Posted by rmd_SoCalif on 6/18/07 2:26pm
Msg #195648

signing docs on a "Living Trust" acct

How are borrower's suppose to sign docs if they have a trust account? I was told (by a siging service) that the borrower's are to sign their name and the work "trustee" after every document including all loan docs? ??

Reply by cara on 6/18/07 2:38pm
Msg #195649

Who or what is the signing entity? If it is a trust, it must be signed by a trustee. How someone signs legal person (corporations, trusts, etc,) But, do not guess, asking the escrow officer would be best. JMHO.

Reply by Todd Atkins on 6/18/07 4:01pm
Msg #195664

I have done signings involving trusts several times but only one as a contract notary. I remember asking specifically how the docs should be signed. I was never given clear instructions. I went back two days later to do the signing all over. Never mind the wife insisted on signing in calligraphy - took forever.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 6/18/07 4:27pm
Msg #195667

I've done countless signings with docs in a trust. I've long since decided to ALWAYS ask the client how they want the docs to be signed, and I nearly always get a different answer, in at least some small way. Everyone has their own idea and there isn't one right answer. What the ss told you could very well be correct. If you don't trust them, by all means ask the escrow officer, unless your ss doesn't want you to contact them. Otherwise, do as they've asked. No one here has enough information to be able to tell you what to do in this individual case. BTW, pay especial attention to the Note and DOT.

Reply by CJ on 6/18/07 6:45pm
Msg #195688

Living Trust Signing Help.

I sign lots of trusts. When the property is in the trust, the trust owns the property, not the "borrowers". But the borrowers control the trust. I say it is like a safe that you buy to put your jewels in: the safe holds the jewels, but you hold the safe.

So the "trustees" are the owners of the property, but the "individuals" are the borrowers. The docs need the Owners AND the borrowers to sign.

SO, if the line says, "John Smith", then they sign John Smith.
If it says, "John Smith Trustee", then they sign "John Smith, Trustee".

if their name is printed "John Smith" and "John Smith, Trustee", then they have to sign twice, both ways.

Usually, the trustees have to sign the DOT, the TIL, and the RTC. You will notice these are the same documents that have to be signed when the husband and wife own the property together, but the only the husband is borrowing.

You can tell if a property is in the trust because the DOT will say, "John Smith and Mary Smith, Trustees of the Blah-Blah-Blah Trust, Dated July 4th, 2001". This is helpful, becuase on the Trust Certification, they always ask, "What is the exact name of the trust?" And you can find it on the Deed of Trust. Then they ask for the date it was created, which the borrowers never know, but that is that date on the Deed of Trust. The "Settlors" are the creators of the trust", the "Trustees" are the controllers of the trust (your borrowers). They are usually the same people, but sometimes mom and dad are the settlors.

I used to sell living trusts. I was not a good sales person, but I learned a lot. Living trusts protect your estate from tens of thousands of dollars in probate. They cost about $2000, but then the estate can be passed to the kids with just a few signatures. We bought one for my mother-in-law to make sure we don't have to go through probate. The siblings are protected too according to Mom's wishes, but we know it will be smooth sailing when she is gone: we will get our share intact, and the siblings will get their share intact. No attorneys getting a hefty portion.

Many times there is a grant deed to take a property out of a trust, and not an following grant deed to put it back in the trust. I tell the borrowers to make sure after the loan closes to follow up on that.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 6/18/07 10:07pm
Msg #195709

Re: Living Trusts

<<Living trusts protect your estate from tens of thousands of dollars in probate. They cost about $2000>>

You can create one through LegalZoom.com for about $200, and can do it yourself for about $30 (the cost of a book from Nolo Press that explains it all and includes the forms you need) - it ain't rocket science. The reason it costs $2000 through a lawyer might be because they know they won't be making any additional money in probate.

Reply by CJ on 6/19/07 3:53pm
Msg #195817

Re: Living Trusts

I have not looked at Legal Zooms trusts, but the ones I "sold" had about 200 pages and covered everything (like properties out of state). However, I do know that they asked a lot of specific questions on the application, and then just mail-merged them the way loan docs are done. I think if the trust is not complicated (never divorced, going to leave everything to the kids evenly) then standard trusts might be okay. If you can't handle $2000, Legal Zoom still must be better than probate.

Reply by JanetK_CA on 6/19/07 8:48pm
Msg #195880

Re: Living Trusts

However, probate laws vary from state to state, and I think CA laws could be a bit more complicated - maybe for the very reason you state!! ;>