Posted by notarybycony on 12/18/06 4:01pm
Msg #166529

confused...help!

i did a signning last week and I check all my paper works and had not find any issues or missed area for signing prior to mailing. today I got a call from SS stated the Grand Deed was not signed. I was perplexted and when I call the Escrow company, they gave me a whole list of items stating that it was not and sign and insisted I should not date it when I bring it back BO today.
should I date and I was sure I check everything before I send, what should I do?

Reply by John_NorCal on 12/18/06 4:04pm
Msg #166530

You have to date it for the day that it is actually signed, anything else is back dating. Did you have them fax you the deed to check it over for yourself? Maybe they made a mistake and want to pin it on. You never know.

Reply by notarybycony on 12/18/06 4:09pm
Msg #166531

nope they had call me a few hours ago and still no deed in fax nor by email.

Reply by Larry/Ca on 12/18/06 4:22pm
Msg #166534

Was there a Grant Deed ......

in the package? Was it entered in your journal? Perhaps THEY forgot it and now need one signed. Sounds like a trip fee if you can somehow prove it wasn't in the package.

Larry

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/18/06 4:38pm
Msg #166536

Re: Question occurs to me since I'm not familiar with CA law

Can the Grant Deed be dated AFTER the mortgage or do they have to be "of even date"...thereby requiring a whole new signing...

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/18/06 4:50pm
Msg #166541

Re: Or the Grand Deed IS your mortgage... n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/18/06 4:50pm
Msg #166542

Re: Or the Grant Deed IS your mortgage... n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 12/18/06 5:51pm
Msg #166548

Re: I apologize for the above 2 posts - *I* was confused

Confusing Grant Deed and Deed of Trust (glad I gave the disclaimer of not being familiar with CA law) - anyway - it leads back to the question "Can the Grant Deed be dated after the Mortgage/Deed of Trust...just curious now..

Reply by notarybycony on 12/19/06 10:50am
Msg #166702

Re: Was there a Grant Deed ......

it was in the package and I and the BO both confirm that it was signed on my last visit and comes to find out the escrow had updated the change of name of BO and needed to have it resign.

Reply by ZeeCA on 12/18/06 4:45pm
Msg #166539

i had a funny situation where I notarized a stack of docs and missed a signature as they had the signature line that was very feint and just a piece of it buried in my notarization area...it taught me to look at things differently. I mean why would the b/o sign my notarization area? it was a strange one the t/c understood it was THEIR error as the signature line should have been above and they had me resign the one page. Since it was 3 blocks I said np, n/c as I value their business and it ws not a hardship on me and it happens

Reply by hcampersFL on 12/18/06 6:01pm
Msg #166549

I think you need to have them send you copies of the Documents that you missed. You said that you checked everything before sending it out, now they want you to go back and have it resigned with no dates? VERY fishy in my opinion. Please make sure they aren't taking advantage of you.

Reply by Joe Ewing on 12/18/06 6:05pm
Msg #166551

Cony english is your second language right? I understand and you did get your message across. Grant Deeds are used to change things like names or the spelling of and transfering title of property. Trustees transfer title back to themselves with a grant deed, refinance the property with a deed of trust then transfer the property back into the trust with another grant deed. All done at the same time and date. But you cannot sign and notarize a deed of trust on tuesday as owner and then grant the property to yourself with a grant deed notarized on wednesday.

LOOKS TO ME like the SS and title company fked up and want you to notarize several false crertificates to be attached to the transfer of real property. Look that one up in your California notary Handbook under Felony.

Reply by hcampersFL on 12/18/06 6:06pm
Msg #166552

Joe I thought that myself. They are trying to pull a fast one.

Reply by TitleGalCA on 12/18/06 6:48pm
Msg #166557

Cony, first - please know that it is a Grant Deed, not a Grand Deed. The language is important. I admire anyone that can speak more than one language but even if english is not your native, in this business - it's important.

Grant = to convey. A grant deed conveys real property.

Second, I agree with the others...someone is pulling a fast one on you. If the document was in the original package, you would have noted it in your journal.

Third, you are not concerned with the dated date of the document. The only "date" you need to concern yourself with is the acknowledgment date. In a perfect world the dated date of the grant deed and the deed of trust will be the same, but it's not your problem. If the lender or escrow messed up the dates, you are due a trip fee if you go back to notarize the grant deed.

Reply by cara on 12/18/06 9:24pm
Msg #166594

I agree that the only date you should concern yourself with is the date the document is acknowedged by the signor in your presence. Remember, a person can acknowledge a document s/he signed years earlier.The date they acknowledged their signiture is the date you fill in the acknowledgement. And, of course, you should refuse to notarize any document with blank dates.

Techincally in a note and deed are signed before a deed of trust. The note is the debt and the deed of trust is the security for payment of the note. The borrower/owner needs to have a legal interest in the property before s/he can validly offer it as security for the loan. The deed is the transfer of the property and the deed of trust is the mortgage or security interest giving the lender the right to foreclose on the property if the note is not paid. These of course are legal matters and should not be of concern to a notary. All we do is notarize signitures.

I have too have had experiences where I have been told that I missed a notarization when I know that I did not. My journal showed an entry indicating I had gotten the doc signed. When I was faxed a new document, I noticed that some of the terms had been changed by the TC or lender and concluded that they wanted me to correct their error on my dime (without getting paid a trip fee). Since I did not keep copies of the document in question (it had been FedExed) I could not prove the slimy ruse and got a new signiture without getting a trip fee. My only recourse was to avoid that SS.

If the docs were e-docs, then you would have proof that a document was or was not in the package. If they were mailed, you would not have proof, unless you kept a copy of a list of docs included in the package.

I hope this helps. Hang in there.

Reply by notarybycony on 12/19/06 11:16am
Msg #166706

thank you

thank you all for your input and support, I had went back and resign the "Grant Deed". It was not that I had missed signing the Grant deed; it was a change of name for the BO. I'm glad I was not hallucinate/delusional. BO remembers signing it and I keep e-copy of the doc. But I did not request to have a trip fee due to I was not far from BO, consider it a holiday gift to the SS. All the info is very helpful.

Have a happy holiday.
And I’ll remember to check my spelling prior to posting.

Reply by hcampersFL on 12/19/06 11:24am
Msg #166707

Re: thank you

While I admire your generosity to the SS, please be aware that they are more than likely going to charge the Title company for your trip whether you charge them or not.
Don't sell yourself short.
Learn your value!

Reply by MelissaCT on 12/20/06 11:47am
Msg #166913

Cara, in that case, have the borrower(s) pull out their copy

of the document. That should be the "proof" that the document was, in fact, changed and not simply "missed.