Posted by BrendaTx on 7/2/06 2:57pm
Msg #130376
Per Signing Expenses
In light of the recent request of the NNA to do something about their prices, I want to write an article regarding the real cost of signings. A quick brainstorm brought these approximate costs to mind. This quick tally yields around $27.00 cost per avg 20 mile. I am not the best at this but thought maybe some of you who'd like to play a numbers game with me would care to comment.
00.25 Calls via Cellphone
00.50 Faxing Service if applicable
00.25 Email and internet access
01.00 Utilities
00.25 misc office supplies (clips, pens, sticky notes, etc.)
02.50 edocs IF you recharge your own cartridges and buy paper in bulk
20.00 Car cost / approx .50 per mile / 20 mile radius/RT=40 miles
00.10 Car Insurance
01.00 advertising/marketing
00.01 notary commission / stamps/ journal
00.01 notary insurance
01.00 SE Tax
00.25 Inc Tax
00.50 Equpiment Depreciation
xx.xx Home office expenses ? (Makes you more liable for audit, so I have read.)
xx.xx Health Insurance
xx.xx Other??
For those who are not good at figuring out of pocket costs, depreciation, etc. this might help to educate them on what they are actually MAKING at the end of the day. I know it surely helped me figure what was worthwhile to me to keep this business running.
No matter how I slice it, the shortest signing in the world requires over 2 hrs of time. Not that time really matters in the scope of many, but it does to me.
Anyone want to add to or correct me?
| Reply by Pamela on 7/2/06 3:55pm
Msg #130394
Brenda! Re: Per Signing Expenses
Good Afternoon Brenda!
Hope All is Well!
You may add these to your lists:
Business/Business-Casual attire
Clothing maintenance (dry cleaning, washing etc. . .)
Perfume, lipstick, make-up . . .
"Overall Grooming"
Weekly Hair care and maintenance (i.e. hair stylists)
Dental insurance
"High-end" mobile phone (i.e. BlackBerry 7100i) and accessories
Mobile phone contract with added amenities (i.e. e-mail etc. . .)
Physical business planner
"Business" auto insurance
Auto maintenance
Business-Class machines (i.e. printers, copiers, faxes etc. . .)
"Back-up" Business-Class machines (i.e. printers, copiers, faxes. . .)
Business cards
And, Pantyhose, Pantyhose, Pantyhose. . .!
Also, "therapy time" (All of my borrowers so far have been very nice people. They all seem to want to "share" with me! Even if it isn't loan related, they all feel comfortable talking to me!)
lol,
Pam
| Reply by BrendaTx on 7/2/06 4:00pm
Msg #130396
Re: Brenda! Re: Per Signing Expenses
I definitely think that from the SA's point of view some of these can be considered and I might not put a price on it but these are good thoughts to include. Thanks, Pamela.
| Reply by MichiganAl on 7/2/06 4:16pm
Msg #130400
Yes, pantyhose and lipstick can really run up my costs.
But I'm thinking of eliminating them. It seems to scare the borrowers when I show up that way.
| Reply by Pamela on 7/2/06 4:27pm
Msg #130404
MichiganAl!
So, I take it, that you don't live in Los Angeles ("smile" ?
Pam
| Reply by Brenda Stone on 7/2/06 4:29pm
Msg #130406
Re: MichiganAl! and Pamela! are both comedians today.
Thank you very much for the laughs...both of you.
| Reply by Pamela on 7/2/06 4:36pm
Msg #130409
Brenda! You Are Very Welcome!!! Pam n/m
| Reply by Sylvia_FL on 7/2/06 6:43pm
Msg #130442
Re: Yes, pantyhose and lipstick can really run up my costs.
Al
I would be happy to send you some pantyhose. I have several unopened packages.
And I have several unused lipsticks from when I was selling cosmetics.
You have been so kind to me, I would love to help you with those items.
All I ask in return is that you post a photo of you wearing the pantyhose and lipstick so we can all enjoy LOL
| Reply by Pamela on 7/2/06 4:06pm
Msg #130398
Brenda! And-
Plus,
The added cost for signing-up with the various notary directories
The added cost for a business webpage
The "time" spent signing-up and marketing to the various companies
The "time" spent, waiting for e-docs to arrive
And, The "travel time" spent just waiting in Southern California traffic,
is worth it's wait in gold ("smile"!
Pam
| Reply by Cherilyn_CO on 7/2/06 4:12pm
Msg #130399
About car expenses...
Insurance is included in the cost per mile.
Also, Pamela commented on equipment, which would be included in depreciation.
And I think your SE Tax is low. Let's just say that this signing was paying $100.00. Say I notarized 10 items. In Colorado that would be $50.00. If I had a $50.00 SE income-$27.00 worth of expenses, then my SE income would be $23.00 multiplied by .0765 and you get $1.75.
I also think .25 per cellphone call is a little high. I'm going to get my current bill and work the number to see what I come up with.
Cherilyn
| Reply by BrendaTx on 7/2/06 4:19pm
Msg #130402
Re: About car expenses...Thanks very much, Cherilyn.
I can easily agree with you on the cell phone, and for clarifying on car insurance. I look forward to other comments.
| Reply by M_Gall_CA on 7/2/06 4:47pm
Msg #130410
Office Cleaning (or percentage) / insect repellent (ugh) {had to have office done professionally after one signing} landscape costs, prof. fees (accounting/legal)
| Reply by BrendaTx on 7/2/06 4:51pm
Msg #130413
**prof. fees (accounting/legal)**
Definitely a keeper. The others should be noted in general as well. Thanks.
Would you care to put a Per Signing amount on the Prof fees?
| Reply by Martha Gall on 7/2/06 4:55pm
Msg #130416
Wish I could but use both services for toher than notary/loan signing work. So I really don't have a clue.
| Reply by SharonMN on 7/2/06 5:36pm
Msg #130428
Re: Per Signing Expenses - Taxes
I don't remember the exact #s and don't wish to revisit my tax return at this point - but $1.25 per signing for taxes seems extremely low to me. Of course it depends a lot on your family income, whether you have 2 jobs, how close to the edge of a tax bracket you are, how much you can deduct for exepenses, etc.
For $100 signing, if you are in the 25% bracket - $25. SE tax is, I think, another 15% or so (if you live in CA and can exempt most of your notary income, good for you - but I live in MN and can charge $1 per notarization.) I always sort of figure 40% is going to the gov't right off the bat and if it comes out to be less than that at tax return time, hooray.
| Reply by BrendaTx on 7/2/06 5:46pm
Msg #130430
Re: Per Signing Expenses - Taxes
**For $100 signing, if you are in the 25% bracket - $25. SE tax is, I think, another 15% or so (if you live in CA and can exempt most of your notary income, good for you - but I live in MN and can charge $1 per notarization.) I always sort of figure 40% is going to the gov't right off the bat and if it comes out to be less than that at tax return time, hooray.**
Sharon, I do not disagree with this at all. However, had I put a higher figure out there, someone would have come along and started telling me how I was way off on that figure and did not know how to do my taxes right and we'd have been off the subject. You're input is very valued for this purpose. I hope to have a tax-ified person give us a realistic figure. I am not an expert on taxes by any means, but it stands to reason that the $1 is low by your own very astute comments.
| Reply by Ilona_OH on 7/2/06 7:50pm
Msg #130451
You get $10-Ohio gets $1.50 & 2.00 per. that's makes
a difference on the old SE amt.
| Reply by Bob_Chicago on 7/2/06 11:41pm
Msg #130471
I do not look at it quite that way.
I am not going to nit-pick your expense list, MKIA, but
the way I see it a lot of those costs are going to be there
if you are on the road doing signings , or sitting
at home playing the word association game on NOTROT.
The largest component of our costs is, of course,
car costs. I am well aware of the IRS decduction amounts.
Those allowances, however, are based on the total cost
of owning a car. The largest part is depreciation computed
by passage of time. A new car loses a large part of its value
when you drive it out of the dealer. A 2003 is worth less that a
2004 of the same make and model.
"Excess" mileage , is, of course, an issue, but the largest component
is simple aging.
Insurance , licenses, etc are a fixed cost as is the financing cost
to acquire the car. All of these are cranked into the IRS allowance.
Again, they are the same, even if your car sits in your garage.
The "fixed "part of your expenses will be there if you are our doing \
signings , or sitting at home. I try to spread these costs
over as many signings as possible, so long as they are
at a "reasonable" fee with good companies.
I find that I will frequently be able to do several signings on one
trip, with minimal doubling back. This reduces both my
cost per singing and my time per signing. Drivin time on
a bunch of one way trips to bwr and dead heading home,
frequently can take mor time than the actual signing. By
doing several signings on each trip, you are greatly reducing
your driving time.
I acknowledge being in an urban area, my circumstances are
different that some. The point that I am trying to make is , you
will usually find that the more work that you do, you will
be spreading your fixed expenses over a higner number
of jobs, and you will , therefore, have a lower cost per job,
and less total time invested per job.
Even if you end up with some "dead " time between jobs,
you can stop a a local library and do paper work or use thier
computer, usually without cost.
Have a happy Fourth of July and remember to fly those flags.
| Reply by BrendaTx on 7/3/06 12:06am
Msg #130472
Re: I do not look at it quite that way. FKIA
Your input is valued as always...and very pertinent. MKIA
| Reply by Bob_Chicago on 7/3/06 12:09am
Msg #130473
Go to bed, it's late . I am . Nighty Nite n/m
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