Posted by Peggy Hinkle on 5/19/07 4:58pm
Msg #190964

adoption paperwork question

have been notarizing all adoption papers for a couple adopting from vietnam. latest package included forms that were to have some information left blank, to be filled in in vietnam, but i was supposed to notarize the couple's signatures.

i know we're not supposed to notarize anything with blanks, yet this was such a special case. i ended up having them fill out a jurat with affiant stmt, stating that they knew there were blanks on the forms. i was just making it up as i went - logical, but still wondering what will happen in sacramento during apostille process.

anyone have any experience with these sorts of forms?

Reply by TRG_wy on 5/19/07 7:00pm
Msg #190975

I too have done adoption papers. Some blank (not filled in or completed) information isn't rare. As long as the signers are aware and knowledgeable of the issues. Some specific information just can not be completed at time of signing.

My guess is that you covered yourself here.

Reply by BrendaTx on 5/19/07 9:47pm
Msg #190990

Interesting post, Peggy. I have not done adoption papers. That would really bother me to have to leave those blanks in there...not being stricken by paranoia here...just thinking why the H. can't the lawyers do the adoption papers so that it isn't necessary to notarize signatures on a document in which blanks will be completed post-signing so that everything runs smooth as silk for these people.

It sounds like poor document crafting to me to leave the blanks in under the circumstance you explain. There is bound to be a better way.

One thing about it, if it gets through the apostille process it kinda shows that California doesn't really take issue with leaving blanks in the documents now doesn't it?

Reply by MelissaCT on 5/21/07 9:46am
Msg #191079

Re: BrendaTx - blanks in papers

I recently have done a few documents for foreign adoptions and the balnks (on this particular form) were explained to me this way...

in (Ukraine), the dossier that is hired is required to stand in line beginning on Saturday for a Monday appearance. Appointments are no longer given. So, depending on the country of the person(s) applying for adoption of a child, a certain day of the week is used for each country. Each country gets 1 day per month.

Logistically, a single person cannot stay in line for 3 days straight. The person acting a dossier has to present the paperwork when it's their turn in line, thus if the form is left blank, the person who is actually in line at that time can complete it then. This allows for a better chance of the peperwork being submitted. Often, the main dossier will hire relatives, etc. to stand in line for shifts to be able to present the paperwork for consideration for adoption.

I am not an attorney & this is merely what I was told. This is the explanation I was given for why there is some information left blank within the document. The document was a Power of Attorney form and the signers knew it contained blanks as well as why it needed to contain blanks.

Hope this sheds some light on the situation. Mind you, each country is different in the way they handle foreign adoption papers...

Reply by Joe Ewing on 5/20/07 6:57pm
Msg #191030

The County Clerk and the SOS do not review for Notary error

The County Clerk will verify your signature ONLY. An Authentication will be attached to the Acknowledgment or Jurat. Then the Secretary of State will attach an Apostillle to the Authentication specifically for Vietnam. The issuance of the Apostille has absolutely nothing to do with the content of the document.

Reply by BrendaTx on 5/20/07 7:47pm
Msg #191031

Interesting insight, thanks Joe. n/m

Reply by Joe Ewing on 5/21/07 1:55am
Msg #191058

Re: Interesting insight, thanks Joe.

Your welcome Brenda. I guess I should add that the county recorder (not the clerk) does look for notary errors but not that closely. I submitted documents for recording and certified copies only a few days ago and there was several obvious notary errors in them. Both had the notary seal stamped over some of the wording on the Acknowledgment and both were not crossed out or circled in the he/she/they part. Recorder just glanced at them and stamped the top.

Reply by BrendaTx on 5/21/07 6:50am
Msg #191065

Re: Interesting insight, thanks Joe.

Actually, there's been an AGs opinion in Texas that the recorder only has to look for the notarial certificate but doesn't have to determine if the language in the acknowledgment is correct. My local recorder will kick them back for a lack of seal...sometimes...but little else.