Posted by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 9:08am
Msg #165353

No ID's = NO FEE, PERIOD!

This was not stated on the confirmation, but on a cover sheet included with the docs. I found this interesting in light of a recent thread on getting a copy of the borrowers ID. Sure sounds like it gives me an interest in the loan! I wonder if you got a note signed by the BO that you did request they have copies of ID's at closing and they forgot, and made a copy of the note to send back with the docs what they would say? Wonder what the judge would say when you had to sue them to collect the fee.
I'm thinking maybe, even with the ID's put in the pkg, I would line thru and initial that statement and write in "unacceptable terms, not idisclosed in original agreement".
Any thoughts?

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 9:09am
Msg #165354

disclosed not idisclosed...sorry :) n/m

Reply by TRG_wy on 12/12/06 9:58am
Msg #165360

If I'm understanding correctly, they've attached a cover sheet to the package stating that if photocopy of ID is not returned with docs you do not get paid?

First, if your confrimation did not disclose this fact so you forwarn the BO to have a copy at the table it isn't your fault. Some lenders may require it some may not. Some states may prohibit it.

Secondly, if it pops up with the docs and the BO don't have a copy at the closing I'd call the TC or LO and explain. If they give the go ahead to sign make sure to attach a note with their name and authorization to close.

Third, this is my route - I have a printed form that explains that photocopy of ID was not available at closing but was viewed and recorded (in my journal) by the notary. Wyoming is a very rural state, only 500,000 people in the whole state, and it is often a long distance to a copy machine.

Reply by Gary_CA on 12/12/06 10:02am
Msg #165361

Ah come on Bonnie...

yeah it might be a PITA, but making a specific act required at the signing in no way no how give you a financial interest in the loan.

Gimme a break... it's a client describing a required result... exactly what makes you an independent contractor.

What's the big deal? Ask the BO what ID they have on the confirmation call, if the ID doesn't work, don't go.

No problem.

There's a whole list of things unspoken that = NO FEE. No stamped DOT, no fee... right?

I understand though... I got a confirmation with a bunch of "forfiet fees" or $15 reduced fee if.... blah blah on it too... pissed me off.

But mostly it's the rude way they put it, the requirements aren't so crazy... well usually

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 10:25am
Msg #165366

LOL! Gary...

This isn't really an issue for me as I carry a portable copier. But for those that don't or those very rural closings and for the comments on the recent thread about getting copies of the id, it could be.
You can't force the BO to have a copy of thier ID at closing for you to send back with the pkg. (I'm not sure if you misunderstood, the type of ID isn't an issue, the photocopy of the ID is what this company is talking about), you can tell them when you call, but if they "forget" or just don't want to make a copy of it, then the notary is penalized? I've had some borrowers that get extremely upset about wanting a copy of the ID to send back with the package. Why? I have no clue...just the way they are I suppose! Even after I explain to them that it is needed by the lender so the lender themselves can verify ID. It's weird.
If I screw up a loan, I am more than willing to fix it, everyone makes mistakes occasionally, but to print docs, make sure everything is signed and sealed correctly, make the trip to the borrowers, spend the necessary time etc and then get $0.00 for all of that because the borrower did not want to send copies of thier ID?
But, like I said, I have a portable copier, about the size of a briefcase, and has a handle so it can be carried, it's not really an issue for me, UNLESS the BO refuses to let me copy it, then it becomes an issue.

Reply by Gary_CA on 12/12/06 10:30am
Msg #165367

Fair enough...

if the borrower refuses, yeah... and I'd at least expect a trip fee.

But we all should be able to take a picture at least... just part of the job. And apparently and important part for some.

You'd think the statement of a sworn officer of the state that the id was good would be superior to a loan processor's glance at a copy of the id, but apparently not.

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 10:34am
Msg #165368

You are right...

I thought that was one of the reasons Notaries came into exisistance to begin with, to verify the identity of a signer. Guess the "job description" has changed, huh? LOL!
Have a good one!

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/12/06 10:50am
Msg #165370

Re: Bonnie - just a quick off-topic question...

What kind of portable copier do you carry? I'm shopping around for one and not sure which way to go..TIA

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 11:01am
Msg #165371

Re: Bonnie - just a quick off-topic question...

I use the Canon PC170. I love it! It's easy to carry, the ink is inexpensive, and it makes great copies of the ID's. (I've also had BO's ask if I would mind copying various things that they just hadn't had a chance to get a copy of). It has also come in handy for copying various items that the lender asked for, such as the insurance declaration page, etc. It's paid for itself twice over!

Reply by ZeeCA on 12/12/06 11:06am
Msg #165374

Re: Bonnie - just a quick off-topic question...

i googled it and found it to be 99-113$ is it really that inexpensive?

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 11:35am
Msg #165385

Zee...

Yes! I got mine for $99. Well worth the price IMO!

Reply by ZeeCA on 12/12/06 12:55pm
Msg #165403

Re: Zee... THX BONNIE! n/m

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 1:05pm
Msg #165411

Re: Zee... You're welcome! n/m

Reply by hcampersFL on 12/12/06 1:09pm
Msg #165414

Re: Zee...

I think Office Depot has it for $79 right now and I have a coupon for $10 off this week. Email me and I will send it to you.

Reply by ZeeCA on 12/12/06 2:07pm
Msg #165429

Re: Zee...

will do! thx
so frustrating when I get the O/N package as I am leaving (TC uses a cheaper service that does not guarantee timely delivery) and they send 1 RTC .... would be so handy!

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/12/06 11:29am
Msg #165383

Re: Thanks Bonnie!! n/m

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 11:39am
Msg #165388

You're welcome Linda! n/m

Reply by Nancy Korb on 12/12/06 2:30pm
Msg #165434

Re: LOL! Gary...

Are we not required to carry errors and omissions insurance? If I accept a signing, I expect that the entire contract is what we agree to on the phone and what I'm told up front. I don't understand "a whole list of reasons why we won't get paid." A contract is a meeting between two minds...an agreement. If that agreement is changed somehow, without the knowledge and consent of the other, I think that's illegal. I'm not an attorney, but that's my understanding from Business Law.

Reply by hcampersFL on 12/12/06 11:06am
Msg #165373

Re: Ah come on Bonnie...

Gary I can't tell you the number of times I have told the Br during our first call to confirm the appt. that I will need a copy of id to send back with the package. 60 % of the time they don't have copies. Always excuses. I have my digital camera for just these occasions. Problem solved. Bonnie's issue is that it isn't our responsibility and we shouldn't get our fee docked for it.

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 11:37am
Msg #165386

Re: Ah come on Bonnie...

Exactly right! I don't know why it's so hard for some BO's. And 1/2 the time they were also told by the LO to have copies ready.

Reply by Cassandra Andrews on 12/12/06 12:20pm
Msg #165398

if getting a copy of the borrower's id requires that they produce a copy for us to include that's one thing (if we forget to tell them - our fault) but if getting a copy requires something ADDITIONAL on our part, i.e. carry more equipment such as a portable copier, digital camera and then downloading pic to print or send, shouldn't we charge for that? if that's disclosed up front, fine - then we can negotiate the fee, but if not????

perhaps we should discuss all of those things at the time we receive the call. and ask what they expect for a certain fee in addition to confirming w/borrower, printing the docs, performing notarization, courier, etc. when contractors are asked to perform xtra tasks, an addendum (rider) to the agrmnt is called for.

any thoughts???

Reply by CaliNotary on 12/12/06 12:53pm
Msg #165402

I would call the company and tell them that whether the borrower has made a copy of his ID or not is an issue that is out of your control, and due to this clause you're no longer willing to do the signing and they can send someone to pick up the docs from you.

I'd be willing to wager that they'll change their tune pretty quickly, just make sure you get a confirmation in writing that you'll get your fee whether or not the borrower has provided ID.

We need to start throwing this type of crap back in their faces and let them deal with the consequences of their stupid rules, instead of us dealing with it by having to fight to be paid.

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 1:13pm
Msg #165416

Crap is right Cali....

there were a few other things in the "surprise" doc on the top of the loan docs, such as, Notary must pull apart the pkg and stack it in EXACTLY this order...or no pay, homeowners inurance form MUST be filled out or NO PAY....etc. Not reduced pay, but flat out no pay! I wonder if they ever stop to think that MAYBE if they wouldn't try to lowball fees, and hire the cheapest notary they could find, (like the one charging 40.00 for edocs), then some of the notary headaches they have would go away!
Thanks for your input Cali...

Reply by CaliNotary on 12/12/06 1:23pm
Msg #165422

Re: Crap is right Cali....

It's just ridiculous isn't it. Some companies just aren't worth the hassle, no matter how good their fees might be.

It sounds to me like these people are looking for ANY excuse to get out of paying you for your services. I wouldn't even even approach the ID copy issue with them, I'd just call them and tell them that their terms are completely unacceptable and completely ridiculous and ask them whether you should send the docs back to them or whether they want to have someone come pick them up from you.

Reply by Bonnie_CO on 12/12/06 1:33pm
Msg #165424

Re: Crap is right Cali....

That was kind of what I suspected after reading the bs doc. Don't believe I'll be doing this one, or any future one for them, just not worth the hassle!
Thanks for your thoughts!

Reply by Carolyn Bodley on 12/12/06 3:30pm
Msg #165441

Re: Crap is right Cali....

Bonnie,
The way I look at it is that we are dealing with adults. I tell them in my initial call that I will need copies of their driver's licenses. If they balk and tell me they don't know how they will get a copy, I advise that grocery stores have photocopiers.

I don't call to remind them of the driver's license copy(ies). When I show up and they don't have copies, that's their problem. I'm not going to drag my digital camera with me to take photos of something they knew in advance they needed. Both my phone and palm pilot have the ability to take photos -- again, it's not my problem - and with identity theft issues and privacy issues, I don't want a copy of their driver's license on my camera, palm pilot, phone -- and I refuse to begin dragging a portable copier with me.

I've had BOs take their driver's licenses next door to a neighbor (or a family member) to run to the store and copy while we continue with the signing, but I'm not going to hold up the signing waiting for them to do something they knew about before my arrival.

Reply by Nancy Korb on 12/12/06 2:25pm
Msg #165431

I had an interesting experience yesterday. Got a call for a signing. Everything was computerized. I entered the new time that the client wanted for his signing on the website, etc. Everything went well in the signing. Got home, instructions said to close the file, and when I went to close the file, which I had to do if I wanted to be paid, I had to agree that if I made an error, I would NOT be paid at all. However, I would be required to return to the client for corrections.

None of this was made known to me BEFORE the signing. If I wanted to be paid, I had to close the file, and they can arbitrarily decide that I've made an error and keep my money according to this NEW contract, created AFTER the signing. I don't think it's even legal.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 12/12/06 9:46pm
Msg #165482

I think this is just as outrageous as the example Bonnie CO provided. Sounds like extortion to me, and I won't tolerate it. I think I've run into that before and decided not to reply to the website. Instead, I sent them an email providing all the info they requested and advised that I did not agree with their terms which weren't disclosed in advance. I also followed up with a phone call the next day, just in case. That was a long time ago, so I not even really sure who it was, but I don't remember any negative repercussions. With those kinds of tactics, I wouldn't care if they never called me again.

My reaction to Bonnie Co's situation is the same as Cali's. If they want to play those stupid games, let them go find someone else. We have no control over what the borrower does or does not do, regardless of what we tell them. I guarantee my work and IF they can prove to me I made a mistake, I will go to any length possible to get it corrected as fast as possible, but I expect to get paid the full agreed upon fee if I do my job right. All too frequently, I find myself in a situation where I'm dealing with someone else's errors.

Maybe we should ask them if we get to charge THEM extra if someone else messes up and we are left to deal with it... Just kidding, of course, but it makes you think!

Reply by sue_pa on 12/12/06 10:28pm
Msg #165492

...Maybe we should ask them if we get to charge THEM extra if someone else messes up and we are left to deal with it... Just kidding, of course, but it makes you think!...

If I could charge, I would long be retired as a millionaire due to the mistakes I've seen the past few years in this business.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 12/13/06 1:45am
Msg #165531

LOL!! I don't doubt it!! I don't think I'd be quite in the millionaire category yet, but I'd certainly be much closer to retirement than I am right now!! ;>

Reply by David Kral on 12/12/06 2:25pm
Msg #165432

Camera Phone

1) Get a camera phone. It takes pictures of IDs just fine. You can print them at home.

2) Carry identity verification affidavit stating borrowers did not have copy if ids available. Copy down the info, have them sign, notarize.

3) Use an id affidavit that you fill out and sign(you can't notarize your own signature so I like option 2 over option 3).

Plan for it and do what it takes to get the job done. Stop trying to make life difficult.
Be a pro!