Posted by Pier National Notary - Paul on 8/16/07 7:19pm
Msg #206024

We pay within 5 days of receiving Docs!!

Hey Everyone,
We want your feedback.

We hear you! Not getting paid sucks! We do charge a sign-up fee but we also pay fair and now within 5 business days of escrow receiving docs.

So long as our clients do not have any signing conditions due to notary errors, we mail your check off.

What do you think? Let us know!

Reply by Rachel/ORWA on 8/16/07 7:23pm
Msg #206026

With all due respect, if you need a sign-up fee to be part of your income, your strategic plan needs some tweaking. JMO

Reply by LisaWI on 8/16/07 7:25pm
Msg #206027

Silly Question

and not meant to be demeaning, but why are you getting into this business with the way everything is right now? Isnt that a great big risk to you? What can you offer besides your fast payment that others are not offering?
And what is this fee you talk about?
I dont think you will get many takers on this. Most do not want to pay a fee to get work. You would have to have a really good sale on that one.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 8/16/07 7:36pm
Msg #206030

Check thread starting message 187186 n/m

Reply by Pier National Notary - Paul on 8/16/07 7:37pm
Msg #206031

Re: Silly Question

1. We have been in business for 3 years and truly enjoy what we do. We are still in business and growing.

2. We have a diverse client base. Reverse Mortgage is picking up for us and the profit margin is slim with these. So, we need a way to pass this business onto notaries nationwide.

3. Very good questions. Other signing services are going under and leaving notaries unpaid. We are trying to keep the channels open and get the work to notaries and get rid of the uncertainty of not being paid on-time. 5 day payment to notaries is above the current industry standard. And we are trying to find a way not to drop the fees we pay our notaries. We don't pay notaries lowered fees as compared to the industry. We believe in paying for quality.

Any other questions or suggestions?

Reply by Charles_Ca on 8/16/07 8:20pm
Msg #206050

I suggest that you answer the question, What is the fee,

and what do you get for the fee besides the potential of work which may never come?

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 8/16/07 7:32pm
Msg #206029

I pay as soon as the signing is completed, I pay a fair fee - and full fee for no-signs and loans not funding. And I do not charge a sign up fee!

Why any company needs to charge a sign up fee beats me. The only possible reason is they do not have the capital to pay their notaries. They want the notaries to fund their business! Not going to happen!

Reply by Calnotary on 8/16/07 7:45pm
Msg #206032

Is that a new thing because I have worked for them and never received my payment in 5 days and their fees are not that great! Sorry~

Reply by Pier National Notary - Paul on 8/16/07 7:49pm
Msg #206034

This is new. We have previously paid when escrow paid us. We are using a combination of captial and notary sign-ups to get you paid much sooner.

Reply by Roger_OH on 8/16/07 8:07pm
Msg #206037

We'll all be waiting for this answer, Paul...

So what's your policy on no-signs at the table?

Importantly, if a loan rescinds, are you still going to pay full fee to the notary who has already completed the signing responsibility he/she was hired for, and has no control over what happens after that?

Reply by CJ on 8/16/07 8:13pm
Msg #206042

Questions and observations.

How much do you pay for one regular signing (one loan, docs overnighted)?

If I pay per month to work for you, how many jobs can you give me? I know you realisticaly can't promise, but if I get only one job per month, then already my fee is reduced by my monthly fee. And what if I get no jobs that month? Then I am paying for nothing.
I am in about 100 databases. They all call me once in a while. I wish each of them would call me at least once a month. Some call me only twice a year. But I would lose a lot of money if I had to pay each of them every month to be in their database.

That is just how I see it.

Reply by Pier National Notary - Paul on 8/16/07 11:09pm
Msg #206096

Re: We'll all be waiting for this answer, Paul...

Roger,
Yes, with a paid membership. We pay within business 5 days of escrow receiving docs, even if the loan is canceled.

Reply by Pier National Notary - Paul on 8/16/07 7:47pm
Msg #206033

Re: Sylvia

Thank you for your post.
We actually have capital. Please feel free to ask any notary about our history of paying. We are growing in this market because of aggressive marketing and signing rates charged to our clients. But, honestly, that does dip into the profit margin, we are all in business together.

How can I pass and pay notaries fairly without a joint effort? If a notary invests an average of $8.25 a month to keep us processing and that keeps the notary pay-outs at a respectable fee, doesn't that justify a healthy business relationship?

Notaries are not funding our business. We have spent the last 3 years building our pipeline for them. And now we are growing even more. Why should I give away the pipeline or allow my compeition to under cut us and pay notaries less for their quality work?

Reply by PAW on 8/16/07 8:08pm
Msg #206039

Let's make a deal

I will gladly pay you $8.25 per month for the privilege of being in your database. In return, Pier will pay me a minimum of $125 (average fee for a signing) each month. Sound fair to you? If so, check my profile for contact information.

Reply by Rachel/ORWA on 8/16/07 8:10pm
Msg #206040

Re: Sylvia

Yes, you are undercutting notaries; you're just trying to spread it around. Let's say out you give an assignment to 1 out of every 5 notaries signed up with your company. So, instead of asking the one notary to reduce their fee by $45, you ask five notaries to pay you $45 (5 x$9).

It may work for you, if you can get enough people to fall for it, but count me out.

Reply by Dennis D Broadbooks on 8/16/07 8:10pm
Msg #206041

Guys & Gals...

...you've just witnessed the reincarnation of Jamie Jessup.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 8/16/07 8:15pm
Msg #206046

Re: Guys & Gals...

Sure sounds like it - except JJ is (unfortunately) still in Florida.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 8/16/07 8:13pm
Msg #206044

Re: Sylvia

If you need notaries to pay a fee to sign up so you can pay respectable fees, then yes you are relying on notaries to fund your business!

Reply by MikeC/NY on 8/16/07 8:15pm
Msg #206045

Re: notaries paying for signings

<<How can I pass and pay notaries fairly without a joint effort? If a notary invests an average of $8.25 a month to keep us processing and that keeps the notary pay-outs at a respectable fee, doesn't that justify a healthy business relationship?>>

No, it doesn't. Why would anyone pay you "an average of $8.25 a month" (which translates to about $100 a year) unless you're willing to guarantee a level of work that will make that expense worthwhile? My investment here as a premier member of Notary Rotary was paid back in less than a week - can you match that?

There are too many people trying to get their hands in our pockets, and it seems like you're just another one. I don't want to hear about "healthy business relationships", or any of that other meaningless nonsense. Either tell me in plain English what it is you're going to do for me - with specifics as far as "respectable fees" are concerned - or go away.

Reply by C_in_OKC on 8/16/07 8:26pm
Msg #206052

So if these guys get just 100 notaries to sign up that's $825 profit per month without doing a blasted thing. How does anyone even know if these guys are GETTING signings from companies to assign out? What real motivation would they have to even seek out signings if they're getting paid for doing what amounts to nothing?

As someone once said, "I may have been born at night, but it wasn't last night."

Reply by docs1954CA on 8/16/07 8:46pm
Msg #206063

They aren't answering the question we want to know...

What do you pay? O/D? E-docs.What do you pay?What do you pay?What do you pay?What do you pay?What do you pay?What do you pay?What do you pay?What do you pay?What do you pay?What do you pay?

Reply by Pier National Notary - Paul on 8/16/07 11:20pm
Msg #206098

Re: They aren't answering the question we want to know...

$75 for overnight
$25 for e-docs
$40 for attached 2nd.
*Signings will be within 10 miles of your place of business. If not, then we'll adjust the fees for extended travel.

You can visit us at piernational.com

Thanks for your response.

Reply by Blueink_CA on 8/16/07 11:29pm
Msg #206100

Re: They aren't answering the question we want to know...

Most companies pay that or more, and they don't charge us to work for them (or to be in their database). But, your plan, if successful is brilliant. If say 3000 desperate newbies go for this, then you're making almost $25,000 a month. Pay me half of that, and I'll phone interview your prospects. Yeah right. Do you have a brother named Barry?

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 8/17/07 8:19am
Msg #206137

Re: They aren't answering the question we want to know...

And you believe those fees are fair?
I started out paying $75 for overnight (within 10 miles) and $35 for edocs. This year - because of the increased cost to notaries to do business - gas etc, I raised the base fee to $100, and still $35 for the edocs. So a notary doing a signing for me with edocs would get a base of $135. And I pay full fee whether the loan closes or not.
There is one title company that uses me that pays me well enough so I can pay $150 with edocs, and on some of their signings I have even been able to pay $200. (Depends on the lender)
The notary does the signing one day, the check goes in the mail the next day - even though I sometimes have to wait two weeks before I get my check.
And I see no reason to have the notaries pay me a sign up fee.

Reply by Becca_FL on 8/16/07 10:16pm
Msg #206089

My personal experience with PNN-LONG (PAW & Sylvia pls read)

Hi Paul,

I have had the opportunity to work with your company very recently and can vouch for the fact that you do pay in a timely manner. However, I did not pay a fee to be listed and I believe your company found me by way of Notary Rotary.

I did a closing for your company on July 5th and then again on July 6th. The closing on the 5th was adjourned by the borrower because the terms were not what he was expecting and the unsecured debts he was expecting to be paid at funding were not listed on the HUD. BTW, this was investment property so the RTC did not apply. We called the LO and I called to report to your company before leaving the borrowers home. I also had the borrower complete my “refusal to sign” form.

I received a called to return the next day, but could not get to the borrower until 9pm that night. The borrower was a super-sweet guy and agreed to meet with me late. The closing on the 6th was a success! All issues were fixed and the borrower was happy. I fax the required “Professional Standards for Loan Closings” to your office that night. The next morning I had four packages to triple check and an appointment @ 11am. I checked your package, included an invoice and got it off to FedEx for Monday delivery. The document package was in your

On Monday, I received a call from (I think it was you) PNN, saying that I had missed an acknowledgement. I asked that you fax me the doc and assured you that if it was my mistake, I would gladly fix the problem as I guarantee my work 100%. When I received the fax, it was clear to me that I did not miss anything. The document that you were requesting me to notarize was a document to be singed by the settlement agent, stating and notarized.

Well, of course, when I situation like this arises, I contact the experts. I emailed a sanitized copy of the document to Sylvia and Paul and they both agreed with me, that this document was to be signed by the settlement agent and notarized. I felt much better knowing that had done the right thing.

The document stated that the settlement agent had provided a copy of the title commitment to the borrower and that the settlement agent had explained each exception to the borrower. The jurat on this document was directly after the settlement agent’s signature line and the first page, where the borrower signed simply said the undersigned…hereby certify and agree as follows. There was nothing in the document saying that the borrower was swearing to anything. The only signor of the document swearing to anything was the settlement agent. For some reason, your closing department could not understand this and insisted that I send a jurat even after I explained that it was against Florida law.

When I explained to your closing department that I simply can not send a jurat, I was met with extreme arrogance and rudeness. For the sake of the borrower, I told the EO that I would make arrangements with the borrower, at his convenience, to have the document signed and notarized as long as I received instructions, in writing, to notarize the document. The EO got very upset with me and said “don’t you contact my borrower again. I’ll just find someone to fix your mistake.” I said, again, what you are asking me to do is against the law and I will not jeopardize my commission for you or anyone else. She went on to say that I was a horrible notary because I would not fix my mistake. I said I was more than willing to fix the problem even though it was not my mistake, for the sake of the borrower. Then she said “you’re just the notary and what makes you think you know more than the lawyers that created the docs.” I said, I’m a Florida notary and I know the laws that govern what I do, apparently more so than the California attorney that created the document. The conversation pretty much ended there. I guess they found a notary that doesn't mind breaking the law or they just redrew the docs. Either way it doesn't matter because that particular lender bit the dust as of 8/6/07 (Aegis) and we won't be seeing any of their screwy docs anymore.

I wanted to post this because I think it’s important to point out a few facts about Pier National Notary that I experienced first hand.

FACT 1) PNN paid me within 30 days of the closing.
FACT 2) PNN paid me a fair fee to facilitate the closing.
FACT 3) PNN paid me full fee for the no-close on the 5th
FACT 4) PNN requested that I commit an illegal act and became rude and condescending when I refused to oblige them.

FWIW

Reply by Becca_FL on 8/16/07 10:28pm
Msg #206091

I think I should clarify...

Everyone I spoke with at PNN was very friendly. The only person that was rude to me was the EO. However, I kind of got the impression that PNN was an in-house SS for the TC.

Again, FWIW.

Reply by GF_CA on 8/16/07 10:42pm
Msg #206093

Re: I think I should clarify...

I had the opportunity to work for Pier National Notary also. They paid always in less then 30 days, until my last signing, Dec. 20, 2006, I was paid March 21, 2006 and $10 less of my fee. One signing borrower cancel and I got paid only $40

Reply by Pier National Notary - Paul on 8/16/07 11:07pm
Msg #206094

Re: I think I should clarify...

All your responses are very helpful. What is more beneficial to our company?
1. A one-time fee from a notary for signing up. We make $8.25/mo. per notary.
or
2. Cut the fees we pay our notaries. We make up to $10-20 more per closing.
(Maybe we'll just lower our notary fees by $10)

I see many notaries complain in these forums that so and so called them and offered them $45 for a signing. If I cut my fees in half, I could easily create more revenue. But why hire poor quality notaries.

It an interesting issue. How much is a database worth with a bunch of notaries signing up for free and no one can follow-up on their background. It costs money.

We all know the NNA Gold Star isn't worth much. But why do SS just take the word of a notary that they are qualified. Well, we don't. We need to call their references and speak with each notary that wants to join our database in order for that database to be worth anything. A poor quality or new notary can cost themselves $100 but cost a SS thousands of dollars.

We use part of the revenue from sign-ups to staff people to call their references and we call each notary. If they are new to the business, we train them with our own staff. If the quality of mobile notary closings does not improve, all of us will be making less per signing.

FYI, to answer the question about if we pay for canceled signings. The answer is yes. And yes, in the past we only paid $40 for canceled. We don't like it as much as you don't. We aren't getting paid for these non-fundings.

We have changed many things with our company and of course, when you have volume, you going to have a few horror stories.

I appreciate your feedback and understand your concerns.

Reply by jojo_MN on 8/16/07 11:43pm
Msg #206103

Re: I think I should clarify...

So, what do you get per signing from the entity that hires you?

Reply by Becca_FL on 8/16/07 11:51pm
Msg #206106

Jolien, I don't discuss my fees on the forums...

for obvious reasons. I'll send you a PM.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 8/17/07 8:11am
Msg #206136

Re: Jolien, I don't discuss my fees on the forums...

Becca
I believe Jolene was asking Paul (PNN) how much he is getting from the company that hires him to find a notary.

Reply by jojo_MN on 8/17/07 9:20am
Msg #206158

Re: Jolien, I don't discuss my fees on the forums...

Thank you, Sylvia.
Yes, that IS what I'm asking. I'm trying to find out why a signing service finds it necessary to make even more off the notaries than they already get. I work for many generous SS's that get double what I'm getting. There are others out there that get $200 over and above what we get and then refuse to pay us $75 (an example only).

Reply by MelissaCT on 8/17/07 8:37am
Msg #206142

Re: I think I should clarify...QUESTION

"We use part of the revenue from sign-ups to staff people to call their references and we call each notary. If they are new to the business, we train them with our own staff. If the quality of mobile notary closings does not improve, all of us will be making less per signing."

So, not only do we have to pay a monthly fee (vs a one-time fee), but also have to provide references? Is this so you can "build your pipeline"? Conducting a phone interview would take less time & IMO, be more productive in screening notaries, IF that is the motive behind taking & calling references.

Count me out.

Reply by MonicaFL on 8/17/07 9:13am
Msg #206155

Re: I think I should clarify...

This is something I have never been able to understand. Why, Why, Why would you (the SS) NOT make it part of your contractual agreement with the lenders, etc., that, even if a loan doesn't fund, that you still get paid your full fee (and, pay your notary their full fee)? If the loan doesn't fund, 99% of the time it is negligence on the part of the LO, Lender or TC - NOT the notary or SS. I just had a situation that the loan didn't close (after I printed out 300 pieces of paper and travelled 25 miles one way - and on a Saturday) because the LO wasn't honest with the borrower and all the figures had changed drastically from what was originally agreed upon and the borrower had no clue that these changes were taking place? Now the company that hired me wants to only pay be $50 - --------- Take this to mind - if you go to see a lawyer for something and his consultation fee is $125.00 and after consulting with him you decided you didn't like what he had to say and told him that because you didn't like what he had to say you weren't going to pay him his $125.00 but perhaps you might pay him $50.00 for "his time". Do you think that would fly? I don't think so. So, why should be expect to be paid any less for our servicesfrom a SS, TC, Broker or Lender!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Reply by jojo_MN on 8/17/07 9:22am
Msg #206161

AMEN! n/m

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 8/17/07 9:46am
Msg #206168

Re: I think I should clarify...

Companies I work with know that they have to pay full fee if the loan doesn't fund. If it is a no-sign then I only bill the company the fee I pay to the signing agent - the signing agent gets his/her full fee, and I make nothing on the deal. There are very few no-signs so it is no big deal.

I do know of one signing service here in Florida (now defunct!) that only paid 1/2 fee for no signs etc, yet he was getting the full fee from the title companies. That is wrong!!

Reply by Becca_FL on 8/16/07 11:07pm
Msg #206095

Re: I think I should clarify...GF_CA

When I deal with a new to me SS, TC, broker or lender, I always add this disclaimer to my email correspondence. Perhaps, that is why I received full fee for the no-close.

BTW, Thank you to Melissa/FL for the blurb.

Note: This email confirms our fee agreement made by phone
and the price quoted is the fee agreed upon by both parties
and is not subject to arbitrary reduction or increase by either
party. Your invoice will be for the amount you agreed on...
no exceptions. No Show, No Sign or No Fund all receive Full Fee. If this is
not agreeable with you, please cancel this order immediately
before documents are printed.

Reply by Pier National Notary - Paul on 8/16/07 11:24pm
Msg #206099

Re: Going to sleep

Everyone, thanks again for your responses. They were are very helpful.

I must get some sleep because I have to work tomorrow.

Reply by Monica Valle-Cavero on 8/17/07 5:36am
Msg #206125

Re: I think I should clarify...GF_CA

Becca,

Well put! It is important for all TC's and SS's to understand that we work hard and are due respect. Although there may be times that there is a new notary that makes a mistake, that should not be taken out on the rest of us who are professional.

Reply by sue_pa on 8/17/07 6:13am
Msg #206126

I would pay $8.?? monthly to be listed with your company. My base fee is more than Paul - I generally charge (and by the way receive) $150 per loan. $140 for a double e-mail? You've got to be kidding!!!! My condition for paying the $8.?? would be that it be deducted from my last check issued each month, provided I received the equivalent of one order per week and the 3 previous checks are issued within the 5 days. By the way, I receive MANY checks on disbusement so within 5 days in itself isn't that unusual if you've got the right clients.