Posted by MikeC/NY on 12/31/06 11:15am
Msg #168470

Question on journal entries

I recently started using the journal sold here, and like the ability to identify all the docs on one line per signature.

For those who use the "MoJo", I'm curious about the most efficient way of entering which docs have been notarized - do you review the docs beforehand and check them off before you get to the table, check them off as they're signed, check them off as you review the package to make sure you haven't missed anything, make notes at the table and check them off later, or...?

Reply by Signing_Doc on 12/31/06 11:25am
Msg #168476

I always review the docs at home, before sending them off (a final check). At this time, I have my MoJo open and tic off the docs which I've notarized. If I have time before hand to preview the docs, I tic them off then, but you always have the possibility that the signing will not go off as planned, then you will have 'burned' that line and can't reuse it. I have also tried to tic them off at the table as they are notarized, but sometimes you don't have the time to do that either, so the best solution IMHO is to have them sign the journal, take all information required by your state then and there, put the book away. Go home, grab a cold one (Pepsi please), or a steaming cup of hot chocolate (laced with either candy canes or red hots)...place this cup WELL AWAY from the docs and update your book them. As always, my disclaimer...."I'm not a doctor...but I've seen one played on TV"

"Doc" Stuart (still krazy after all these years!)

Reply by Calnotary on 12/31/06 12:01pm
Msg #168480

I record everything I have notarized at home after the usual triple check of docs.
One more thing when I have a 1st and 2nd I have them sign twice my book so I have more space to record every single doc notarized.

Reply by Bruce_CA on 12/31/06 3:00pm
Msg #168500

Re: Question on journal entries - Is that even legal to do?

I would think that this would be illegal!!??

The clients need to sign that you have performed those tasks. This IS after all a public RECORD. Modifing (which is what you are doing) AFTER they sign would be like modifing a contract (in my eyes, maybe not the courts...)

Also, what happens if you mess up and check the wrong item or some silly thing like that, and you need to void out the line?

I thought it was a requirement to make the enties as you notaried (I could not find that in the code, so I guess I am wrong on that), but for me, I don't see any reason to even chance it!

What I usually do is to make the journal enties at the table, but when they are filling out some other form that takes a little bit of time (Statement of Idenity or something). I will usually -if I have a chance to- put one of these forms at the end of the package before hand, or while going though the package, if I come on to a form that will take a few moments, I will say "I'll put this to the end for right now'

I feel that this sould be done at the table.

I am new(er), and want to learn GOOD habits!

Just my $.02
Bruce

Reply by CA/Notary on 12/31/06 12:02pm
Msg #168481

I use the MOJO, but I use one entry for each document, that way I can enter the date of the document, not all are the same, example you may be signing a set of docs that are dated 12-30-06, some docs don't have a date from the lender, but the borrower is to date it and the date on it would be 12-31-06, other will not have a date at all. I also enter the time it was notarized, CA requirement , I show the time each doc was notarized. I do all my entries in the journal at the time of the signing and fill out all the certificates at that time, I also generally have time to check the docs 3 times for errors while sitting at the table with the borrower. Each signing generally takes 45 minutes to one hour and I'm done. It is good to get in the habit of completing everything at that time.

Reply by CaliNotary on 12/31/06 12:14pm
Msg #168484

If there is a document with a different date from the rest

I simply make a note in the notes section stating what the date is. I don't see the point of using the MoJo if you're going to use separate entry for each notarized document.

And I do everything at the table. When I leave the signing the only thing left to do is drop the docs and send my invoice.

Efficiency is the key to a successful business.

Reply by Calnotary on 12/31/06 12:18pm
Msg #168485

Re: If there is a document with a different date from the re

I do all notarizations in front of the borrower, what I do at home is just the recording of what docs were notarized.

Reply by CaliNotary on 12/31/06 12:33pm
Msg #168486

Why?

It's not like it's a time consuming chore to check off the boxes in the MoJo at the table. And I can't imagine not having time to do it on most signings where there are about 4 or 5 notarized documents to complete and record in the 45 minutes that it takes to do the signing.

What are you people doing during the signings that doesn't leave you with the time do complete something so simple? I truly don't get it.

Reply by Signing_Doc on 12/31/06 12:41pm
Msg #168487

Re: What are you people doing during the signings that doesn

What I'm doing is taking care of the borrower and THEIR need for speed. Last weekend, I did a 1st and 2nd for a husband/wife team of investors. This was their fifth investment property and they were well aware of what to sign, where to sign and why to sign. (She was a Real Estate Agent/Loan Officer). The wife was in a hurry to catch a plane out of town (thus the need for my services) and we needed to vacate the office we were using for the other agents to close. So in answer to your question, some times there is NOT enuff time to complete the "small" details (filling out the MoJo completely). I do complete all Notary info on the spot with the borrowers present (stamp, date, sign, print my name etc). I do a double check THERE with the borrowers. BUT, at MY leisure, I fill out the rest of the MoJo at home IF I need to. Yes, it's a "time management" business, but it's also taking care of the borrowers (customers)

"Doc"

Reply by CaliNotary on 12/31/06 12:47pm
Msg #168488

Re: What are you people doing during the signings that doesn

Yeah, but you're giving me an example of a situation that is an exception to the norm. Which obviously isn't the question I was asking.

You know as well as I do that most of our signings go at about the same pace and take about the same amount of time. So during those signings that take about 45 minutes and have an average number of notarizations, what are people doing at the table that doesn't afford them the extra 2 minutes they need to put their entries in the journal?

Reply by Julie/MI on 12/31/06 1:35pm
Msg #168493

Re: What are you people doing during the signings that doesn

Cali, you would just faint, I only use tally marks for the number of notarizations for tax purposes. Way back I used a line for every notarzied doc, but now I just use tally marks.

Thankfully, I live in MIchigan and don't even have to use a journal unless I want to. It's really only a record keeping book for me.

Reply by ananotary on 12/31/06 4:39pm
Msg #168507

Totally agree Calinotary....

It only takes a second to check the box or write in your notes section if necessary. That is not the part of the process that is time consuming. I don't understand why people check their work 3-4 times at the table and then again before they send out docs. I have enough confidence that I only check once at the table and ship docs out. What is the big deal? I have not had anything come back since I was a newbie over three years ago. Cali you make a fantastic point by pointing out the time vs. money. I for one want to spend all that extra time doing more signings and making more money.

Reply by CA/Notary on 12/31/06 4:53pm
Msg #168509

Re: Totally agree Calinotary....

I recheck at the table as it gives me something to do as the borrower is either reading or signging docs.

Reply by Andrea Ciardo on 12/31/06 5:33pm
Msg #168513

I fil out my journal before I go to the apt if possible. That way I know what has been notarized for tax purposes as well as for record keeping. At the signing , they sign, I fill out address info, take a thumbprint and off we go.

Reply by ananotary on 12/31/06 7:24pm
Msg #168521

Re: Question on journal entries...But Why the extra step?

Record keeping is the point of the journal. Why do you fill it out ahead of time and not at the table? You would get the same result ie: the record for tax purposes as well as record keeping.

Reply by MelissaCT on 12/31/06 9:07pm
Msg #168526

What if the signing is halted or cancels at the last minute? You're wasting time & (journal) space.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 1/1/07 7:52am
Msg #168568

Thanks for all your replies. After reading through the thread, it seems to me that the best way to handle it would be to check them off as they're signed if possible (I've had a couple of signings where there was barely enough room on the table for the docs), or else during that final review at the table before leaving, which is where I expect to catch any missed sigs or initials. The only time I go through the docs after leaving the table now is if I have to do fax-backs.

As far as burning a line in the journal if the signing halts, I would personally prefer to have a record of a partial signing or a flat out no-sign than to have no record at all. I'm still going to claim the mileage deduction and hopefully collect at least half of the fee, so that keeps all my records in synch. Journals are not required in NY, so there is no legal requirements to be concerned about as far as that goes.

I saw that someone mentioned that they don't fill out the journal at all until the end of the signing. I personally would not do it that way - for one thing, what if you get through the whole thing and then they refuse to sign the journal? I see the journal as a way of setting the tone for the signing and establishing ID; after collecting and recording ID information and getting a sig in the journal, the first document I present in the package is the Name/Signature affidavit. If someone balked at any of those, it would raise some serious questions in my mind about the possibility of fraud.

Thanks for all your insights - hope everyone has a successful 2007!