Posted by Elaine Sedlock on 11/7/07 9:05am
Msg #220019

two part signing?

I had a call yesterday to do a "two part signing." I didn't ask (schedule was full anyway). I figured I could search for info on notrot but didn't find anything that really explained what it was other than the fact that notaries from two different states would be doing the signings. This was to be part in MD and part in FL. Can anyone tell me how that works? TIA

Reply by Phillip/TX on 11/7/07 9:16am
Msg #220025

I had one yesterday too... The husband is in Texas the wife is in CA with the property. You sign whichever one is in front of you. Then you send the documents to whomever, and they complete it. Really no different unless you are the second half, and then you have to attach loose ackledgements to the notarized documents.

Reply by Elaine Sedlock on 11/7/07 9:22am
Msg #220027

So you notarize the docs according to your own laws and they do the other part by their laws? Their was a discussion in the archives about whether or not to make changes to the first notary's notarizations and whether or not you should? It was a bit confusing as there were disagreements. Made it sound like it could get pretty hairy -- something I'd like to understand better before I ever take on.

Reply by Phillip/TX on 11/7/07 9:33am
Msg #220032

You would never change anything that the prior notary did... you are only to notarize your signer... and you will prolly have to use a loose ackledgement to do so. If you are the first closer, you will mark thru the name and inital for whomever is not in front of you. You NEVER mark thru the signature line.

Reply by Elaine Sedlock on 11/7/07 9:35am
Msg #220035

Thanks a lot Phillip!

Reply by Renee Giannos on 11/7/07 9:34am
Msg #220034

Just make sure that you are only notarizing one parties' signature. If both names are in the acknowledgement, cross the 2d party's name out, initial, etc.

Reply by Phillip/TX on 11/7/07 9:37am
Msg #220036

This is true... about making sure you only are attesting to the one party not all.

Reply by Dave_CA on 11/7/07 9:40am
Msg #220037

Yes, you always notarize according to you state law.
No, you never change another Notary's certificate.
The only thing I look at differently is to see how the notarial wording is set up. If it is already made out for another state, and that is where the 2nd part of the signing will take place, then I will use loose certificates and leave the preprinted information for the other notary.
This is not essential it's just a courtesy for the second Notary.
If they are filled out for my state, and the 2nd signing is in another, I'll use what is printed and just ensure that it clearly shows only the person who appeared before me.
If I'm 1st, and both signings are in my state, I'll use loose certificates just in case the 2nd Notary has "forgotten" to bring any.

Reply by Elaine Sedlock on 11/7/07 9:43am
Msg #220039

All good advice. You people are so helpful. Have a great day.

Reply by Kitty/VA on 11/7/07 10:45am
Msg #220048

Virginia does not allow separate acks. All notarizations must be on the same page as the signature. Best to check your state laws when doing this.

Reply by Teresa/FL on 11/7/07 11:19am
Msg #220066

Florida allows attached certificates

There is no requirement that the notarization be on the same page as the signature of the document signer.

Of course, it is good practice to reference the document information on your loose certificate.

Reply by Elaine Sedlock on 11/7/07 11:34am
Msg #220069

Re: Florida allows attached certificates

The Florida manual states:

"Preprinted notarial certificates designed to be attached to a document should be used only in rare circumstances. Most documents will have a notarial certificate already printed on the document. Use that certificate, but make it comply with Florida law, if necessary."

and further that:

"Only in rare circumstances should you actually attach a “loose certificate.” If you do, be sure to state in the notarial certificate the exact document and signature to which the notarization applies."

Has anyone ever had any problems in FL regarding attaching certificates? I had to do one for the first time yesterday because the wording on the certificate provided was so impossible to correct and the space was so limited it was necessary.

Reply by MistarellaFL on 11/7/07 11:46am
Msg #220073

Re: Florida allows attached certificates

I have never had a problem by adding a loose cert.
Usually certs are printed on the signature page, except this instance would (IMO) would be one of those rare circumstances to add the loose cert.

Reply by Teresa/FL on 11/7/07 12:07pm
Msg #220080

Re: Florida allows attached certificates

In the case of a split signing it is very common to have to attach a loose certificate, unless the document preparer has added another certificate to the document for your use.

If the document is going to be recorded it will affect the recording fees, but that is something the TC should have taken into account.

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 11/7/07 12:43pm
Msg #220086

Re: Florida manual

The manual is a guideline. The statutes concerning Notary law are the "laws"
There is nothing in the law regarding loose certificates.
As signing agents we do see more instances where a loose certificate is necessary.

Another guideline in the manual is that we should put the name of the person whose signature we are notarizing on the certificate. And although I follow this guideline, the statutes do state:

(e) The name of the person whose signature is being notarized. It is presumed, absent such specific notation by the notary public, that notarization is to all signatures

So, if we don't put the name of the person whose signature we are notarizing in the certificate it is presumed that we are notarizing all signatures on the document.

I believe it is prudent to put the name in the certificate.

You should not have a problem attaching a loose certificate when necessary.

Reply by CopperheadVA on 11/7/07 12:41pm
Msg #220084

True. However Virginia notaries can easily handle this type of situation even if the first notary in a split signing has used the pre-printed notary certificate. All that's needed is ack and jurat stamps that can be stamped onto the signature page (assuming there is room). Every VA notary should carry these stamps with them IMHO. If there's no room on the doc, I would be at a loss as to what to do, short of writing it in by hand however I could. At that point a call to TC would be in order.

Reply by Phillip/TX on 11/7/07 1:09pm
Msg #220094

Texas Wording for your view

This is the form of certificate that I would attach, as you can see it clearly shows who I am notarizing and what document it is to be attached too.

ALL PURPOSE ACKNOWLEDGMENT

STATE OF TEXAS }
COUNTY OF _____________________ }

On _________________ before me, _______________________________________ personally appeared _________________________________________________________________, personally known to me (or proved to me on the basis of satisfactory evidence) to be the person(s) whose name(s) is/are subscribed to the within instrument and acknowledged to me that he/she/they executed the same in his/her/their authorized capacity(ies), an that by his/her/their signature(s) on the instrument the person(s), or the entity upon behalf of which the person(s) acted, executed the instrument.

WITNESS my hand and official seal.

______________________________
NOTARY
( SEAL )



THIS CERTIFICATE MUST BE ATTACHED TO THE DOCUMENT DESCRIBED AT RIGHT TO BE VALID. Title of Document: ______________________________
Number of Pages: ______________________________
Date of Document: ______________________________
Parties: ______________________________