Posted by TCMN on 1/9/06 1:05pm
Msg #87071

The Windows Upgrade thread got me thinking...

Does anyone use Apple? I just got the iMac G5 and I'm probably not going to use it for business just yet until I "learn" where things are, but I'm told that it should work fine for this. Just have to go about Office and creating docs differently. Reading them and everything will be no problem but just wanted to check with the computer pros out there.

tia

Reply by Glenn Strickler on 1/9/06 1:50pm
Msg #87085

Only my opinion, but......

I started on an Apple, thought it was a better system from the start, but unfortunately, Microsofts marketing was better and hence, 96% of the market belongs to PC based machines. The succdess of the iPod saved Apple from oblivion and is the major source of income for the company.

This past year, I bought my daughter a computer for graduation and was going to buy her an Apple only because since it is only 4% of the market, no one bothers to write viruses for it and it would be less work for me in the long run. Unfortunately, there is no software written for her major in college that will work on an Apple. So I ended up buying a windows machine. You can use a program called virtual pc to run windows programs, but it doesn't do it well and you can open that part of your computer to the viruses again. Plus Apple is more expensive for the same computing power. Also, Apple announced last year that they will begin using Intel processors, so where that will lead, who knows. Some geeks I know think it will be the end of Apple as we know it.
Several years back, I was managing a test store where Apple was trying to sell its computers to my company. It was a total failure and the company ended up with pc's.

I don't know what compatibility the programs like eLynx has with Apple. Perhaps PAW can shed some light. He had more computer knowledge than I. I am told they won't work, but I never tried as I long ago packed my Apple away and went with Windows. There is just more out there for Windows and everything from software to hardware is less expensive.

Reply by TCMN on 1/9/06 3:28pm
Msg #87106

Glenn...I agree mostly..but this is a big response

those were my exact objectives also. But when I was standing there going through things with this store salesperson a stranger walks up and says that he loves it, wouldn't trade it, actually had both until last year when he was done with Microsoft because all they do is patch (put bandaids) on thier problems and he's never had a problem with his Apple.

I them walked into another store where I was checking things out, playing around with the floor model, and this guy walks up and starts talking to me about all the features, etc. I ask if he works there (since he wasn't wearing a name tag) and he says, no he just teaching training classes on Apple and the iMac's. Hmmmmmm, so I start using this as a HUGE tool and pick his brain. Can I use office on Apple since I will get word docs emailed to me? Can I still do my business as I do now? (and explained what I do)
He said no problem, with one exception....no problem opening and reading, etc a document that is emailed in any office product bcause Apple has Microsoft office software that will take care of that. BUT, if I create a document in office using my Appe then someone else mgiht have a hard time because the configuring is a little different because it's Apple written. Does that make sense? I got what he meant, but I doubt I am using his exact words or even close to hi verbage (being the tech he is).
I also asked about the programs, etc. that Apple has. Granted, they do have less to offer than Micosoft, I don't think they were on their way out. I would say that a lot of businesses run Apple systems. Just walking into 5 different places where I could see their computers, 3 of them used Apple. So, if these bigger businesses then my business use that and get along fine I would pray that I should be able to.
They do run more effecient , more secure and easier systems with a lot of features that people will actually use as standards when you buy them AND with less needed for operation the same on a Microsoft Windows. (that's the only thing I disagree with you on) Why? Because Microsoft will have to pull info from several (like 60) different programs just to run WORD, when Apple only opens from the program you are asking to use.
That also is one of the reasons why Apple would have a harder time getting a virus. The reason everyone needs virus protection is Microsoft runs that way giving more open programs, thus more access areas for viruses to move through. If a virus tried to get into an Apple through WORD lets say, Apple says, umm,no your not part of what's needed to run this program and it ends there. Virus don't get in.
Now granted less viruses are wrote for Apple but after learning a little about that part of it I honestly believe that is one of the reasons Apple will make a bigger comeback than most believe.
I watched this guy start both, an Apple and a Microsoft windows base computer and no kidding, the Apple desktop was up and I was using it BEFORE windows little bar thing scrolled across the screen at start up. They were technically the same in ram,mb,kb, etc. but just because of how much better Apple is wrote it out does anything Microsoft would put out had Apple put the same thing out.
Microsoft doesn't correct their mistakes, then patch them. Apple says...hey this isn't good enough, let's start from scratch and make it the right way. I'm told that Apple programmers could do what any Microsoft programmer could but the same isn't true the other way. And that was my ex who programs computers. His company has both Apple and Microsoft. His boss bought his wife an Apple because it was easier and she has to use the other because that's what he can connect to his computer at work.

I say that with the ipod, Apple just made an inexpensive product that got peoples attention. Even Sony said last night in an interview, Apple doesn't have to waste time trying to figure out security issues like we have or Microsoft has, they've had that covered. We've all had to worry about how to make sure people don't pirate our stuff and what we should've been doing is stop with the "quick-fixes" and start over and make it right so we can progress like Apple has been doing. I think he said that it was a huge slap in the face since what is primarily a music product wasn't produced first by someone like Sony or Pioneer, etc. and that he believe that the ipod is just the tip of what Apple will have come forward in the future.

I don't know, I'm just taking in what I have witnessed or tried with the help of that trainer that I interrogated when the poor guy walked up to talk to me.
I hope I'm right.

ps....and every person who I've talked to about the Apple said that it will last for years...8-10 is not out of the question at all.

That makes me feel better at least, as long as I don't have to replace it every 14 months like I have the last 2.

Reply by Glenn Strickler on 1/9/06 4:08pm
Msg #87136

Re: Glenn...I agree mostly..but this is a big response

Well, don't get me wrong, I really liked Apple, and if all I did was personal use, I would buy a new Apple. I still use mine for personal use now and then and think of what might have been had their marketing department been better. I usually don't like to follow the crowd when it comes to deciding what I like, but unfortunately I had to make a decision that was made mainly with the size of my wallet in mind. But considering all the things I do with the computer, it made fiscal sense to get away from Apple. My daughers friends who have Apples (all two of them) are constantly using our computer for their science classes, because the software that they need is just not written for Apple.

As far as patches, viruses and spyware, you just need to run behind a router (which acts as a mechanical firewall) and keep your anti-virus and anti-spyware programs updated. I have them all on auto and have not had any problems. Don't kid yourself with Apple being more secure. They just have not been attacked since they are such a small share of the market. The holes are there, but since the code is different, they are not affected right now. And in reality, will probably never be, except, I can't get a clear answer from the people I know on how the Intel chips will change things for Apple -- or they know and just aren't telling me. If you are a person who writes viruses (it takes a lot of time) will you write it for the 4% or the 96%? If you are never attacked, then you will never have a problem. I am not defending microsoft by any means, but the windows machines are being attatcked and hacked from mutiple directions all the time and by millions of hackers worldwide. It's got to be tough to keep up with. Ain't so with Apple. In terms of security, they have an easy life. It's easy to look good when you aren't challanged.

How long do they last? Well, my son-in-law has replace his Mac twice in the time I have had this computer. The computer I am writing this on is a 1997 Acer. P2 266. The only thing I have done is blow the memory out to 512mb. Everything else is from 1997, except software upgrades. How long they last is a function of brand as much as how well you take care of it. My son-in-laws Mac's have had a hard life. In fact, he can't make a new car last either.

My hope would be for Apple to become stronger and create more competition. It would be better for all computer users.

Anyway, gotta go, got a job.......

Reply by PAW_Fl on 1/9/06 4:19pm
Msg #87142

Re: Only my opinion, but......

For ease of use and simplicity, I would take an Apple over a Windows based system any day. Actually, I would take a Linux based system over either one. And I would take the DOS prompt over Windows! (Gimme that old C:>)

But, for application availability and compatibility, just about everything is Windows twisted. That is, it is written for Windows based systems and ported over to the others. There are some applications, especially graphical based ones, specifically written for the Apple, but that's not our industry. Some print utilities that some lenders use, will simply not work on an Apple or Linux system because they are specifically written to use Windows. This is also true with some other applications, but I can't think of any that an NSA would run into, other than the document managing applications (SwiftView, GMD, SecureSend, etc.).

Reply by Glenn Strickler on 1/9/06 5:18pm
Msg #87168

Yeah, I miss the old dos prompt.

PAW, I have waited so long to replace my desktop because I was waiting to see what Windows Vista is going to ge all about. Is it worth the wait, or should I just spring now and upgrade later in your opinion?

Also, have you played much with Linux? Should I even think about going there?

Reply by PAW_Fl on 1/9/06 6:30pm
Msg #87195

Re: Yeah, I miss the old dos prompt.

I haven't been following Microsquash lately but personally, I would wait until Vista is released. I would even consider using the RC releases if you have a box to play with. Otherwise, wait. I am.

I don't use Linux for desktops, only for servers. So, "play" isn't too much of an option there.