Posted by Loreta Alfonso on 9/11/07 2:58pm
Msg #210367

Signing Agent appointment time lenght

I've had 2 assignments that I've accepted in the last 2 weeks, which lasted more than 2+ hours because they had so many questions. Normally 45 min to an hour is what I take to sign a set of loan documents. Is it acceptable to ask for more after the fact? Or would you negotiate more upfront? It's just one agency that' I've found has poor quality client communication. Borrowers don't know terms of their loan and I had one borrower who had no idea he was coming off title, his parents were replacing him with another son.

Your feedback is appreciated!

Reply by qmriley on 9/11/07 3:05pm
Msg #210372

mine usually take 25-1 hr (1st/2nd) anything longer then that is crazy

Reply by Charles_Ca on 9/11/07 4:07pm
Msg #210390

Seems to me that you are taking on much more than you should be if youra explaining the terms of the loan: that is not yoru job, its the LOs. By explaining the terms and in the case of vesting you may exposing yourself to much more liability than you are prepared to handle and it may turn around and bite you. It shoujld take more than an average of 45 mins. I don't ask formore because it seems to work out for me, for every little old couple that takes and hour and half I find someone who just wnats to sign and get it over with. My fastest was a dentist with a patient under local anesthesia in the chair, it took about 15 minutes from the time he walked in the door until I walked out.

Reply by Todd/OH on 9/11/07 4:12pm
Msg #210391

Remember, you are there to watch them sign. Point out the important items (charges on the HUD and terms of the note) and just show them where to sign. If they start asking you all those questions, refer them to their LO. The LO often doesn't know much either.

Reply by LJ on 9/11/07 4:38pm
Msg #210396

Very rarely I am at a closing longer than 1 hour (unless it is a 2nd). If I am there longer is because the borrowers are so nice, we get sidetracked and get off the subject. If I have another apt, I keep that to a minimum. But sometimes, the people are so nice that we just sit and talk. I've made a lot of friends doing this and some people are grateful that I don't rush them. The other side of the coin is some borrowers just want to sign and get me out of their house. I respect that also and can usually read that in the first couple minutes.

Reply by CJ on 9/11/07 4:49pm
Msg #210397

This is how I see it:

I am paid to see this job through to completion. I am paid a flat for for the job.

I can usually get the job done in 1/2 hour: point out the figure, if they are wrong, pack up and leave (after making appropriate phone calls). If they are right, sign - sign - sign.

But if they want to read or ask a million questions, there is nothing I can do. I have tried to speed it up, and they just get really mean. But like someone else said: sometimes they take a long time, but it is balanced out by the quick ones.

Also, I think borrowers are more scared because of the stuff in the news. I try to find out what they are specifically worried about, so we can address that right away. Sometimes they are afraid of things like a hidden ppp, or a hidden balloon payment, so they read EVERY document looking for it. I tell them I know where they hide everything, so we will check all of those places first (Note, TIL, and HUD). I explain how we KNOW there is no balloon payment, or whatever they are looking for. Of course I also show them the RTC.

Since it is so slow, I figure now I am glad to be sitting at a signing at all. Where am I going to rush off to? I am getting paid to complete this signing, so I just be patient and let them read or whatever. But there is no point to negotiage the fee. Otherwise, we would be paid by the hour. The title company gave the SS a flat fee, and the SS gives us a flat fee. Are you willing to take less if it goes quickly?

Personally, I like to say that my specialty is "problem borrowers", then hopefully they will call me first. I just sit there patienly, and get everyone on the phone that they need.

Reply by CaliNotary on 9/11/07 6:45pm
Msg #210424

I partially agree

Most signings go pretty smoothly, and the occasional long one is balanced out by the occasional short one.

But where I disagree is on just sitting there and letting them read the docs in excruciating detail. I'm paid a flat fee to get the docs signed, not to sit and stare at the wall while they read all the fine print. A certain amount of reading is expected - the settlement statement, the note, the TIL, etc.

But if they're going overboard with it, I'm going to politely nudge them along. And if they're not cooperative, I have no problem telling them that the signing will have to be rescheduled if they're unwilling to sign without reading everything in detail. That usually does the trick, although there have been a couple of times where I had to pack up and leave because we were 45 minutes into the signing and about 5 pages into the package.

My fees are based on an hour at the table and travel time. I'm simply not going to donate an extra hour at the table because of somebody's paranoia.

Reply by Dennis_IN on 9/11/07 8:37pm
Msg #210441

Re: I partially agree

If I get a reader I politely remind them (sometimes more than once) that they have 3 days to review the docs and if they have any q's to call their LO. But I don't want to seem that their concerns aren't important...but they do have 3 days to cancel.

Reply by mbcinva on 9/11/07 5:37pm
Msg #210406

My closings usually take about 20 minutes, provided there a no problems. I sit down with the borrower and go over the highlights of the docs. If they want to read, I explain to them that they have 3 days to review the docs. If there is a problem and they cannot get things worked out with their LO, they have the right to cancel. This usually satisfies them. As far as getting extra pay after you have agreed to their initial fee, I doubt that they would do this!! Good luck!!

Reply by cntrlcalntry on 9/11/07 6:03pm
Msg #210414

I always allow for one full hour. I book two hours in between appts. so I am not stressed to get to my next appt. ( Who can afford a speeding ticket with these slow times?) Also, some one posted here recently "some days you eat the bear and some days the bear eats you"! Love it and think of it often some days!

Reply by LJ on 9/11/07 8:16pm
Msg #210437

How do you get through a 100 + page pkg, notarize and fill

in journal and ID pages and double check your work in 20 minutes? Seems impossible to me. I guess I'm too particular or perfectionist to get through it that quick.

Reply by Margaret_FL on 9/11/07 9:24pm
Msg #210448

Re: How do you get through a 100 + page pkg, notarize and fill

I agree, I do not know how this can be done. Getting ID's entering in journal, filling out notary certificates, sometimes there are tons. I have had borrowers comment on the way I do it. They said they last notary rushed them, sign here, sign here, like they were in a hurry to get to another appointment in 30 min. I have also been reading on a lot of websites where borrowers are complaining about being rushed by the notary. I did one the other day that was 150 pages, had about 30 certificates. I filled in as much as I could on the certificates, I stamped and put what kind of ID once I got there and it still took 2 hours.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 9/11/07 7:11pm
Msg #210425

2+ hours is certainly unreasonable, but I don't think you can go back and ask for a higher fee after the fact. What you CAN do is either refuse assignments from this agency or demand a higher fee in advance; clearly, there's very little communication with the BO, and there's no reason you should be taking the hit for that.

I can generally get through a set of docs between 20 and 45 minutes, depending on how much they want to actually read at the table. I always start off with the HUD-1; if there are going to be problems, that's usually where they will surface. I follow that with the TIL and the RTC, so they know what they're getting into and how they can get out if they want to; after that I present the the note and the mortgage, and point out the highlights. Once you get the 'big 5" out of the way, it's usually smooth sailing because the rest of the docs tend to be junk anyway.

Occasionally there's an odd affidavit to deal with, but if you can gain their trust by taking a few extra minutes with the important docs (making sure they know what and where the info is, without explaining why), the rest of the docs should be easy.

I also find it's helpful to gently reinforce the RTC when the borrower has questions and can't contact the LO. I keep a pad of paper in my briefcase and will write out the questions they have so they can call the LO the next day and ask. The last thing these folks want is to be railroaded into signing papers; anything you can do to make them more comfortable with the process is a Good Thing...

Reply by snoopdogMs on 9/11/07 8:50pm
Msg #210443

I have found that closing times are as unique as the borrowers are. Most of my closings occur within 45-60 minutes but there are those oddball signers that either want to zoom thru or scrutinize every document. I think it is the element of surprise that I love about this job and certainly each closing brings something new to the table.

Reply by SharonMN on 9/11/07 10:12pm
Msg #210451

Re: Signing Agent appointment time length

Even the thorough readers usually get bored and speed up after they get about halfway through (start with something like the HUD or the Note and NOT some crazy long title affidavit - save that for the end when the borrower is ready to be done!) I think my longest appts. are about 1.5 hours. HOWEVER, when they start calling the loan officer and being on hold for 20 minutes, then it can take a while. If there are problems that aren't quickly resolved, I tell the borrowers they have 3 choices and it's completely up to them which one to choose: sign it as is, adjourn and reschedule after your questions are answered, or (if applicable) sign it and you can use the right to cancel if your questions aren't answered to your satisfaction within 3 days. I'm very careful to say this with no pressure and tell them it doesn't matter to me which option they choose.

I don't think you can usually ask for more money after the appointment, but if things are starting to look ridiculous, you can politely ask for the appointment to be rescheduled when everyone is comfortable with the documents and is ready to sign.

Another thing I do, if I get "readers" - I tell them that they have a right to carefully consider documents before signing, but many people don't wish to do so, so if they refi in the future, it might be a good idea to let the lender know that they want time to review the documents and request that the documents be sent to them in advance of the signing appointment.

Reply by Ilene C. Seidel on 9/12/07 7:10am
Msg #210469

When I run into this problem with the same company I call the borrower before I leave my office and go over the loan package with them. If they are unaware of the terms or any other problems I tell them to call their loan officer and to call me back when they are comfortable with the loan officers answers I'll then go over to close the loan. I've also been known to call the loan officer myself to tell him to do his job!!!. It's not your job to explain the loan package your selling a loan and the loan officer is getting paid for it.

Reply by WDMD on 9/12/07 7:22am
Msg #210473

Ilene said: "When I run into this problem with the same company I call the borrower before I leave my office and go over the loan package with them. If they are unaware of the terms or any other problems I tell them to call their loan officer and to call me back when they are comfortable with the loan officers answers I'll then go over to close the loan. I've also been known to call the loan officer myself to tell him to do his job!!!. It's not your job to explain the loan package your selling a loan and the loan officer is getting paid for it."


You may want to up your insurance coverages, you may need it.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 9/12/07 8:35am
Msg #210489

Re: Signing Agent appointment time lenght n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 9/12/07 8:39am
Msg #210492

Okay..that was interesting - I canceled the post - but on second thought think I'll stick my .02 in...

"When I run into this problem with the same company I call the borrower before I leave my office and go over the loan package with them. If they are unaware of the terms or any other problems I tell them to call their loan officer and to call me back when they are comfortable with the loan officers answers I'll then go over to close the loan. I've also been known to call the loan officer myself to tell him to do his job!!!. It's not your job to explain the loan package your selling a loan and the loan officer is getting paid for it."

And you're POSITIVE you're speaking on the telephone with THE borrower? ALL the borrowers?? If as you say you have the same problem with the same company, instead of playing devil's advocate IMHO maybe you should just not work for them any more as they obviously provide you with with, in your opinion, is less than informed borrowers. Further, IMO it's not YOUR job to call the LO and lecture him/her about their performance.

Again..all only my take on it.

Reply by MSFlorida on 9/12/07 9:15am
Msg #210498

When I first started doing closings I didn't know the proper way of showing the docs.
But then I got wize and listen to the posters on here on how to present docs. I now show
the Five main docs first. Hud Note TIL RTC First payment letter. I tell the borrower's to have pen and paper ready to write down all questions while we are going through docs and have them sign as we are going through again letting them know that they have 3 days to cancel.
I tell them to wait and call LO at the end because this way they will have seen all docs and have all questions they need to ask in front of them for when they do call LO it would be easier then trying to fumble through docs to find the question you wanted to ask and this way all questions could be answered in one phone call. Now this does not work if there is no RTC but it seems to put the Borrower's at ease and get the docs signed if they cancel after I leave then its on the head of LO and not me, because we all know that if it cancels at table the LO could possibly say it was our fault why they didn't sign.

Reply by Colleen Drozd on 10/7/07 9:38am
Msg #215319

I had only 3 incidents in 4 yrs doing closings. I had one borrower took over 4 hours to do a closing and gave me a major hard time. I even gave her borrowers copies. She was a nasty person. She told me she is going to copy everything that she signed thru her fax copier machine and if I did not allow her to do that she was going to break my notary stamp on me and call the police on me. I cried. What do I do in a case like this where the borrower gets nasty with me? I was late to my other appoinments and if they ask me to do an appointment for that person, I will never do it again. I also tell borrowers they have a 3 day recision period to sign and I also give them copies. I have done other closings and 99% of them were nice and I became friends with some of the people. I like doing these closings and picking my own schedule.

Reply by sue_pa on 10/8/07 7:38am
Msg #215378

do you allow everyone you interact with in life to walk all over you? While we all must put up with a certain amount of 'nastiness' from a borrower if they are so inclined, why in the world would anyone remain in the presence of someone like this woman. It also appears that you had no control over this closing and that she was in charge. VERY big mistake.

Your question - what do I do in a case like this where the borrower gets nasty with me? You say, "It appears you aren't prepared to sign this paperwork today. Call your LO when you are." Pick up your stuff, walk out the door and call your client. Refuse to go back, that day or ever, and if someone won't pay you, chalk it up to a learning experience and make sure no borrower ever controls you again.