Posted by MA_SA on 3/10/06 6:07am
Msg #103784

Oh No, SOX!

Problem,,,

I accepted a signing yesterday from a SS. I coudnt quite hear hear who the company was, but when the docs all came over, it was SOX. I dont know what i should do, should i cancel? have they been better with paying? I am thinking of sending them an email.

Help me,

brian

Reply by MA_SA on 3/10/06 6:21am
Msg #103786

Also

Also, I dont think they said they were SOX when they called, now that i think of it, and now that i see other posts from notaries that they had done that before, ,,,,,

brian

Reply by Korey Humphreys on 3/10/06 8:49am
Msg #103810

Brian, they called me and I told them hell no! Funny you got

it!! That's hilarious!! I've decided two weeks ago that I, and my network, should cut ties from them. After listening to people here, I have to agree. Their business practices are horrible, and just like Lisa Schreiber (?) the head mukie muck should be locked up and ordered to pay back all those SOX has screwed over.

I disagree with the other posters. If you accept the assignment under false pretenses (not given the name), and/or realize later that they are scam artists, you should cancel. Screw them like they've screwed so many others!!

Regardless, Brian, good luck and inform us in a couple of years when you get paid.

Reply by Korey Humphreys on 3/10/06 8:53am
Msg #103814

*all those SOX* NO! meant *all those notaries* :-( n/m

Reply by LawrenceOK on 3/10/06 9:19am
Msg #103822

Re: TWO WRONGS DO NOT MAKE A RIGHT KOREY!!

Who is it you are really screwing when you do this? the BORROWER thats who! There are other avenues, like assuring that the title company knows that SOX is using false pretenses to get you to accept assignments. I accepted the signing and I completed the signing as I was more concerned about the borrower not SOX. BTW, I now do these in my area for the TC, not SOX.

Reply by Korey Humphreys on 3/10/06 10:12am
Msg #103839

(STOP YELLING) :) If I know of a company that screws over

notaries the last thing I am going to do is accept an assignment from them.

I understand your concern about the borrowers. Put quite frankly, this is a business. I'm not going risk going in debt because I wasted time serving some deadbeat business.

Before I would cancel, I would ask the business to send me the check (usually with the docs). Seeing how this is unlikely, I know they'd cancel. Thereby rendering it to be their problem.

Brian made a smart move in requesting a copy of his check. Will it actually happen? From SOX, I doubt it!

Reply by patricia on 3/10/06 10:25am
Msg #103850

Re: TWO WRONGS DO NOT MAKE A RIGHT KOREY!!

in a situation like this it might be fine to call the title company and ask them to send your
signing fee directly to you and what-ever was left over to SOX

Reply by CaliNotary on 3/10/06 12:35pm
Msg #103916

In this case they make a right

There is absolutely nothing wrong with giving a signing back to a signing service if they have a reputation for not paying. This is business, if you want to be charitable there are certainly more worthy organizations out there than SOX.

There are plenty of signing agents out there. If you don't do a signing they can find someone else who will. To work for free because you're so concerned about the borrower, a person you've never met, and a loan that very well might not even be date sensitive, is just plain foolish.

Nobility has it's place in life, but there is a line where it crosses over into being a chump. This would be one of those situations.

Reply by LawrenceOK on 3/10/06 1:05pm
Msg #103934

Re: In this case they make a right

Ya know Cali, I like chumping my A** to the bank every 15 days. By keeping the assignment the Tc calls me for my area now.

Reply by CaliNotary on 3/10/06 5:12pm
Msg #103993

Re: In this case they make a right

well if everybody were able to steal TC business from SOX I'd have different advice. Sometimes people win the lottery and get rich, but that doesn't make lottery tickets a sound financial investment.

The reality is most people do the work and get stiffed for payment and have to invest a ridiculous amount of resources to get paid from SOX. I don't care if the borrower is about to lose his house if I don't show up, I'd still give the signing back. Anybody who is familiar with SOX and still takes work from them for ANY reason gets exactly what they deserve.

Reply by LawrenceOK on 3/10/06 8:14am
Msg #103796

I have always believed that if you accept the assignment, you do the assignment. This very same thing happened to me recently and believe it or not, I was paid as promised and they met me fee.

Reply by cmd_NH on 3/10/06 8:22am
Msg #103799

I agree with Lawrence. If you accept it, you do it. Sometimes we have to suck it up and deal with it. At least it shows we follow through.

Reply by Tina/Idaho on 3/10/06 8:32am
Msg #103804

I agree with you both, BUT if you were hired under deception then where is the obligation?!? And if they had to hire you under deception what makes you think they will pay??? I am in business, as a full time loan signing agent, to make a living . . . pay those bills and have some fun. I am not in this as a community service. Now as a notary public I donate my services all the time. Here we only get $2.00 to notarize a signature. I have never charged for our service because it isn't worth charging for! But I do that on my own free will. Why work for / with a company that has to operate under these deceptive conditions? I am very straight forward and upfront and expect to be treated that way in return.

Reply by LauriecPA on 3/10/06 8:44am
Msg #103809

I agree with Tina, on this one! If they used a different co. name when they called you in order for you to accept the closing, they know that a lot of notaries are on to them and not accepting the assignments for them when they use their "real" name. I had a similar situation a couple of months ago. I had a call from someone referring to themselves as working for an "accounting firm" and didn't give me the co. name. I told the "accountant" that I was available for the time and location he specified and asked him to email me all of the info. Turns out it was JG Wentworth. Now, I have read numerous posts on this board and others about them not paying their notaries. I was torn between going b/c I had "accepted", but then I thought of all of the aggravation I would have to deal with down the road and called him back. I apologized for turning down the assignment, I explained why I was turning it down and wished him luck finding another notary that didn't know of their business practices.

Reply by MA_SA on 3/10/06 9:36am
Msg #103826

Well, i kinda ended up meeting the posters halfway. i emailed back the assignor of the closing and told her that i needed a copy of the check they would be sending me emailed or faxed before i could do the closing, since the independent contractor agreement said that i could only sue them in california. being in massachusetts, this kinda just voids any chance i have of suing for my fee. i told them that to sign such a service contract required payment up front. she said she would find another attorney to do the closing.

i dont need collection agravation right now, seems like a lot of comanies are in the process of trying to stiff me right now.

brian

Reply by BrendaTx on 3/10/06 9:48am
Msg #103828

Re: Oh No, SOX! - It's not that easy for me to say but...


----I will cancel under certain situations---

When I encounter a new company via phone call about an appointment, I let them know I will not keep the signing if I check my sources and find bad reports on their payment history. I also try to get references.


-----Fax backs will break a deal also----

I would be lying if I said that I had never caused a bwr to be left without a notary. Not long ago I got blindsided with fax backs. The afternoon before the signing I got the edocs and I contacted the co. and told them I would need an additional fax fee since they had not disclosed that ahead of time.

They responded via email : "Sorry, we do not pay a fee for faxing back." It was two hours before the signing before they told me.

To which I responded. "I understand. I do not do fax backs as a part of the fee you were quoted. You should consider this and either get a different notary or waive the requirement." The argument was long and arduous but I did not back down. For $75+$25 for a large refi, I am not going to fax back docs over one or two. This company gives me maybe four jobs a year. I actually do take care of myself and my business BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE WILL.

I remember to ask now. I took one yesterday and was lied to about the faxing requirements when I asked. It was the HE that I did not take so it was a moot point.

EVEN AT ONE OR TWO pages when this is required, it is costing the notary an hour off the top. (1) You go back to your office rather than dropping off. (2) You fax. (3) You reassemble (4) You You go back to the courier.

Everything else is already on its way for the day...but, no...you have more mileage and 30 minutes at least invested in a trip. It all counts.

When it is only one or two pages, my digital camera makes a beautiful reproduction of the pages. I can fax from that with no problem. Usually a HUD.

This garbage of 12, 21, 40, 52 pages is unfair. We are supposed to be independent contractors. If they tell us what to do after we have bid a job, I think that's a little bit pushy. We did not bid on that. I bid on the function of signing a loan...notarizing, returning the docs...I am not bidding on being an imaging technician.

Due to fear of no work, we have slowly evolved into doing even more of the office professional's work. The notary closer is not bidding on their work of scanning into their system via fax. Now, if they want to also hire me to do their imaging work, that's different.

----Read the lender's instructions to title----

Usually, packages that require faxing these days are as a result of the lender's closing instructions. They either need these things faxed to them by the title company when the loan closes and funds, or they need a purchase or inv. property docs to fund. If it is a purchase or inv. property, the sa should be given a higher fee to get these things done because it requires more of the sa's time and disruption to schedule.

If it is just because the ss has agreed to get this part of the task done for the tc, or it makes it easier on the tc to get your fax in their system, hence not necessary for them to take the time to scan into their system to email or fax it out it is unfair to press the notary into the position of imaging technician...which is what I think is the real drive behind some of this faxing back.

I realize some hiring entities may feel I have got a bad attitude about all this. I understand...but I am not dead yet and Texas is slow. I still have a business.

Many are slow all over but they keep allowing more work requirements for less money. It sounds good to say "I make $50-$60-$75 for a one hour appointment."..but they are not. The profit margin is not nearly that high.

It comes home to people when their non-commercial fax has worn out, they need new tires, they must go buy a new printer to replace their non-commercial printer...they have to replace a $100 toner cartridge before they have been in business a month, etc.

If you don't charge enough on the days you are working, you cannot cover the office expense when you have no jobs. It's not just about one job at a time if you are in this as a business. I guess lots of people really do this for bingo money.

As long as I am around, I will keep bringing up these nasty little annoyances so people don't give theri work away. ANY of us can find other work to PAY and not cause us to go into the hole. Lose your mentality that we HAVE to take the jobs cheaper to get work. You can do something else besides signings. Leave the cheapest notaries out there working. There will come the time that they are not getting paid enough to hold their commitments and they will say HECK WITH IT. They will quit all in one big decision to go see their grandkids play a baseball game rather than sit around and wait for edocs...find the bwrs...fax back. It will come. If they get back into the game they will charge enough to make it worth their while.

Vent on faxing, and bad companies over. I respect the views of others, but this one is mine.

Reply by FlaMac on 3/10/06 10:29am
Msg #103854

Faxbacks might be illegal soon..nationwide..I'm trying..

to find out for sure. It's supposed to be part of the new federal Identity Theft laws that are in the works. Wouldn't that be Grand! Then we can tell them it's illegal just like backdating

Reply by LauriecPA on 3/10/06 10:32am
Msg #103858

Re: Oh No, SOX! - It's not that easy for me to say but...

Great post, as usual, Brenda! It was something I needed to read b/c I have been guilty of taking the fax back jobs in order to get the work. (That was last month, I've turned over a new leaf for March after what I went through in Feb.!)

Reply by patricia on 3/10/06 10:50am
Msg #103876

Re: Oh No, SOX! - It's not that easy for me to say but...

I certainly appreciate Brenda's post, I also refuse to do fax-backs and usually get them waived
but I have had to turn down work due to fax-backs and other hand-holding and it hurts
when I do need the income, I refuse to let companies use me and waste my time. There
are some companies that seem to think that when we agree to do a signing we are willing
to tie up hours of time and let them squander our assets, such as car, cell phone and equipment. I wish everyone would "just say no"

Reply by BrendaTx on 3/11/06 12:07am
Msg #104018

Re: Oh No, SOX! - It's not that easy for me to say but...

Thank you-each one of you who understands. We talk about the entitlement claimed by some of the posters we encounter here. However, there are too many entitlement issues with those we work for.

The philosophy that one person should take advantage of another just because they can is so against my grain that I am shocked. Total greed and indifference toward using people.

Reply by Calnotary on 3/10/06 12:40pm
Msg #103920

"I agree with Lawrence. If you accept it, you do it."


They also accepted it to pay you and they not always do.

Reply by SanDiegoCA on 3/10/06 11:42am
Msg #103900

Well, GOSH, it looks like I'm in the minority here, but I've had no trouble getting SOX to send pay for appointments I do for them, even the $150 cases for piggyback eDOCs.

I will say this, after the first month I was called by them, I missed the deadline for my invoice, and you MUST send your invoice (as their internal accounting SUX - quip intended) by the 5th of the following month.

Also, at least 60 days will go by before you get the check, due to how the cycles work in that office also considering the setlement companies offices they use and their cycles, and sometimes it can go as long as 90 days, which is, I know, pretty extreme. But I have yet to be stiffed as long as my invoices arrive on time.

As for faxbacks, Brenda, I with you pretty much. I'm having issues with CountryWide right now through ServiceLink, but ServiceLink is not the responsible party for the trouble, and they were nice enough in covering for the additional fees WHEN I can catch the issue of there being faxbacks for the case soon enough.

CountryWide has other problems as well for some reason, maybe because they are a new company, but I know for sure they don't have a Certified Signing Agent on their staff. Hopefully they will get it together and settle out some of their insane nature soon.

For me, while SOX is a little hard to deal with, I have had no trouble getting paid, except that it is slow pay by it's very nature and totally dependent on YOUR invoice to key their accounting.

Reply by CaliNotary on 3/10/06 12:41pm
Msg #103921

"Also, at least 60 days will go by before you get the check, due to how the cycles work in that office also considering the setlement companies offices they use and their cycles, and sometimes it can go as long as 90 days, which is, I know, pretty extreme. But I have yet to be stiffed as long as my invoices arrive on time."

You think 60-90 days is an acceptable amount of time to wait for payment for the work we do? That is really sad. Take a little more pride in your business.

Reply by Cherilyn_CO on 3/10/06 12:53pm
Msg #103927

I completely agree! That's just sad. nt n/m

Reply by Brenda/CA on 3/10/06 1:06pm
Msg #103936

Re: I completely agree! That's just sad. nt

I don't feel it is wrong to cancel a job you that you have accepted if you have just cause. I had a call from Accusigning about 4 or 5 months ago while I was on the road. I quoted a fee which they agreed to and I accepted the assignment. When I got home and received the confirmation, I looked them up here and on another website. I found a lot of negative information in regards to not only payment issues, but their attitudes on collections, etc. I called them immediately and cancelled, and I told them it was because of their payment issues. If you had bad credit the bank would not want to issue you a credit card. I am operating a business, why should I extend service to a company that would take 3 to 6 months to pay me, if I get paid at all.