Posted by Robin_IN on 6/9/07 11:37am
Msg #194346

Signing service closed and docs dated wrong....

Help appreciated! I have a Countrywide signing today through FASS and all the docs are dated Monday, 6/11. When you call FASS, they don't say they are closed, but I was on hold for 50 minutes before I hung up. (I've called both their numbers...CW team and FASS) I've had both scenarios - some will have you cross through and redate all docs, others want docs redrawn. This signing is an hour and a half away so I really hate to change all docs and on Monday get told this was incorrect. Anybody had this happen that has experience with FASS/Countrywide div? I've even tried to get to the loan officer and I can't reach anybody to answer my question! TIA!

Reply by kathy/ca on 6/9/07 11:49am
Msg #194348

So what if they are dated Monday? Date your notary certs the

date you sign and notarize. Dont worry about the date on the docs and unless instructed to do so, I never change that date.

Reply by Robin_IN on 6/9/07 12:16pm
Msg #194349

Re: So what if they are dated Monday? Date your notary certs the

I always understood that you couldn't sign a loan before the printed date on the docs - you could after, while correcting the dates on the security docs. I actually just got a call from the one person that is working at FASS today, and she told me to reschedule because of this. Thanks for your input though!

Reply by Terri_CA on 6/9/07 1:33pm
Msg #194357

Re: So what if they are dated Monday? Date your notary certs the

Glad that you did get a response. In all cases where docs are dated after the actual signing date, get instructions on how to proceed and document, document, document, who you spoke to and what those instructions were!

Terri
Lancaster, CA

Reply by ananotary on 6/9/07 12:48pm
Msg #194351

I would have cancelled this signing. How do you notarize

Docs that don't technically exist yet? This has come up in the past for me.

Reply by Lisa Wood on 6/9/07 1:04pm
Msg #194354

Re: I would have cancelled this signing. How do you notarize

I have had this same situation numerous times with WAMU docs and I was instucted by the lender to have docs signed and notarized with the current date (date of signing), even though docs were dated for a future date. Crazy I know!

Reply by Lee/AR on 6/9/07 1:53pm
Msg #194359

Re: I would have cancelled this signing. How do you notarize

And every one of these lenders thinks "of course, everybody knows that~~(whatever way they handle it)~~is universally acceptable."

Reply by Robin_IN on 6/9/07 2:47pm
Msg #194365

Re: I would have cancelled this signing. How do you notarize

Thanks everyone. Terri, that is what was so frustrating was that it appeared that FASS was closed today and I wasn't going to get hold of anyone to give me instructions - so I was trying to make a judgment call, as well as call on the expertise and experiences of fellow signing agents. You are right Lee - too bad there isn't a universal solution, but everyone thinks their way is the right/only way. Again, thanks for the info!

Reply by kathy/ca on 6/9/07 4:21pm
Msg #194374

Had this come up many times with WaMu docs, always told

me to put the signing date on the notary certs and ignore their document dates. Many times these are Washington Mutual loans that the borrower finds their own notary to notarize.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 6/9/07 4:42pm
Msg #194377

Re: I would have cancelled this signing. How do you notarize

Whether or not the docs "technically" exist is a matter to be defined either by state law (if it's addressed at all) or by the lender. As we've seen, different lenders have different ideas about this. It's not for us to decide. Which can create quite a dilemma, as Robin found out!

Reply by ananotary on 6/10/07 11:32am
Msg #194437

What I meant was I would have cancelled the signing

If I was unable to contact any hiring entity with instructions UNLESS I knew for a fact that I was getting a full fee regardless. That is based on my past experience with this same situation. I've never had it happen with WaMU. Now I know. Thanks everyone!

Reply by MikeC/NY on 6/10/07 6:45pm
Msg #194448

Re: Notarizing docs that "don't technically exist yet"

Of course the docs exist - they're right there in front of you.

They don't become EFFECTIVE until the date printed on them, but unless directed otherwise by whoever drew them, there's no reason they can't be signed and notarized prior to their effective date.

Reply by kathy/ca on 6/10/07 6:48pm
Msg #194449

Precisely my point, I would have gone through with the sign

ing. The TC and lender are not going to be happy about this.

Reply by ananotary on 6/10/07 7:50pm
Msg #194450

Well then I guess you would do it but I wouldn't without

Instructions to do it. The date of the doc proves when it exists IMO (and past loan signings that I have had this issue arise) and notarizing before the documents is dated....well enough about my opinion.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 6/10/07 9:47pm
Msg #194454

Re: Well then I guess you would do it but I wouldn't without

<<The date of the doc proves when it exists IMO >>

You're confusing "exists" with "effective date" - other than specific instructions from the drawer (or state law), there's nothing that prohibits you from notarizing signatures on a document before its effective date. You can't insist that the document "doesn't exist yet" when you're holding the document in your hand...

The document "exists" at the moment it's created - why should you care what date it has written on it? Your notarization has nothing to do with the date on the document, you're only attesting to the fact that the signers acknowledged their signatures before you TODAY, or signed and swore to the contents of the document before you TODAY. The fact that the document carries a date in the past or future is irrelevant as far as the notary is concerned - all that matters is the date the signers are appearing before the notary.

Unless the lender has specific instructions about when the docs must be signed, I don't concern myself about the date on the docs. They could be dated next year or last year; the only thing I care about is the date I actually notarize.

Reply by kathy/ca on 6/10/07 10:25pm
Msg #194457

Mike, I agree and to cancel the signing was in my opinion

nor the right thing to do. It would have been better to do the signing and find our later, docs needed to be redrawn. Again, just my opinion and what I would have done. Like Mike said, content of the documents is not our concern, date of Notarization is.

Reply by Robin_IN on 6/11/07 10:08am
Msg #194484

Re: Mike, I agree and to cancel the signing was in my opinion

I ended up cancelling this because I DID get a call from the SS and they told me to cancel.