Posted by Tess on 5/29/07 12:46pm
Msg #192535

Notorial wording

Hi all,

I just had a discussion with a title company about notorial wording and I wanted to know what all of you do about this problem.

I had a signing last week that had no notorial wording on the E & O, I emailed the TC before I left for the appointment and asked if they wanted an Acknowledgement or a Jurat for it and was told to not worry about notarizing it and just have them sign. Well, wouldn’t you know, I get a frantic call today (from the same person) saying that it is funding tomorrow and I need to notarize it. I again asked about the wording and she was very adamant that none was needed, even said that” her four notary publics” say so. After my insisting, she had me talk with their attorney, who finally said to write in an acknowledgement statement since attachments are not allowed on mortgage docs (what!!).

Do most of you just add the wording yourself, when they do not answer the question or just sign and stamp? Since the above discussion, I have to assume that they are not questioned on this often! Are there states that do not need notorial wording??

Tess
In PA

Reply by dickb/wi on 5/29/07 1:06pm
Msg #192540

first of all.....

if you just sign and stamp it is not a notarization.....you should never make an impression of your notary seal [or stamp] unless it is on a notarial block or if your state allows, a certification....you as a notarycan not make the determination if it should be an ack or a jurat....only the signer or the document maker can determine what they want .......also a notarial block is not a part of the document it self, but is your attestament that the signers signature is genuine........if they can't tell me whether it's an ack or a jurat they don't get a notarization......if they tell us what they want then in wi we are free to write it or attach a loose one......just signing and stamping in the abcense of a notarial block is incompetent practice and you could, at least in wi be sanctioned by the state for doing so....hope this helps...

Reply by ZeeCA on 5/29/07 2:38pm
Msg #192560

If there is no wording exactly whtat do they think you are

notarizing w/ yr stamp and signature?

Reply by Tess on 5/29/07 2:49pm
Msg #192563

Re: Update - They now say they will not pay me unless


I notarize the already signed E & O they are sending ON to me, even though I told them it is illegal!!! I had even offered to go out free of charge to redo since it was close by.

Reply by Glenn Strickler on 5/29/07 3:01pm
Msg #192567

Re: Update - They now say they will not pay me unless

Well, then, you must have missed something on the E&O that said "attach jurat".

Reply by Tess on 5/29/07 3:05pm
Msg #192569

Re: No, I have a copy here and no attachment notice!! n/m

Reply by dickb/wi on 5/29/07 4:16pm
Msg #192580

Tess....link to your profile or at least.....

put your state behind your name so we know what state you are from....that some times will help you get better answers to your questions......

Reply by Teresa Kutz on 5/29/07 4:39pm
Msg #192586

Re: Sorry, do not know how to change name to add PA


I don't wish to link, I would like all my hits to be all business related instead of forum hits if I can keep it that way.

Tess
In PA

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 5/29/07 5:01pm
Msg #192588

Re: Sorry, do not know how to change name to add PA

I just checked on editing my profile, and I don't see anywhere you can change your forum alias so you can add PA to it.
But when anyone click's on your messages they can see you are in PA.

Reply by Glenn Strickler on 5/29/07 2:59pm
Msg #192565

Re: Notorial wording-- You are assuming

that the lender wants the E&O signature notarized in the first place. Many lenders do not want any signatures notarized except on the DOT. Countrywide comes to mind.

If there is no verbage or a statement that says, "Attach jurat " or something similar, then the lender does not need to have the E&O signature notarized.

Reply by WDMD on 5/29/07 3:31pm
Msg #192573

Tess said- "Are there states that do not need notorial wording??"

Yes, there are. Maryland allows notaries to act as an official witness of signatures on documents with no notorial wording. There are guidelines to follow in the Maryland notary handbook, paragraph 26 page 9.

Reply by PCasey/CO on 5/29/07 3:40pm
Msg #192576

Tess, I hope you kept the e-mail between you and the TC that said that you didn't need to worry about it.

It is not your job to have to ask them what notarization they want on the form, you identified that it didn't have notarial language and asked them, they said to ignore. If what they are asking you to do is illegal as per the notary code in your state you should contact the SOS Office immediately to report this and make sure you keep a paper trail to CYA (cover your A##) in case it doesn't fund. Possibly you need to pull up your state notary code and forward to them so they can read for themselves.

Reply by Tess on 5/29/07 4:22pm
Msg #192583

Thanks,

Yes, I do have all the emails. I do not like to report these things, but I do have a call in to the SOS to confirm the law so I will CMA on that as well. I just wish it had not come to this, but they were wrong on two counts, and with the pay push, I have now lost any respect I had for them.

Reply by Gary_CA on 5/29/07 5:12pm
Msg #192590

I don't know about PA or MD... but in CA...

it is illegal to stamp something without notorial wording. In fact, if its for CA it has to be their precise wording. (By the way that wording was put in place 18 months ago and the document software still spits out bad signature pages, but that's another rant).

You'll work it out... and hopefully everyone will be happy and get paid... but if it comes down to one signing fee or your reputation... tell 'em to stamp it their own damn self.

Then start collecting your fee anyway.

Reply by Rick_NY on 5/29/07 5:34pm
Msg #192595

Re: Notorial wording => BTW, it's NOTARIAL, with an "a"

I'm sorry, but it bugs me when that word is misspelled. Excuse me, please, but I have to go. The plummer is here fixing my pipes.

Reply by Tess on 5/29/07 5:35pm
Msg #192596

Re: Opps! Your right! n/m

Reply by Rick_NY on 5/29/07 5:44pm
Msg #192599

Re: Opps! Your right! => It's "Oops!"

It rhymes with "scoops" not "pops."
Also, I believe you mean "You're (you are) right," not "your" ( as in "aren't I being a pain in your behind?"

I couldn't resist. Sorry.

Have a great day! :-D

Reply by Tess on 5/29/07 6:14pm
Msg #192612

Re: Yes, you are : ) n/m

Reply by Calnotary on 5/29/07 10:52pm
Msg #192642

Plummer? LOL I think it is Plumber. I also have bad spelling n/m

Reply by Terri_CA on 5/29/07 7:02pm
Msg #192624

Tess - Please update us once you have confirmed with the PA SOS what you can and can't do.

FYI - Here in California, I would not have even called the title company and asked about notarizing the document. If there isn't any wording, then the Notary should not notarize the document, nor would I question whether it should be or not. Each individual lender is different. I've seen docs which request notarizations on specific docs, while the next lender only wants the DOT and nothing else notarized.

So, just because some packages have the E & O notarized, do not automatically assume that ALL E & O docs should be notarized just because lender A's docs have the notary wording.

Further, I would charge another trip fee, because you have it in writing to not have it notarized. You followed instructions, now they want you to go out again, get that document re-signed and notarized, that's another fee. Don't forget you CANNOT date that document with the original signing date! You can be sure they'll want you to do! Good Luck to you!

Reply by Crystal Johnson on 5/29/07 8:29pm
Msg #192629

NonPayment: Signatures Plus

I am learning that Signatures Plus is on the slow/non payment list of companies for notaries to stay away from (webpage with entire list of filed complaints). Just wondering if there is another company(s) that I should be sure not to agree to closing for, in addition to Signatures Plus (they owe me for 2 closings since December, 2006). Thanks, in advance, for the pitfall warnings.

Reply by Tess on 5/29/07 11:01pm
Msg #192646

Re: I will update when I hear from the SOS. I had asked


about the wording because there was a place for a notary signature and commission expires but no other wording.