Posted by Les_CO on 8/28/07 9:46am
Msg #208119

Dumb Question?

When reading through some of these board messages/questions/answers I see many refer to the NNA (National Notary Association) as "xyz". Why? It surly is not advertising. I've been a member here for years and have NEVER seen anything good about them. Could they be considered a "competing" web site? I think not? Why not call a spade, a spade? Think you're going to get sued? However unlikely, a possibility I guess, as anyone can sue anybody, anytime, in this country. It's difficult to sue someone for their opinion. (Something about ‘free speech’) Just curious.

Reply by Charm_AL on 8/28/07 9:49am
Msg #208121

there was a big hoopla about us using their NNA name a few months ago, threatening letters were sent to the owner of the board. Therefore, out of respect for the forum NNA is now xyz Just so that there's no trouble for anyone having the misfortune of being associated or afflicted with/by them.

Reply by TRG_wy on 8/28/07 10:04am
Msg #208130

I'm with Les here.

If we can name names of others, good or bad, then the NNA doesn't deserve any better treatment. Unless Harry forbids the use of their name in discussions then I see no reason why we should give them the benefit of the doubt my re-naming them "XYZ". The same should go for SOX as well.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/28/07 10:18am
Msg #208135

If you guys remember, the NNA whined that they were being maligned everywhere and threatened to sue if their name was "taken in vain" again - here and elsewhere...so everyone had to back off...

Don't understand that - if we can tell it like it is for SS's and TC's why not any and all associations?

Reply by cyndi_ca on 8/28/07 10:20am
Msg #208137

Freedom of speech comes to mind

I don't get it either. Does that mean we only have freedom of speech if it is nice?

Reply by MikeC/NY on 8/28/07 12:03pm
Msg #208183

Freedom of speech only applies to the government...

... not to privately owned forums. The owner gets to set the rules as far as what is and what isn't allowed. Harry is the benevolent dictator of this realm and the final arbiter of all disputes; if he doesn't want to see it (for whatever reason), it ain't going to be here...

Reply by Teddog/CO on 8/28/07 10:29am
Msg #208141

Agree with Les and TRG. The Western folks pretty much like to "cut-to-the-chase" when dealing with problems or problem children. Walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, must be a duck. I really do not see any harm in give the names as long a you state JMO in the post. After all you are posting you personal experiences.
PSS,
I am very glad to see people posting the companies that are no pays and slowww pays. It is very rough out there and we need to help each other in every way we can. None of us can afford to "donate" our time, supplies and services for free. This board and Notary Beware have saved my butt more then once before I went out on a signing that was from a no pay. Whew!! Thanks and glad I had my No No List handy.

Reply by Les_CO on 8/28/07 10:19am
Msg #208136

Thanks!

In my opinion.....ALL we NSA's have been afflicted by misfortune and trouble by them! By association or not!

I guess I will just curse their existence under my breath.

However as a paying MEMBER of the National Notary Association (yes, sadly, I joined years ago, and paid several years in advance because they sent me 'membership expiration notices' every three months (sloppy bookkeeping on my part) or so. I should be able to use their 'name' and offer my opinion of their membership services with impunity. I will try and not cause the ownership of this board that I consider to be of great and valuable service to the notary community, any headaches.

Reply by Charm_AL on 8/28/07 10:26am
Msg #208140

actually, it's not about 'nice', they turned it to say slanderous and accused us of being libel for the comments made about them in public. Which, not to mention, weren't very pretty, if ya get my meanin'.

Reply by Les_CO on 8/28/07 10:40am
Msg #208148

The TRUTH is not slander. One should always be held accountable for what they say. If its a FACT be able to back it up. If it's an opinion, it's your opinion, or perhaps a widly held opinion, it's still an opinion.

Reply by Charm_AL on 8/28/07 10:44am
Msg #208150

there were a LOT of opinions being thrown around and the NNA decided to round it up. Some of us are not actively involved with the NNA for various reasons but have a lot to share. They don't be liken' that

We were personally asked by the owner to turn it down a bit.

Reply by Les_CO on 8/28/07 10:54am
Msg #208161

I shall acquiesce...for now. However, please keep in mind that I am somewhat dyslexic and have a tendency to get things backward. So If in future I mention the pseudonym NNA, I 'm probably refering to the "Avaricious Neophyte Notary" group, not affiliated with XYZ.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 8/28/07 5:03pm
Msg #208241

Yep! I got one of those lovely, letters, too. They actually threatened to bring a libel action for making statements that they felt were unfounded. Harry forwarded their communication to those involved and offered us several choices as to how to respond. (I suspect most of us chose to have our posts removed from the board...) I thought it was handled by him very well and I was very appreciative of his support.

The upshot is that it became apparent that someone in the NNA legal department is carefully perusing these boards. The lesson I learned is to be sure to make it clear in any comments that I am expressing my own opinions and not purporting anything I say to be statements of fact. Some people chose to react by substituting XYZ for NNA, I guess. I will still say what I think, but I will be more careful about how I word it... I confess, it was a bit intimidating, which I IMAGINE was their intent! JMHO!!! ;>

(BTW, off the top of my head, I believe "libel" relates to written communications and "slander" relates to verbal statements. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong...)

Reply by MelissaCT on 8/28/07 10:51am
Msg #208158

Re: Wasn't there just a ruling

that a board owner can't be held responsible for content by posters? I believe it went to the Supreme Court & may have involved Yahoo! & the court ruled the message board or blog owner couldn't be held responsible for what posters write. I'll have to dig up a link to the article.

Reply by Charm_AL on 8/28/07 10:53am
Msg #208160

Re: Wasn't there just a ruling

I believe this is a case of 'why go thru the trouble'?

Reply by MelissaCT on 8/28/07 11:04am
Msg #208165

Re: Wasn't there just a ruling - ok, so Feb 07, not "just"

www.techdirt.com/articles/20060606/0323235.shtml

Reply by Charm_AL on 8/28/07 11:08am
Msg #208167

Re: Wasn't there just a ruling - ok, so Feb 07, not "just"

methinks we're trying to fly under the radar....easier that way.

Reply by Vince/KS on 8/28/07 12:42pm
Msg #208186

Discussion can be expensive

Years ago a firm I was associated with a company that explained several items to customers regarding a particular product and why it was not a very good buy. The product was really lousy, but the company that produced it made a great deal of money. Enough money that they had a full time legal staff that tied up companies that printed information about them that was not favorable. We refered the matter to our attorney with the idea that the truth will win out. After several discussion, our attorney let us know that we were being questioned on how much money were we prepared to pay in legal fees to fight for the right to continue to print reports regarding the product. Solution for us was to point customers to information that had to be filed by organization - specifically with a state department where all financial information was required to be filed.

It is usually better to not muddy the waters by attacking anyone - sometimes you may have to defend your position and that defense may take more money than you have. At least that's my two cents worth (but also as a member of that organization that questions several positions that they take - but hey, you cannot keep everyone happy).