Posted by ReneeK_MI on 5/14/06 5:44am
Msg #119768

This song has no title - exasperated ranting

I hit some kind of wall after another morning’s rounds of the boards. I’m almost – but apparently not quite speechless. One of my personal failings/strengths (depends on the view) is the ability to see things within a very large perspective – ‘the view from the airplane’ instead of from the ground, albeit MY view from MY airplane.

Within every field, every company, every group, every profession, every HOME – there are people of integrity, and people of less scrupulous character. Makes the world more interesting. However, as a whole – I begin to feel that the financial & title industries realize the advantage of our ‘third party’ services is in the enabling we provide, to consummate business that might not be consummated otherwise. The disconnect that we provide between their hands and the consummation enables the Machine to turn a blind eye to a lot of things. See no evil, hear no evil, don’t ask, don’t tell.

You have the NNA rushing around the country, like the Acme of SA mass-production. You tell them to chin-up, take the $50 jobs “for the experience”, get out there and get Experienced. That implies something that I think becomes less and less true – that the Mother Machine actually prefers that you HAVE experience. Perhaps, when times weren’t so tough, a higher percentage of lenders/title entities DID prefer to keep everything kosher – but now, times ARE tough, across all the columns of our nation’s economy, and it changes the perspectives.

We all want the same thing – we SA’s, huge lending corporations, independent SS’s – we want to survive. We want to eat, pay our bills, meet stockholder’s expectations, hold attrition rates. It’s a relative thing, the wants and needs – but the means of satisfaction definitely vary.

Ahh … so now there exists a huge pool of guppie SA’s seriously lacking in experience, and this pool is continually being replenished. (To think that these $50 guppies will become $150 experienced SA’s in time, and that the problem is self-solving, is to ignore the math!) These new people are easily intimidated (please, I am GENERALIZING) and that is, to me, very apparent by reading the 5 boards that I read daily, in addition to my having audited over 10,000 closed pkgs), fairly clueless of the Big Picture and having but the most rudimentary knowledge of the laws they’re entrusted to satisfy. They come to these boards and ask questions and read opinions and they place a heavy weight on what they read here.

They’re told all day long – it’s acceptable and understandable to expect poverty-level wages while you’re gaining ‘experience’. They’re often chastised (as are the experience SA’s) for concerning themselves with anything beyond NOTARY law. Docs say he’s unmarried but he tells you he’s married? NOT YOUR BUSINESS, they’re told. (THAT one blew me away, so it comes to mind.) Credible witnesses used when they shouldn't be, RTC's improperly dated, I have to imagine (and of this, I am not very knowledgeable) that title agencies (i.e. their Underwriters!) LOVE Signing Services – because it adds one more step of removal from the actions at the table. Lenders don’t even want to think about you people out there – don’t ask, don’t tell. Send the docs to whoever is named on that Closing Protection Letter, and wipe your hands, your butt is covered.

It’s a pretty damn successful machine. It’s not like we’re reading about all the hundreds of SA’s being hauled into court every day, eh? Considering all the transactions that are done daily, and the HUNDREDS of THOUSANDS of SA’s that are out there, acting in the capacity of the lender’s blindfolds and earplugs. And the beauty of this is that if/when the Stuff hits the proverbial Fan, the SA will (as I imagine it) be able to stand there and say, “all I did was notarize” (and sweat/pray they did THAT part right!).

The ‘experienced’ SA is now a double-edged sword. On the one hand, they’re not likely to pose much risk of messing things up PLUS they’re usually able to handle common problems – on the other hand, if that borrower presents anything from the Gray-Colored Category, your experienced SA is probably going to know what to do THERE, ALSO. Integrity plus some knowledge can pose a risk. On top of that, you’ve got the fee issue.

Well, this is the American Way, this is nothing specific to this industry, it’s our culture and our society, it is survival, it is capitalism and the great Passing of the Buck maneuvering.

On the flip side, there certainly are plenty of entities that hire our services and EXPECT our knowledge, experience AND integrity; and they realize those things are a commodity with value. We can all be winners; it just depends on what it was that you wanted to win.

Reply by Kelly M Robertson on 5/14/06 9:12am
Msg #119775

Renee, Not All $50 Guppies will become Experienced SA's

Ive said this many times: In tough times, the LSA's that hate this work and just don't like people will finally call "Uncle" and quit; those that never really got their business off the ground will give up (maybe they were not suited for the job, didn't market enough, got sidetracked with something else, ran out of money, didn't do the proper research, didn't anticipate the comittment required, moved, had a baby, etc). And I hate to say it, but it's true: There are many folks with good intentions that become a Notary Public, take classes, buy books, purchase expensive equipment and even write their business plan but never, ever, ever complete one single notarization let alone pursue a business as a Loan Signing Agent. This business is just not for everyone.

As you know, Renee, I am vocal about the, "it's none of my business" lines - don't analyze, just notarize. When I've gotten my panties in a wad about issues that I am not swearing to or have no solid facts/knowledge of (such as if they are married or not), I'm stepping onto a slippery slope that is not within my role as a Notary Public. Yes, Loan Signing Agents are much more than just than a Notary but as long as I'm not personally participating in any fraudulent acts, I get out as quickly as possible without comprimising courtesy and professionalism.

Reply by BrendaTx on 5/14/06 9:22am
Msg #119776

Re: Renee, Not All $50 Guppies will become Experienced SA's

** I'm stepping onto a slippery slope **

Our professions as signers have slippery slopes everywhere. A bird's eye view and spiked golf shoes are the best for navigation.

That's the difficulty of posting "advice." When I write or post, unless it's hard and fast Texas Notary Law - it's about not what the reader should do, it's posted as what I do...how I handle things.

A moral compass and the ability to step back and determine where one vague and sloping boundary ends and another begins is invaluable.

This very post is slippery and vague, yet it is not to go against either Renee' or Kelly above...it is to describe in my own words the paradox and/or contradiction of that which is being a signing agent.

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 5/14/06 10:26am
Msg #119782

I'm curious as to why one bothers reading all the boards if only to begin the rant that appears to disturb them. It appears they carefully choose their words and the stance is unclear at least to me. I recently read an article on another board that was deleted from this one, regarding the number of mistakes notaries make that they never hear about, I think it suggested 1 out of every 10 signings had flaws, the notary simply doesn't hear about them, the LO, lender makes a decision to let it slide due to time, etc., etc., etc.
I wish this article had included the countless mistakes made in the documentation the notary gets, we are not perfect, no one is, I think most, do the best we can.
The world is not perfect nor are the people in it, everyone deserves a chance even the (NOT MY WORDS-guppies of notaries) I for one have seldom offered advise on this or any board but have certainly listened and learned from those who have chosen to offer their advise and opinions, for the asking. It is entirely up to those who chose to ask for advise as to whether they take the advise as the gospel. There are many roles in life where the rules are often bent, I'm not saying this is right but this is the real world and things aren't perfect, I'm not, and in fact no one I know is. We learn every day of our life.....
It is indeed the American way and to each his or her own, they can run their business any way they see fit. None of us are GOD.

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 5/14/06 11:37am
Msg #119793

Re: TYPOS TYPOS TYPOS - That should have been advice n/m

Reply by BrendaTx on 5/14/06 5:00pm
Msg #119819

Re: This song has no title - **None of us are GOD.**

I knew this, but there are some who will debate that you!

Reply by TitleGalCA on 5/14/06 11:10am
Msg #119788

Not unclear at all

but it is a view from above, that's for sure.

The passing of the buck happens all the time and it is ***the American Way***. It's just sad to me that in this one industry, that affects the financial abilities of so many people, that there is a great deal of ignorance and lack of responsibility from almost all the players - the big corporate lenders who profit, the lenders employee's who turn a blind eye (or don't even know that they are turning a blind eye), the independent agents who appraise, inspect and sign, to the end-user's themselves, the borrowers. It's almost as though each little facet of the process is an independent interest, and not one wants or accepts responsibility for the end result, because they are not required to!

I remember when I eagerly awaited the variable rate on my loan to go away after five years, as the LO promised. When the time came, and my rate varied up (again), I called the lender and got a very legal sounding spiel over the phone, along with the statement "didn't you READ all your loan docs"? IMO, that's where the real problem is, the lack of education among the American Public about money, and I'm one of them.

A great philosophical point about the lack of accountability in this business.

Reply by ReneeK_MI on 5/14/06 12:20pm
Msg #119797

Re: Not unclear at all

TG - I don't know why so much of this dawned on me so recently, but ... it did. The lack of accountability plays right into the ease at which we would all like to step away from any 'slippery slope'. In effect, we're enabling this process by being what we perhaps SHOULD be. Irony, like gravity. Yeah, allow me to take the SA world down about 47 levels, WAY out into the deep water!

Kelly - yes, agree, many new people who become disenchanted will move on. Not a point I disagree with - the point was that they'll be immediately replaced, they're a constant factor regardless. And I guess that makes sense, that factor would be evidenced in any field, I imagine.

Lake Arrowhead - the post you reference remains posted, wasn't deleted. The point of that posting was really that everyone makes errors, and that certainly includes people doing the processing, but they just weren't the topic. I intend no offense to anyone with the analogy of 'guppy', and perhaps that sounded derogatory, I do apologize, really. It just was the 'visual' I had, of tons of new fish in a small pond.

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 5/14/06 1:40pm
Msg #119805

Re: Oh my mistake, I was told the article had been deleted

, I missed it on this site but did have the opportunity to read it on another. I did find the article interesting but somewhat one sided.
I wasn't offended by the term guppy but many new notaries may be, in suggesting they are fishlike, I simply wanted to make clear it was not my word. No harm no foul..... Again with many new notaries, one can't accept every work order they get a call for whether it be prior commitment, another signing same time frame, bad hair day or whatever reason. I know my capabilities I feel I have no competition and I never intended to make a million dollars in the notary biz. We are all individuals and how we run our business and the business choices we make are our own. We each face our maker in the end and one must be able to live with the decisions they make in all avenues of life not just this one area of expertise.

Reply by BrendaTx on 5/14/06 5:00pm
Msg #119820

Re: Oh my mistake, Just Curious...

Do you know why it was deleted?

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 5/14/06 5:24pm
Msg #119821

Re: Oh my mistake, Just Curious...

Apparently is was not deleted according to the above posting, I have no idea one way or another whether it has been. I never saw it here but I was told it had somehting to do with competition. These are not my words but told to me by another source. I read it on another board.

Reply by BrendaTx on 5/14/06 5:51pm
Msg #119822

Re: Oh my mistake, Just Curious...gotcha n/m