Posted by Vince/KS on 7/26/07 10:38pm
Msg #202131

Proper ID questioned

Okay, the documents arrive late, drive 40 miles, sit at coffee table for signing (table too big of a mess to sit at she says) and Mrs Marie A Smith provides her license and a copy of it to take with me. The problem - the TC specifically said she is to sign as Marie Smith-Jones. She has zero identification for that name. She does have a SS card that has name printed on it as Marie Artful Jones (does 1 and 1 = 2?). Nothing else. We are talking to Loan company and the manager joins the conversation while we are discussing proper ID. He said (among many other things) do not do anything to jeopardize your Notary license uncomfortable with the ID status. I also talked with TC that suggested a quit claim probably should have been done as she clearly is not using the name as prepared within the docs. But with torn feelings walked away from this woman who wanted to proceed with the signing. After leaving, called TC rep and explained exactly what transpired. Then received a call a while later from another “supervisor” that wanted to know exactly what the situation was. He had a call from the LO wanting full explanation as they were very unhappy. After explaining, he said he understood and would support my decision to walk away from it. Overall, it didn’t feel right, even if the woman could have a hyphenated name, and she may have been Jones before, is Smith now and may also go verbally by Smith-Jones - but, no photo ID backing the name in the docs. Anyone had a similar experience(s)?

Reply by JohnnyB on 7/26/07 10:53pm
Msg #202133

yes, mostly everyone has. I had a borrower who had proper id and a wife who had no U.S. ID documentation. The title company tried to me persuade me that the ID was ok. They said the lender was a large client of theirs and their business life depended on it. I stuck to my guns and did not notarize that package. I do not work for that company anymore.
I think they got their scheduler to notarize that mortgage.

Reply by NCLisa on 7/26/07 11:09pm
Msg #202138

I usually ask the TC if they would like the borrower to sign all the docs I notarize as Marie Smith-Jones AKA Marie Smith, and that I will notarize only the Marie Smith name. Then we can adjust the AKA statement. I've never had a TC have a problem with that.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 7/26/07 11:31pm
Msg #202144

I've done that successfully, too, but only if I felt reasonably comfortable with it, e.g., the borrower has previous IDs showing Marie Jones and current ID says Marie Smith and everything else (picture, signature) matches, or something to that affect. If there is enough documentation that my gut is making me more queasy about having to say no, than saying yes, I'll offer that as an option. I've also never heard of it being a problem. Always a good idea, though, to check with the client first, if possible.

Reply by CJ on 7/27/07 11:08am
Msg #202226

Witnesses

In California, you can have two adults (not named in the documents) with proper ID, swear to the person's identity. You put their IDs, names, addresses, signatures and thumbprints in the Notary book and say, "Witnesses for so-and-so".

I use this with elderly who have no ID, people with expired ID, people who have their nickname on their DL (I have no idea why), illegal aliens, newlyweds, etc. They can usually get on the phone and get grown kids or neighbors to come over.

I am sure you know, but SS does not count as ID. ID has to have a picture, a description, a number and an expiration date. (But still, it can't be a Costco card).

Reply by MistarellaFL on 7/27/07 11:52am
Msg #202240

How about representative capacity?

Marie Smith who represented to me that she was f/k/a (or a/k/a) Marie Smith-Jones

Reply by PAW on 7/27/07 2:25pm
Msg #202291

Re: How about representative capacity?

CA doesn't allow capacity. I don't think FL is unique in this aspect, but I'm not sure which states do allow a representative capacity statement in the notarial certificate.

Reply by dickb/wi on 7/27/07 12:09pm
Msg #202244

i thought in ca you could only use cw if the borrower...

was unable to obtain photo id..[not could get it but didnt--but couldn't get it]...am i wrong?

Reply by JanetK_CA on 7/27/07 8:33pm
Msg #202375

You are right...

which is why the aka option may be the best thing to do.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 7/27/07 9:26pm
Msg #202388

Re: Witnesses

In the original question (posted by someone who is not from CA), the person had a presumably unexpired, acceptable ID, but the names didn't match. Very different situation. Like Dickb/WI said, in CA CWs are only supposed to be used when it is difficult or impossible for the signer to get an acceptable ID. Some on this board would take very strong issue with some of the circumstances you described. (And again, of course, only the name on the ID goes on the certificate.)

BTW, I'm very familiar with the ID requirements for CA, including use of credible witnesses. I actually did 2 CW signings just this week for signers without acceptable ID for reasons I won't go into. I don't do those very often, so it was unusual for me to have two so close together.

Reply by Vince/KS on 7/27/07 12:15pm
Msg #202247

Re: Proper ID questioned - follow up with TC

Talked with the title company again this AM. Apparently the BO was divorced three years ago. The divorce decree changed her name to Marie A Smith. The title person said the former notary on the last loan (after the divoce) allowed for the old name to be used. Then went on to say that a quit claim should have been done on the Smith-Jones name as the decree is on record and changed title to Marie A Smith and new docs issued in that name only...