Posted by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 12:01pm
Msg #95469

I'd like to push SOS's....

To require a Title Producer's license in every state....require continuing education, and require some sort of training to be NSA.

At the very least the Title Producer's license will start to limit the # of new NSA's thinking this is a get rich quick scheme because of the fees involved.

I'd think TC's and SS's would be supportive, simply because you'd have more educated NSA's, and less errors.... might make fee's go up.... who knows?

Reply by Charm_AL on 2/8/06 12:05pm
Msg #95472

I don't feel I need a producers lic and continuing education to do this job. I think a mandatory NSA skills test is more appropriate to do loan signings. Knowing the docs is key.

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 12:10pm
Msg #95485

I agree 100%, I also don't fee I need a producer's license for this job, however; I feel that by requiring those items, it would in turn eliminate a lot of the bad new notaries. The people that get their stamp and cert, and just immediately attempt to close loans.

Regulate our industry, I think its time that an NSA is viewed different that the normal Notary down at the bank.

Reply by Becca_FL on 2/8/06 12:11pm
Msg #95486

Re: I'd like to push SOS's....Shane

I wouldn't mind seeing TPL (or in FL TEL) as a necessary qualification to do closings. However, many Notaries are not NSAs and I doubt we'll ever see an across the board stipulation between Notary and NSA.

I am going to get my Title Examiners License here in Florida, but for other reasons.

Reply by Charles_Ca on 2/8/06 12:45pm
Msg #95505

Why is it that we need the government to step in and

add more regulations to our lives. There is a much simpler solution and that is to organize ourselves so that we are a major force in the industry. Right now notaries are fragmented and can be pushed around by a bunch of signing services who have nothing at stake. If you're going to try and regulate any one it should be the SS. Notaries are already licensed. why not license SS to at least the same minimum standards as notaries? Why not make sure that SS licenses require that the y pay on time and set up a regulatory process to do make sure that SS make timely payments to commissioned public servants who are actually deputies of the SOS. Why put additional regulatory burdens on the notaries, make the test harder but don't regulate unnecessarily. What is a notary going to do with a Title Producers Lic??? Besides there are probably wel organized groups that would vigorously oppose such a proposal!

Reply by MistarellaFL on 2/8/06 1:29pm
Msg #95528

I like your attitude Charles! I am in complete agreement.

As notaries, we are already regulated by the SOS. The ones who aren't are the SS. Which probably puts them in the same catagory that telemarketers were a few years ago.

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 1:37pm
Msg #95532

We are regulated?

Other than our notary capacity, how exactly are we regulated? what exactly are the penalties for not notarizing a document correctly, and costing someone their rate lock? or their loan not to fund?

Are state SOS's stripping incompetant notaries of their commission? if so, it would be the first I've heard of it.

The facts remain that our industry is more and more being flooded with inexperienced, uneducated notaries, and it is HURTING us, rather than helping us.

At the very least, the states should limit the # of notaries they produce.

Reply by Charles_Ca on 2/8/06 1:42pm
Msg #95535

I don't know about Ohio but in California we ceratainly are

On of the problems is that the documents that don't need to be notarized are of no consequence to the government. The notary is set up to notarize documents and that is an SOS function but the loan documents are a private enterpirse function, unless there is a great abuse of the documents that aren't notarized there is eally no reason to invoke the police powers of the State. Perhaps you should consider going after the TC's and getting them tocertify the SS and the Notaries I think you wold have a better chance of getting that accomplished. Believe me I am not defending the state of the business: the NSA business is a mess and there is no voice for the NSA's.

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 1:47pm
Msg #95537

We've talked about organizing....

I think along with the organizing, this is the next logical step.

You can have all the organization in the world, but you've got to have something to lobby for.
Otherwise, you are group of people doing nothing to change the business, other than talking about everything that is wrong about it.

Reply by srnotary_CA on 2/8/06 1:58pm
Msg #95546

Re: We've talked about organizing....

The thing is, is that if we can get the truly serious notaries to stand together maybe we will have some luck. If we get a local network going we can refer each other and work togethr and build up a base which will hopefully help us all out. Yes I think it should be mandatory to take an NSA class. But not through the NNA or anywhere like that that just churns notaries out. There are a lot of notaries who become a notary and then find out about the SA aspect and say why not I know how to notarise stuff and off they go. I took a Signing course when I took my notary course. I guess I got lucky because the instructor I had actually taught us what the docs were and made us fill them out. The notarizations that is. She even made us check ID and fill out a mock journal page. She even made us fill out RTC's.

I think that we will see the ones looking for a quick buck dwindle out when they find how much time, cost, and effort go into a signing. The truly serious ones will stand up through the crowd because they know their job and do it properly.

Reply by Cherilyn_CO on 2/8/06 12:31pm
Msg #95495

You barely need a heartbeat to be a NP in CO...

so I would be all for it. NNA comes here quite frequently with their get rich quick scheme and I do quite a bit of clean up work. I'm all for weeding out those who aren't serious about the profession.

Reply by Charm_AL on 2/8/06 12:36pm
Msg #95500

Re: You barely need a heartbeat to be a NP in CO...

I am serious about this profession, I still don't think I need to have a title producers license to do it. I'm an independant contractor.

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 12:39pm
Msg #95504

I first got my notary cert in 30 minutes in Indiana...

Back when I first became a notary, it took me going into a State Farm office, getting a notary bond for ($50, which they later refunded $15)..then driving to the SOS, giving them the copy of my bond and application, and they printed my notary cert right there in front of me...

30 minutes to an hour tops..... that made me qualified to close loans.

There needs to be more stringent requirements.

Reply by trnsa_IL on 2/8/06 12:49pm
Msg #95506

Re: I first got my notary cert in 30 minutes in Indiana...

JMO but I would say that made you a notary not a loan closer!

I was certified through the NNA but I didn't know there was any other way of becoming a Notary Signing Agent than by taking the Certification Exam. (I found out about this profession from a friend whose sister is a signing agent.) I found the class educational and referenced the book many times when I was getting started. I feel that anyone who truly studies the information in the class will find it useful. Now with that said it is possible to only take the exam at the end and look up your answers as you go and never study therefore passing without any knowledge of what you are doing.
Again, JMO

Reply by trnsa_IL on 2/8/06 12:51pm
Msg #95508

Re: I first got my notary cert in 30 minutes in Indiana...

Reply by trnsa_IL on 2/8/06 12:55pm
Msg #95511

Re: Shane...understand I was agreeing with you! :)

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 1:09pm
Msg #95518

I followed you :P

The fact that one is qualified to be a notary, or heck, you could be the best Notary in the world, and still be a poor NSA.

Reply by Charles_Ca on 2/8/06 12:55pm
Msg #95510

Re: I first got my notary cert in 30 minutes...Did that

make you a poor notary. It sounds to me like you are being diligent and doing a great job. Perhaps if the Signing Services had a financial stake in the chain of title they may think twice about hiring brand new $45 notaries without a more careful screening process. Rignht now the SS are getting a pass on everything, they are promiseing the TC the sky and then going out and, n many cases, finding the least qualified to perform the service (experienced ntoraies won't take the sottom of the barrel pricing).

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 1:07pm
Msg #95517

Re: I first got my notary cert in 30 minutes...Did that

I think that I'm probably not the norm. Maybe a few years ago, the TPL or extra oversight, wasn't required. We didn't have a huge influx of new notaries, making errors left and right. We had people that took the time to learn what was required. I also had the benefit of working in the industry for several years, so I wasn't Bob Jones who saw an ad, and jumped on the bandwagon.

I think its time, they start separating the Notaries, from the NSA's.

I doubt you'll ever see any regulation over the SS's, as basically they are the ManPower/Kelly Services or what have you, of the Loan Signing business. They place people. Sometimes those people aren't qualified.

The regulation would at the very least improve make people better NSA's. Sure, everyone with experience is going to say they don't feel they need it... but this isn't about what we do, its about the industry as a whole.

Reply by trnsa_IL on 2/8/06 1:16pm
Msg #95522

Re: I first got my notary cert in 30 minutes...Did that

I spoke with the Indexing Department of the IL SOS who handles notary issues and asked if they were going to regulate this profession. I was told last year that the gov. is quickly working on a regulation for SS & TCs who want to do business in this state. I was also told that they have issued numerous cease and desist letters to companies doing business illegally in IL including one which only pays $50. He said at this point they are more concerned about the illegal businesses than the signing agents hey hire.

Reply by Charles_Ca on 2/8/06 1:23pm
Msg #95524

That's rignt trnsa_Il, The Governmen will protect their

revenue sources each and every time.

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 1:24pm
Msg #95525

Revenue Source...

Wouldn't requiring a TPL, or other regulatory license, be added revenue to the state government?

Reply by Charles_Ca on 2/8/06 1:26pm
Msg #95527

Re: Revenue Source...Yes but not in the same volume that

regulating businesses who are outside the fold. Besides they would have to set up another bureaucracy to handle the added responsibility and that may actually be a negative revenue source.

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 1:30pm
Msg #95530

Regulate Both....

Sounds to be like the government way of doing things. Require special licensing and bonding by the TC's and/or SS's (I imagine TC's are already covered)

And at the same time require a certain training/education and or License to practice as a NSA.

Reply by Charles_Ca on 2/8/06 1:52pm
Msg #95540

Don't confuse my reluctance to get the Government involved

to be a vote for the status quo. Anyone who has known me for any length of time knows that I don't like the way things are being done right now. As I see it the notary portion of the NSA business is a government function and there fore the notary is commissioned as an extension of the SOS. The loan document portion is an enterprise function and I see no reason to involve the police powers of the State to get involved. The enterprise portion is strictly a business function and to regulate business is usually a bad decision in a free enterprise society.

I think that a better place to put pressure on getting better quality of NSA would be to try and get the TCs to certify SSs and NSAs. Perhaps someone is up to tarting an organization that would certify NSA's and SSs to minimum standards set by the loan industry, I don't think anyone is doing that. This situation has got to change, I agree, but not by getting the government involved.

Got to go, I'm headed for Southern California this afternoon. I'd live to debate this at greater length and maybe we can get together a better forum than this. The NSA situation definitely needs to change, but it should be done to benefit those who are involved in the business! Lets keep up the dialog. Best regards Shane!

Reply by Shane_OH on 2/8/06 1:55pm
Msg #95545

Dialog is always good!

I suppose i'm thinking outside of the box on this matter. As the state I just moved from Indiana now requires the TPL....and i believe we'll probably see other states follow suit over the next year or 2.

We'll keep this discussion up Charles, stay busy!

Reply by Paul_IL on 2/8/06 9:46pm
Msg #95685

Re: I first got my notary cert in 30 minutes...Did that

Newflash for you but the IL SOS Index Department has nothing to say about doing closings all they do is issue Notary Commissions. Closings fall under ILDFPR Title Insurance Division. It is the Title Insurance Act that requires a title company , title agent or independent escrowee to legally conduct closings in IL. The Title Insurance division has been sending cease and desist letters to notaries that are illegally conducting closings.

Reply by Julie/MI on 2/8/06 1:16pm
Msg #95520

I cannot speak for Ohio SOS duties

The less my government knows about what I do the better!

The secretary of state is responsible for following the notary laws set into place by the legislature.
Mortgage Closings fall under the state licensing bureau.

If we give the legislators fuel for the fire, the way NNA does, we will all be out of business. Let's keep it simple, we are notaries public who know where mortgage documents need to be signed. Period.

MD requires a title producer's license and it doesn't appear they are raking in more per closing than other states.

Those that make errors will not be called again. Even a seasoned notary will make mistakes.

Reply by Becca_FL on 2/8/06 1:25pm
Msg #95526

Re: I cannot speak for Ohio SOS duties Julie/MI

>>>The less my government knows about what I do the better!<<<

I'm with you! The less government, the better. I know plenty of professions that require training and education, yet still have idiots out there conducting business. The Real Estate profession comes to mind. I have been involved with more inept Realtors lately, it seems like every housewife in the county decided to go out and get their license to cash in on the real estate boom.

Reply by Anonymous on 2/8/06 2:06pm
Msg #95553

Re: I cannot speak for Ohio SOS duties Julie/MI

Don't knock us housewives, we work for a living (and less pay than anyone on the planet!) That being said there are some of us who should remain just housewives and spare the rest of us the embarassment-but that can be said for any profession.
I agree with the government staying out of my business! They are already too involved in my life, but taxes is a whole other conversation.
I had to test for my Notary, it was not difficult, but I have several friends and relatives who are brokers and reccommended that I become a closer to supplement my husbands income. It is flexiable to my 4 kids schedules and I can work as much or as little as I want. It is pretty great.