Posted by CarolynCO on 1/13/06 11:52am
Msg #88186

General Notarizations

I do 30 or so general notarizations a month for people who find me on the internet. All but just a few come to me on an "appointment only" basis. I rarely have problems with this set-up.

I was on my way out the door for a UPS and FedEx run when I got a call from a gentleman needing two docs notarized in order to move into an apartment. I told him that I could meet with him in one hour in my office, and his reply was "I need these papers signed right away." I told him that I had a commitment and again told him that I could meet with him in an hour.

When he saw that I wasn't going to budge, he said that he would continue searching and if he couldn't find anyone, he would call me back. It has been 1-1/2 hours and he has called THREE more times simply because he can't keep track of the "notaries" he has already spoken with.

The time I told him I could set aside for him has come and gone. If he calls to say he's now on his way, he's just going to have to wait until I can schedule him for another time slot.

Reply by Teddog_CO on 1/13/06 11:59am
Msg #88189

The guy sounds a little strange. Hope you are not alone on this one . Be careful!

Reply by Teddog_CO on 1/13/06 2:13pm
Msg #88226

Notarizations-In rural areas

My reason for asking Carolyn if she is alone today and having someone come to home office.
Both Carolyn and I live in Very Rural areas, if someone calls us there are not many other people to refer someone too, within a 30 or 40 mile radius. When I get a call from someone it's a good idea to get their particulars. Be sure you're not allowing someone in that just might not have good intentions.

I also have referred clients to someone else when I'm to busy to help them. Sadly, there is only one other person I know about 30 miles from me.

So, just so everyone knows I did "get" Carolyn's question-just concerned for her safety. It's a pretty weird world out there and feel Every Notary should be careful. Living in a rural area, or not. It was just the way the "guy" kept calling her that I though was a little weird.

Reply by CarolynCO on 1/13/06 2:26pm
Msg #88228

Re: Notarizations-In rural areas

Thanks for your concern T-dog. I should actually be more afraid or rather cautious of people than I am. However, I do have a pretty good first-impression/sense of feeling people out, and have my pepper spray always triggered when someone comes to the house and I'm alone -- even if they are my attorney clients. Additionally, this is the case when I do signings, as well.

This guy was very demanding and expected me to drop everything for him. This usually turns me off real fast. The second turnoff was continuing to call, and not even realizing he was calling me over and over.

Reply by Jenny__CA on 1/13/06 12:08pm
Msg #88193

When I can't accomodate a regular notarization I refer the person to a nearby business that has a notary on staff all the time. I know the people there and they are very nice so I don't feel too guilty when I can't work someone in if they call me out of the blue.

Reply by Deb_CO on 1/13/06 12:44pm
Msg #88208

I do precisely what Jenny does, and just steer them to a UPS or MBE store in their area. Mind you, I don't look for one for them, but just let them know they typically do have a notary on staff--I usually say 'call first to make sure the notary is there.' They always appreciate it, and then I'm not stuck waiting for someone to 'maybe' show up. It let's you off the hook and they're still taken care of.

Reply by BrendaTx on 1/13/06 1:02pm
Msg #88214

Carolyn,

I have had them demand I help them right now and when I couldn't they'd tell me it was an emergency. If I can't, I can't. In two cases of this kind of thing, the person went through two or three weeks of emergency. It seemed like their emergency reoccurred in their brain on Friday afternoon...needed a weekend notary BAD. It was a woman in both cases.

Another one was a couple who needed a notarized statement so they could get married in China. It also required two apostilles. Okay, public notaries, if a foreign person comes to you and they have a statement telling them in English what they need to type up into a statement to get married in China, what do you do?

They bring you instructions from a website which says something like:

1. "Do a sworn statement with this info on it

Info (your name) info info (your birth date) info info (your birth place) info."

2. Have it notarized."

3. Do all this other stuff for the apostille.


So, they bring that blurb to you and want to have it notarized.

ARRGH.

I told them to go back to their computers and type up two statements with that information in it.

We argued for ten minutes over it and they wanted me to type it up for them. They would have paid me, but then we began in a discussion over price LOL Everything is negotiable! LOL! I told them I'd type it for nothing BUT I COULD NOT because I would be preparing a legal document for them to sign -- It's a legal document for the Chinese government so NO I could not do that and then notarize it.

I COULD type it up for them for free as a new friend would, if they needed help with that, and I could provide them apostille documents but they'd have to take it to another notary and get even bring it back and I'd help them get the apostille info / wedding info separated out according to instructions (as a friend - no charge).

These were two students and they were plenty bright, just unable to speak English / read English fluently. They had computers and printers at their disposal and money was not a problem in this case. The wedding was six months away.

The bride understood, but the groom was totally disgusted with me. The bride said they'd be back and that was a month ago.

But, what do you do? You just can't do what you can't. If I had made an error on their wedding documents AND notarized them ...MY BAD!

Reply by eXpedN_TX on 1/13/06 1:53pm
Msg #88224

A lady called me to perform a certified copy of her green card. I told her in the State of TX I was not allowed to perfrom certified copies of green cards, passports, marriage license, birth certificates, etc. She told me that I can certify a copy of her green card, that others do it all the time. (I have an email from the SOS stating what I said above - that you cannot).

I tried to be very polite with her while she told me what I was allowed to do, but ended up refering her to a local postnet or something similar. She called me about 2-3 more times since it was a weekend and couldn't get ahold of anyone. I couldn't find anything in my TX primer about green cards, but since I had an email from the SOS I turned it down.

The next day the lady called me to tell me she went to the bank and they had a list of what they can make certied copies of. Green cards were on their list of can do's so they did it for her. She called me to "educate" me in case I get another request.

I thanked her and hung up. I hope the bank only notarized the fact that the lady stated it was a true copy and didn't cerify the copy. Also, I would like one of these lists....the SOS said there isn't a list. The one the bank has may be wrong or the lady may have misunderstood what the notarization was?!?! A lot of you know how I like to search the web finding things...well I can not find any list anywhere?!?!?

Reply by BrendaTx on 1/13/06 2:38pm
Msg #88230

Re: General Notarizations- eXp...Cert. Copy

Recordable documents are items recorded in government records as I interpret it. You were correct not to do it.

There is no way you, a notary, are qualified to take a government issued card or document and look at it and determine it is a true, authentic item issued by the government. Therefore, you cannot certify a copy of it.

You can allow the holder to swear it is a true and correct copy, but they need to write that statement and you let them pick the correct notary certificate.

The reason there is no list is because it is infinite. There are so many court documents generated for court cases that you would have a list with every court document known to
man - these are "recordable" in court records.

The court is the only one who can certify copies of these. Again, you have no way of authenticating that the copy was true and correct.

One common type of certified copy a notary makes is a settlement statement...usually in a title office.

It's dicey on making certified copies of Powers of Attorney because these can be recorded in the county records (Texas can). Same for Wills. These CAN be recorded before death of the maker, as well as normally recorded after death. So, these should be added to your list in my opinion only.

Just ask yourself (like you did) if a document can be re-issued as an original or as a certified copy by any branch of government. If yes, then no can do...IN MY OPINION only. The Texas law is vague on this, so that's my rule of thumb.

ABOUT THAT BANK LIST - Either they use the method of attaching a statement like I mention above, or they are flat wrong, or that woman is a big fat liar. (Again, only in my dainty, Texas Mother Know It All Opinion. )

Reply by eXpedN_TX on 1/13/06 2:47pm
Msg #88233

Thanks MKIA!!! n/m

Reply by Gerry_VT on 1/13/06 3:55pm
Msg #88246

Re: General Notarizations- eXp...Cert. Copy

In my state the SOS notary handbook and FAQ only mention vital records as things that a notary should not prepare certified copies of. I have heard Texas notaries say they couldn't certify recordable documents. Perhaps a strategy would be to go the county recorder and get a list of what can be recorded. In Vermont for example, besides all the things you would expect, town clerks shall record "other instruments delivered to the town clerk for recording."

So, when someone wants a copy of a green card or passport, (s)he could check with the county recorder to see if it is recordable. If it is, record it and get a certified copy from the county recorder.

P.S.: while I live in Vermont, I have carried out a real estate transaction on my own behalf in Tarrant County, TX, and have visited the county records office there.

Reply by eXpedN_TX on 1/13/06 4:08pm
Msg #88248

Re: General Notarizations- eXp...Cert. Copy

Thanks for the great advise Gerry_VT. What part of Vermont are you in? My family is from the Quechee area.

Reply by Gerry_VT on 1/13/06 4:16pm
Msg #88251

Re: General Notarizations- eXp...Cert. Copy

I divide my time between the Rutland area and the Montpelier area.

Reply by BrendaTx on 1/13/06 4:49pm
Msg #88256

Re: General Notarizations- eXp...Cert. Copy-Gerry/eXp

Very nice idea, Gerry.

Here's a pretty good list of what we may not do - straight from the sos

MAY I MAKE A CERTIFIED COPY OF A BIRTH CERTIFICATE OR A MARRIAGE LICENSE:

No. Birth certificates and marriage licenses are recordable documents. A recordable document is one that is recorded with some type of entity whether it be the Secretary of State's Office, a court of law, a county clerk, or the Bureau of Vital Statistics. Certified copies may be obtained by contacting such entities.

A non-recordable document is one that has not been nor will ever be recorded with any type of entity. For instance, a letter is not recorded with anyone but there are times the sender of the letter would like to obtain a certified copy of that letter for his or her file.

http://www.sos.state.tx.us/statdoc/edinfo.shtml

So, if it is recorded in the official records of an ENTITY, that's the key? I will stick to my earlier definition...Gerry, did you interpret what I stated earlier to be okay?

Reply by Gerry_VT on 1/13/06 6:03pm
Msg #88263

Re: General Notarizations- eXp...Cert. Copy-Gerry/eXp

Brenda_TX wrote "So, if it is recorded in the official records of an ENTITY, that's the key? I will stick to my earlier definition...Gerry, did you interpret what I stated earlier to be okay?"

What you wrote made sense to me. The areas I could imagine such a broad definition being a serious inconvenience is where an ENTITY, such as the U.S. State Department, has a record of a document, but has a policy of not issuing certified copies (i.e., passports, university diplomas). Another potential inconvenience is when something, like a deed, will be recorded eventually, but a certified copy is wanted for temporary use until the recording occurs.

Reply by Regal1 on 1/13/06 3:28pm
Msg #88241

What is your fee to do a Standard Notarization? In NC we will can only charge $5 per signature.

Reply by eXpedN_TX on 1/13/06 3:47pm
Msg #88244

It differs per state. In TX you can charge $6 for an ack or jurat.