Posted by Ndwa on 3/14/07 7:35pm
Msg #179961

Count your eggs, check your basket

As my friend BrendaTX said in another post, it will only get worse after this quarter. The change this month alone is noticeable. Of the 25 signing I have to date, 18 are Heloc which is an unusual (opposite) ratio in my book.

With concern of a decline market, I did some number crunching the other night and found that the ratio of my monthly signing volume (this quarter) to number of clients yield 3:1 theoretically. The dive on my chart is not pretty from Q4 '06 to present, but my signing service is making up for the lack or even better volume wise. Anyone who is not actively marketing or have not a good connection with clients will be in for a long haul. I hope all will weather well (financially) in the next few months.

Reply by Michael Edmonds on 3/14/07 7:42pm
Msg #179962

project 1st qtr down 8% from 06 sales figures. n/m

Reply by TitleGalCA on 3/14/07 7:54pm
Msg #179964

The title industry is gearing up for a very lean second quarter, and third...and fourth.

Management is advising their underlings "don't squawk about doing the work of two people...don't complain...don't think your job is necessary...prove that we need you...don't make any assumptions about your worth". Pretty scary stuff.

Andy is right to advise marketing your services, but only to those with experience. New signing agents should be looking for other work; and please, please don't believe the NNA or other companies that tell you it's all about you - the market is dictating the work and there is very little of it.

Reply by Jacqueline Dyson on 3/14/07 8:11pm
Msg #179968

Please define "experience".

Reply by TitleGalCA on 3/14/07 8:23pm
Msg #179974

Uh, no

You already know if you're 'experienced' or not, why ask me what the 'definition' is? Having someone post a number is pretty moot in a real estate market like this.

You either are or you're not, you either have confidence in your business or you don't. Ask yourself the same question about the definition of experience and I'll bet you can provide the answer much better than I can.

Reply by Jacqueline Dyson on 3/14/07 8:27pm
Msg #179975

Thanks! n/m

Reply by cassiewi on 3/14/07 8:35pm
Msg #179978

I wouldn't want to be just starting out right now

My numbers are still good and we'll see how it goes. I'm doing a lot of repeat business and I hope that it continues. Hope all goes well for everyone.

Reply by Jacqueline Dyson on 3/14/07 8:55pm
Msg #179983

I hear you Cassie,

I am going to work on gaining experience which will assist me in positioning myself when the dust clears. I promise as a "newbie", I will not lower the standards. You guy's are worth every $$$ you work for. I have been reading this post for quite sometime. You guy's are awesome.

Reply by cassiewi on 3/14/07 9:01pm
Msg #179984

Good luck to you! n/m

Reply by Jacqueline Dyson on 3/14/07 9:15pm
Msg #179988

Re: Good luck to you!

"He who is not courageous enough to
take risks will accomplish

nothing in life."

Muhammad Ali (1942 - )
American boxer

Reply by Joan Bergstrom on 3/14/07 11:10pm
Msg #179995

I don't think it is hard to get started now in Calif

Two of my friends in Riverside, Ca got started as loan signers approx 6-8 weeks ago and they haven't had any problem getting loan signing assignments.

One friend I helped the first 2 weeks by referring her phone number when I couldn't do the loan signing.

The other friend I referred only one signing in the 8 weeks she has been a notary.

They are both doing 5-10 signings a week in the Inland Empire.

You have to know how to market yourself.

Reply by Jacqueline Dyson on 3/14/07 11:37pm
Msg #179997

Great post Joan!

I just read that CA made the top 10 list for low foreclosures. Thank you for the encourgement. Andy, I love your numbers. Maybe the focus at this time should be to market ourselves,so we don't have to depend on or encourge the low life sigining agencies, who don't pay or treat us as if we are from a 3rd world country. The Subprime market is in trouble due to what I would say "Greed". To bad people who only want a part of the american dream are suffering. Do not let these type of signing agencies due to "greed" ruin our profession.

Reply by CaliNotary on 3/15/07 2:33am
Msg #180004

It's in your financial interest to say this

All the marketing in the world isn't going to overcome the reality of what the market is right now.

Part of your business is training people to get into this industry. Your opinion can't be trusted on this board.

Reply by Ndwa on 3/15/07 3:27am
Msg #180006

You're da man, Cali

I find there's nothing more disgusting than the willfulness thought with an agenda.

Reply by hcampersFL on 3/15/07 7:27am
Msg #180012

Joan I like you. I think in your mind you are spouting the

real deal. The problem is that everyone else on this board is saying your wrong. Are they all wrong about the future of this business?

New people coming here are looking for any straw they can grasp and you are glad to give them a hand full of hay. Please disclose the fact that you are an instuctor and make a nice chunk of change from your teaching gig.

People can market their asses off but if it slows down and the work just isn't their then how will they survive??? Don't you feel some responsiblity for this?

Reply by MelissaCT on 3/15/07 7:48am
Msg #180013

In Joan's defense,

she's working smarter, diversifying and riding the wave. Like it or not, it's a smart move from a business sense to stay afloat. I'm not saying it's right or wrong. Just pointing out that if you take a step back from the situation & try to look at it objectively, it's a smart way to increase revenue.

Much like the NNA. Like them or not, shady business practices or not, they are doing a great job of marketing & creating new revenue streams for themselves. Even if they invent needs.

This is simply my opinion -- as a devil's advocate -- a different perspective.

Reply by hcampersFL on 3/15/07 7:55am
Msg #180015

Melissa I agree with you. She is a smart lady, no question.

I just feel she needs to disclose the fact that she is an instructor so that newbies have full "disclosure".

You have 10 people telling you to tighten your belt its going to be a bumpy ride and then one post how 2 new friends of hers are getting 8-10 signings per week.....really? Of course the newbie with the stars in their eyes only hears the one person saying what they want to hear.

I would bet that their are people with vast experience and knowledge on this board that have slowed down and aren't getting those numbers. They market and have established clients etc. Heck they have posted on this board you only have to read it.

Reply by Maureen Couper on 3/15/07 8:00am
Msg #180019

Re: Melissa I agree with you. She is a smart lady, no question.

I as a Notary Signing Agent that has been doing this for awhile , are looking into the bankruptcy training and other options to keep things going during the slow sailing we have ahead. I have been marketing through a new website, other association memberships, and title comp. visits. We all have to be diligent at this time. I can tell you I am only getting 4 signings a week at this time. I am in Florida so we may be slower here. To all of you keep up the networking and good luck to all of those who are in foreclosure through no fault of their own.

Reply by Dorothy_MI on 3/15/07 8:09am
Msg #180021

Just yesterday

one of my associates told me how last Feb (06) he did 49 loans. This Feb (07) - 29 loans. And believe me he markets! Just the facts of life.

Reply by BrendaTx on 3/15/07 8:16am
Msg #180025

Re: Joan I like you. Me too...but

Beverly, I agree with you. I believe that Joan does believe what she says. H3ll, I want to believe what she says. I think this month we are seeing quarterly numbers pushing up some of the otherwise flatter numbers.

The anomaly of rising numbers of appointments to three in one week from zero to three last month is, IMHO, a push for lender branches to get their numbers up for this quarter so that they might not be the one who gets the axe.

Disclosing that Joan teaches would be a very good idea--that way people can determine if she's got her rose colored glasses on.

Let's all hope for Joan to be right and for me to be full of crap.

Reply by MelissaCT on 3/15/07 9:02am
Msg #180039

Absolutely. I have 3 this week (woo-hoo!) No doubt

business is down. And newbies will always think they can "beat the odds" and make it in this business despite the downturn, despite the numbers and despite the competition. They'll market to title companies that they're brand new & should be utilized over the established competitors. Look at American Idol -- everyone thinks they have what it takes, doesn't matter what industry they're in, whether it's singing or signing.

Reply by Jacqueline Dyson on 3/15/07 9:24am
Msg #180047

You are correct regarding American Idol

then...someone comes along and walks away with movie/music industry awards. I am not willful, just a "Dream Girl". I do plan on keeping my day job!

Reply by ewing2surf on 3/15/07 8:44am
Msg #180034

Re: I don't think it is hard to get started now in Calif

You guys lay off Joan. Look at her track record. She was a signing agent for about a year when she co-wrote a book about it that has sold many thousands of copies nationwide. Wow! That's what I call "Wildly Successful". So if there's a new (er) nickle to be made in this business Joan will help you locate it and I am willing to listen.

I teach those silly classes too. Since December I have certified 34 notaries. Over two thirds of those notaries were english second language hispanics located in the LA and Riverside County areas with strong family or business ties to the mortgage industry. How do I know this? I ask each person in the class why they are here and how do they intend to market themselves along with a warning that there are a lot of people chasing this opportunity. Most already have a business plan but a few are actually willing to listen to my marketing speech. Then shortly after the class is over I start getting the calls from those few motivated marketers asking me if it's ok to backdate a deed or this XYZ signing company wants them to downloand 2 loans and have them signed for $60. Well they are getting work I say to myself but 6 hours work for $60 minus expenses and time away from the family gets old fast.

So in some areas the signings are still out there just not as many and the always greedy signing services are getting better trained notaries that are willing to work for FAR less then most of us will, just to get out of the house at night. Some notaries would do this for free if they could justify it to the breadwinner.

So now Joan why don't you refer those San Diego county leads you must be passing up to your friend in San Diego (me). I could use an extra 5-10 a week to go with my actual 5 a week. None of those $50 signing service adventures that only "new to the business SA's" will take though.










;

Reply by hcampersFL on 3/15/07 9:40am
Msg #180054

Thank you Joe for at least being honest with us about your

classes and your numbers.
That was my only point. Everyones numbers are down, there is now way around that fact.

Reply by BrendaTx on 3/15/07 12:18pm
Msg #180064

Re: Thank you Joe for at least being honest with us about your

There's nothing wrong with capitalizing on an industry as long as there's full disclosure.

BTW, was Joe saying it is, or is not, a good time to get into the NSA biz?

Reply by Blueink_CA on 3/15/07 12:42pm
Msg #180069

Re: Is it a good time to get in the biz?

It would be interesting to see this question answred by the new Certified Notary Signing Agents that have received their certification and commission within this last year. Aside from the many posts like "I'm a new SA, how do I get business?", I haven't really seen anything regarding the success (or failure) of the recent grads.

Were your expectations met?

Would you recommend this profession to your (out of area, of course) friends and family?

So how about it new SA's, speak up! Give us the real scoop.

Reply by Debbie/OH on 3/15/07 3:15pm
Msg #180101

Re: Is it a good time to get in the biz?

I would say this is a good time to do your research and there is a lot if it! I began my business in Sept 06. Had my first assignment Oct 1st. (I have 4yrs. experience with previous employer) I am happy with the steady progress of my business! Feb was terrible, March started slow too but today out of the blue 3 assignments. I know to some people this is not much, but it si good for me! There are always cycles in everything and this downturn will pass..Hang in there. You can email me if you want to discuss. I do not sell anything! Just happy to be working for myself!!

Reply by SANDRA LEE on 3/15/07 3:48pm
Msg #180107

Re: I don't think it is hard to get started now in Calif

I've been a notary (certified) in CA for 4 years. I average 2 signings per month, usually toward the end of the month. How do you market yourself? I'm signed on with several big associations like NNA, USA-Signiingagent.com, CA notary.com, Loansigners.com and of course Notary Rotary. I'm GLBA compliant with experience and rarely have to re-do my work.
I'm with yahoo search engine when you type in certifed notary signing agent. What more would be of help to market myself? [e-mail address]
Sandi

Reply by JanetK_CA on 3/16/07 1:07am
Msg #180159

Re: I don't think it is hard to get started now in Calif

Simply put, you need to contact and get registered with a few hundred signing services and your phone may start to ring more. (And no, I am not exaggerating.)

Beyond that, if you've read this thread, you should realize that no one with any sense is going to hand over to you - and simultaneously everyone else who happens to be reading this - all their carefully developed strategies for finding clients in this increasingly competitive marketplace, at least not for free... Having said that, there is abundant information on this board that could help you if you are willing to search it out. If you're serious about growing your business, your first job is to develop a marketing plan and then put it to work!! If you (and I mean this to all newbies or others who aren't doing many signings) aren't willing to do that, then you might as well hang up your shingle right now.

Having read this thread, it seems to me that what people are NOT saying is just as important as what they are. (Notice Joan didn't say how much these new people are making per assignment.) I like the American Idol analogy. There is very possibly someone just now starting out in this business who will be able, despite all the odds and all the naysaying, to become very successful as a signing agent. But what all these good people and experienced NSAs are trying to say is that it ain't gonna be easy and if you want to be one of the few who beat the odds, you'd better plan on working hard, perhaps harder than you ever have before in your life.

This business has always, in some ways, had more complexity to it than what meets the eye. It's not just waving a document at someone and having them sign it. Obviously (I hope), you need to learn the ins and outs of being a notary and what loan docs are all about. But you also need to learn how to manage a business (and your time) and how to market yourself, if you want your efforts to be profitable.

In current market conditions, as I think someone said, most people who are well established or well connected will probably be fine in many (most?) parts of the country, although they may not do as well as they have done in the past. But someone just starting out is waaaay more likely to have a tough time building to a significant level of profitability (or even staying afloat) than they would have had a few years back. That seems to be the concensus. And I would ask, if you're not going to make a profit, what's the point?! I'm spouting off again here, but this is all jmho, FWIW...

PS. Also FWIW, outside of the NNA and maybe the low-ball signing services, very few potential clients give a rip about certification. They want to know your experience level. And I think that's more than just a cummulative number of signings done. You need frequent enough repitition to really get on a roll and handle it smoothly. I bet many of you seasoned NSAs have noticed that if you take even a week off, it sometimes takes one or two to get your rhythm back, right? ;>

Reply by MistarellaFL on 3/16/07 10:42am
Msg #180191

Well said Janet n/m