrrrr..... Your thoughts?

Reply by Anonymous on 4/28/06 11:28pm
Msg #116711

Why such large pkts of prints? Is it a 1st & 2nd?

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/28/06 11:59pm
Msg #116720

Re: EOM Hell!!!! Jahari -

Dear, it's the nature of this business. I, like you, would like to think of myself as one who takes ever opportunity to improve myself. I kid you not, after 2.something years of this, I have become a better person. I have learned a lot. Consider the bricks and mortar added into your character (because you have not choked the living dooky out of someone) to be a small price to pay by having it come at the price of a ream of paper.

I applaud you for not ramming your car into a home or a person. You have grown, cricket.

Seriously...that's the way I come to terms with these events such as you have referenced.

Reply by Joan Bergstrom on 4/29/06 12:24am
Msg #116723

Re: EOM Hell!!!! Jahari -

I had one on Wed. night that was over 400 pages for a 80-20 and when I confirmed with the borrower and said "there are 2 loans to signs" he said he knew nothing about the 2nd loan so I suggested he call his loan officer and clear up the matter as I didn't have the loans emailed to me yet and I couldn't see if it was HELOC or a whatever?

Turned out fine; as his wife had done all the paper work and the dollars they were taking out of the house was great with him.

The huge amount of paper involved in some of these 80 -20 loans is unbelievable!

Reply by Ndwa on 4/29/06 4:19am
Msg #116731

Re: EOM Hell!!!! Jahari -

As "great auntie" Brenda said, the time will come when you'd say hell to that ream of paper. The bread and butter after this is how to capitalize the situation by making the customer feel guilty of expensing your ream of paper.

You reminded of an SS (Eleventh Hour Signing) who still owed me for a ream of paper, a 40 miles round trip, and 45 minutes with the borrowers from Dec'05. The agreed fee was $175, but since BO refused I discounted the fee to $100. They did call a couple more times, only with low fee. Page seems to have a good rep here so I'll let her know on Monday.

Reply by Ilona_OH on 4/29/06 9:02am
Msg #116743

The wonderful life of EOM!It has happened to us all!

I got half way to the signing with a half reqam for each 1st and 2d when the SS called and said the lenders just sent a revised copy. Back home and reprint the pkg. It just happens that way once and awhile.Good for you in the character building department butthen again you may already by a character. This too shall pass!!
Have a good weekend!

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 4/29/06 10:35am
Msg #116764

Re: EOM Hell!!!! Buy paper by the CASE.....ALWAYS.

Plenty of paper and ink on hand 24-7.

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/29/06 12:54pm
Msg #116781

Re: EOM Hell!!!! Buy paper by the CASE.....ALWAYS.

Point well taken.

Reply by Julie/MI on 4/29/06 12:19pm
Msg #116774

Please tell me I misread

Jahari are you saying you were accepting $125 for a first and a second with edocs?

Shame on you! At a very minimum $150 for the first and & $75 for the second for a minimum of $225. It's people like you who squash all the fees that veteran notaries have hammered out.

You ran out of paper? The core of your business!!! Unbelievable!!

I don't even feel one bit sorry. I know you have read the boards and talked with fellow Michigan notaries. If this is what is coming from your meetings, I think I will decline.

I don't even feel one bit sorry for you. You made the commitment now you need to be a professional and not whine about the mistakes you made. Use this as a learning experience and quit selling yourself and the other veterans in this business short.

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/29/06 12:53pm
Msg #116780

Re: Please tell me I misread - Julie, You are right...

about fees...but this is the kind of comment that people say is bashing and which generates a big long thread that evolves into the crap people say they have to wade through. I don't feel this is bashing but a big dog teaching the younger one approach.

I experienced it, but when I applied it I felt as if more experienced ones said I was being a problem. And, even that I was getting too big for my britches.

Actually, it seems each of us have our buttons...mine is that notaries need to read their notary rules before they go out and start notarizing. I also hope all will charge enough to keep us in business.

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 4/29/06 1:56pm
Msg #116787

Re: Please tell me I misread - Julie, You are right...

Julie's comment is extremely well stated, maybe strong in expression but I must admit she is right on all points. My thoughts are, why bother even making the point, it's been said on this board many times.....the folks that need to hear this won't have a clue. Business, it's called being prepared in advance and it's not up to anyone to teach another unless they ask for assistance at the point the above notary was, he should have known better, who to blame.....only himself.
Heck I even plan my notary work schedule as to whether accepting calls in the winter by the weather report, if four days from now we are expected a foot of snow at 6500 feet, I'm not taking any signings in Big Bear or Running Springs, I will do Lake Arrowhead depending on the time the storm is expected. Also if it's a large snowfall I let the service know we are expecting a storm and there is the possibility the docs won't go down the mountain. Another words a notary's mind must always be working and planning your are dealing with others people's STUFF.....If as a notary you can't take the call ot perform the work let another notary have it, it's that simple.

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/29/06 2:49pm
Msg #116792

Re: Please tell me I misread - Julie, You are right...

**the folks that need to hear this won't have a clue.**

Truer words were never spoken. Hmmm...now, if I needed to hear this, I won't have a clue...LOL. And, as they are so true, I guess that means I shall carry on as if I never heard them. But, I do say good contributing point, Susan.

Reply by Linda_in_MI on 4/30/06 7:17am
Msg #116830

Re: Please tell me I misread

OK, maybe a rookie-type error because of mistep in planning and not having supplies. Hasn't there been one time in all our NSA careers where we ran out of some type of supply, but learned from the mistake?

Where I really have issues, Julie, is with your statement "I don't even feel one bit sorry. I know you have read the boards and talked with fellow Michigan notaries. If this is what is coming from your meetings, I think I will decline." Your signing experience outweighs mine, Julie, but I would encourage you not to pre-judge until you have experienced the meetings. I don't know if you were at the very first meeting in Detroit, but I do know you weren't at the meeting in Lansing. Out of the 15 Michigan notaries who originally said they would come, only 6 showed up. Maybe a signing came up for the other 9, but we don't know as the no-shows didn't have the professional courtesy to notify the meeting coordinator.

The knowledge that was shared and the mentoring that took place was awesome. The discussion that started with lunch at 11:30 was still going strong some 3 hours later. Those who had appointments left, but others who were able to stay continued discussions about everything from working in real estate to dealing with specific signings to experiences with marketing. With what I came away from out of that meeting, it was well worth the drive and the time spent.

Reply by Jahari Davis on 4/30/06 12:45pm
Msg #116850

Re: Please tell me I misread

Julie, if you want to want to feel sorry for me thats fine with me. I never asked you to. This is a learning experience for me and I will chalk it up as such. These packets for this signing were huge and definately worth a much higher fee. Had I known the loan packages had this much paper I certainly would have quoted a much higher fee. The SS I dealt with on this signing has been great and they were shocked at the amount of paper and were willing to renegotiate the fee. I went to the signing at 8am Saturday morning and after about 2 1/2 hours of signing one packet and starting into the second packet they decided not to go through with the closing because of deceptive language and lending practices by the lender. Everything has now gone into recision and the no-sign docs have been sent back. Again, this is a learning experience and I will deal with this accordingly as this is my first "no-sign" closing. I will be talking about this with the SS and will work come to an agreement on my fee for this no-sign.

As to the fellowship with other Michigan Notaries, if you decline to attend and meet with us, that is your call to make. Just know that a very strong group is growing and will continue to do so with or without you. If you wish to join us we welcome you. If you dont wish to, then I ask that you show us the respect and professional courtesy we would no doubt show you by restraining yourself from attacking us. You may be a veteran notary but that does not give you license to attack others especially in an open forum such as this. I wish you nothing but success in your business and hope that you and others reading this thread especially the new notaries learn from my experience if they've never had something like this happen.

That said....enjoy your days and nights!!!

Reply by SarahBeth_CA on 4/30/06 1:16pm
Msg #116857

Please don't attack... waaaaaaaaa

Jahari what Julie said was out of rightous indignation. It definately was in no way an attack. If you feel attacked you've got some gromwing up to do. But I'll tell you what I do think Julie should go to your meetings and bring up a discussion of appropriate fees for a Profitable business.

As far as the fee goes the issue wasn't extra printing fees. It was that your fee was too low to begin with. You basically got rear ended on it. When you accept being rear ended it enboldens ss's to continue to try and rear end others that understand what you must charge in order to have a Profitable business and not just a little extra money on the side. Did you even realize that the original fee (without the extra large packages) was rediculously low and completely unacceptable. We get so up in arms about low fees from ss that have lowballed each other to the point where they won't offer an acceptable fee that we don't always remember that the notary that accepts that fee that does as much damage to industry as the ss.

Reply by Jahari Davis on 4/30/06 2:25pm
Msg #116871

Re: Please don't attack... waaaaaaaaa

*sigh* Julie's post may not have been an intentional attack, but it came off like one attacking myself, my intelligence, my business practices, and my fellow notaries in the Michigan group that meets. Now you feel the need to tell me that I have some growing up to do? I will give you the credit due you for the item in your posting stating that Julie should attend our meetings and bring up discussion of appropriate fees for a profitable business. I want to make something clear though. We discussed fees at length at our last meeting so the issue of fees has not been lost on us. Everyone that was there can tell you that I asked about fees and what I could charge in-line with the notary laws and staying competitive in my area. If you or Julie have something to add on this subject you are both more than welcome to join us. The more info shared the better. If we're charging lower than we should then we can learn from Julie and yourself. Consider that.

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/30/06 4:30pm
Msg #116889

Re: Please don't attack... waaaaaaaaa Jahari - not just you

but to all folks...

I know this is a tired old subject but it was brought to my attention and it opened my eyes...make of it what you will.

http://www.usdoj.gov/atr/public/guidelines/pfbrprimer.pdf

Reply by Sign/SealCO on 4/30/06 1:41pm
Msg #116863

Re:$125-$140 for 1st and 2nd

it sounds like you are charging according to the size of the package(s).with e-docs and not knowing the size of the package, I don't see how this practice can be quoted effectively.the size of the package and printing aside, I would never accept a 1st AND 2nd for $125.