Posted by DD/OR on 4/27/08 1:33pm
Msg #245284

Small Claims and collecting judgments

Notaries, if you want to know more about small claims filing against companys out of state and companys who are incorporated, scroll down to where I answered Sue who needs help collecting from a deadbeat company. Lets get the criminal SS on the run. Lets run them out of business. Enough is enough. If they owe you, make them pay up. If you have any questions about SC, I will be happy to answer them if I can. Take care. DD

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/27/08 1:51pm
Msg #245286

I saw your answer to Sue below.
There was a signing company in Florida. It was incorporated. The owner closed down owing many notaries money. (There was an article regarding his owing notaries money in several Florida papers when he tried to run for public office in his county). The notaries could not collect a judgment against him, they had to sue the corporation. Corporation had no assets to claim against, notaries are S.O.L.
This is why some companies incorporate, to protect their personal assets.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/27/08 1:57pm
Msg #245288

LLC's too, Sylvia..

I think there is language in the Articles of Organization for an LLC that protects the individual from any liability...or at least limits their liability. MHO

Reply by DD/OR on 4/27/08 2:34pm
Msg #245294

Yes, I heard about the company in Florida. If a company or owner has no assets, then we're up the creek without a paddle. That's why we investigate them, to see exactly what they do have. And to put them out of business. I know why companys Incorporate, but what I'm saying is that you file in the owners name, not the companys. Although there are ways to get around the Incorporation too; such as proof of some kinds of fraud. I think Internet fraud would fall under these guidelines. Then the company wouldn't be protected by Incorporating. Investigate the owner or company, find out everything you can; background (criminal), assets, real estate, banks, etc. DD

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/27/08 4:06pm
Msg #245305

Sorry, if the owner of a corporation has assets you cannot touch them.

I have seen too many times when someone has filed suit against a corporation only to find out that they can't do that, they have to sue the corporation.

Reply by Charles_Ca on 4/27/08 5:41pm
Msg #245312

Piercing the corporate veil can often be easier than most

people realize. The problem that I see with notary collections is the amount due is frequently not worth the effort.

Reply by AAA LEGAL SERVICES - JOHN on 4/27/08 4:10pm
Msg #245306

Your giving misleading corporation information. Many states allow you to sue the person as an individual, in an individual capacity

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/27/08 4:54pm
Msg #245309

Sure can't in Brevard county Fl. Owner of corporation was sued for non-payment of wages, small claims court ruled that the corporation was the entity that had to be sued. Corporation had been dissolved. Employee couldn't get the pay due to him. Owner of corporation had plenty of assets that couldn't be touched.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/27/08 1:56pm
Msg #245287

First off, I can't believe you really think Sue, of all people, needs YOUR help in collecting past due invoices...Sue's been around long enough, and has a solid enough work background, to teach YOU a thing or two about it...

Secondly...small claims actions and procedures are state-specific and if I ever need help with them I'll research my state statutes on small claims actions together with civil procedure on how to file against a domestic or foreign corporation or LLC...I'd hesitate to rely on the word or advice of someone on the other side of the country.

I would caution any newer notaries or signings agents out there to do the same...if you seriously need advice and can't do the research yourself, ask someone within your own state to point you in the right direction. It's all available and Google can be your best friend if used properly.

JMHO

Reply by DD/OR on 4/27/08 2:38pm
Msg #245295

I agree with you. People should do their own research, they can find just about anything on the Internet. And I beg you pardon, but initially Sue did ask for my advice and I gave it to her. Apology accepted. DD

Reply by sue_pa on 4/28/08 7:48am
Msg #245352

you didn't really help at all

I realize most of us will always win a judgment in our own jurisdiction if we sue someone out of state. You seem to imply that collecting on that judgment is relatively easy and that's the part I'm questioning. Using PA as my only guide, if they are incorporated, you are not taking their personal assets. If they hired you personally and they are married, you are not touching their personal assets. Moving a judgment from PA to CA to WA, to OH requires some legal maneuvering.

Not too long ago there was another discussion on collections. I made a comment along the lines of in my area getting your judgment and filing the paperwork for execution is relatively easy - after execution you send the sheriff out to levy. Someone in CA made the comment about good luck getting that levy - indicating in their area this would be a low priority type situation. Not in my area but the point is every locale has different rules and for the few hundred dollars most are owed they cannot and/or will not go after someone in another state.

Again, I think if someone would tally up the remote closings performed every day and tally up the nonpayments after 6 months, they are miniscule. If 'signing services' are such a problem for anyone, skip them and go direct to title companies - oops, Richmond, Express, Renaissance, South East ... Again, a big splash when it happens but it's seldom.

By the way, no one in CA owes me money - that was just an 'example'.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 4/28/08 8:55am
Msg #245357

Re: you didn't really help at all

At least you can get a judgment against an out-of-state defendant. In NY, you can only go to Small Claims if the other party lives, works, or has a business presence in NY. No one owes me money, but if they did, I doubt that Small Claims would be an option for me.

I agree with you that it's a relatively small number of people in nonpayment situations, but it's sort of like an airplane crash - they don't happen that often, but when they do it suddenly seems like planes are dropping out of the sky...

Reply by MistarellaFL on 4/28/08 9:10am
Msg #245358

the best we can do in FL

After getting a judgement is to file a judgement lien.
Only collectable if and when they try to get credit, and the creditor says,
no credit until you pay this off. We've all seen this on the HUD.

Reply by MikeC/NY on 4/28/08 4:14pm
Msg #245414

Re: the best we can do in FL

Can you do that even if the debtor is located in another state?

Reply by CaliNotary on 4/27/08 3:16pm
Msg #245297

Jeez, shut up already you one note harpy. n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/27/08 3:43pm
Msg #245302

LOL...Cali you really need to stop holding back -

all that pent-up emotion is unhealthy....let it out, man!!!...express yourself!!!...<G>

Reply by DD/OR on 4/27/08 4:24pm
Msg #245307

Re: Jeez, shut up yourself, Harpy. n/m

Reply by jba/fl on 4/27/08 4:35pm
Msg #245308

follow your own advice/demands. You need to look in the

mirror. Of course, you may not be able to see your reflection. LOL

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 4/27/08 5:10pm
Msg #245311

Re: One can be absent from this forum for months

And not much changes......

Reply by Cari on 4/27/08 8:12pm
Msg #245320

nope nothing changes, CaliNotary still fighting the world...

I wonder if CaliNotary is a female/male/animal or all three?

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 4/27/08 9:01pm
Msg #245322

Re: nope nothing changes, CaliNotary still fighting the world...

lol.....male but not all MALE

Reply by Sylvia_FL on 4/27/08 9:30pm
Msg #245324

Re: nope nothing changes, CaliNotary still fighting the world...

"lol.....male but not all MALE"

Now, IMWTK how you know that? LOL

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 4/27/08 9:39pm
Msg #245325

Re: nope nothing changes, CaliNotary still fighting the world...

Pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeee by the man himself....

Reply by Charles_Ca on 4/27/08 10:00pm
Msg #245328

Re: nope nothing changes, CaliNotary still fighting the world...

ROTFLMAO, and LMAO and LMAO. That had to be one of the funniest exchanges I've ever seen on Not Rot. If there was a first prize for great comments it would have to go to you, hands down! I love it!

Reply by CaliNotary on 4/27/08 11:28pm
Msg #245330

Re: nope nothing changes, CaliNotary still fighting the worl

"Pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeee by the man himself...."

Gee, thanks. I thought me telling you I had a clitoris was going to be kept confidential.

Reply by MichiganAl on 4/28/08 7:03am
Msg #245348

You've been gone for months

And THIS is what you felt was worth contributing?

Reply by CaliNotary on 4/27/08 11:40pm
Msg #245331

Re: nope nothing changes, CaliNotary still fighting the worl

"lol.....male but not all MALE"

All joking aside, I can't completely let this comment slide, you're obviously referring to my being gay. Trust me, I know plenty of gay men who could beat the living sh!t out of your all MALE husband, then dust him off and talk sports with him for 3 hours. We're not all the mincing queens that you see on TV.

Not that you'd ever catch me watching sports. Not even figure skating.

Reply by A-1 Signing Agents, LLC on 4/28/08 1:45am
Msg #245333

Re: nope nothing changes, CaliNotary still fighting the worl

I fail to see how anyone's sexual preference got into this conversation. If they were black, would you have pulled the N word out? That is right up there with that IMO.

Reply by CaliNotary on 4/28/08 2:26am
Msg #245335

OK, then you tell me

What do you think she meant by "male, but not all MALE" and that she got it "from the man himself", when we've never had any personal conversations?

Reply by NJ_Notary on 4/28/08 6:46am
Msg #245343

Re: OK, then you tell me

Ok im confused. Did I miss something in the converesation? Folks lets talk business and productive things seriously. And if your gay congratulations and if your not congratulations as well. Atleast your happy we all hope

Reply by Cari on 4/28/08 7:16am
Msg #245351

CaliNotary, if you never had personal conversations...

then how in the world would they know if you're gay or straight?

Reply by BrendaTx on 4/28/08 9:24am
Msg #245360

Cari - the question has been asked before and Cali

answered it. On this board.

Reply by CaliNotary on 4/28/08 10:29am
Msg #245366

Re: CaliNotary, if you never had personal conversations...

The same way that we know that some of the people on this board are married, it just comes up during the natural course of conversation.

And no, I have no idea what the conversation was where it first came up, but it wasn't a formal announcement or anything like that. Whatever the reason for me saying it would have been somewhat relevant to the conversation.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 4/28/08 8:31am
Msg #245356

Whoa...did THIS thread take a sudden left turn...

all due respect...this is a totally unnecessary comment and could (and should) have been left unsaid here...IMO

Reply by JanetK_CA on 4/29/08 1:41am
Msg #245476

Re: Whoa...did THIS thread take a sudden left turn...

This thread certainly did slide steeply downhill. I'm not sure where your comments were directed, but as I go back and reread, it seems the slide started somewhere around Cari's personal crack at Cali -- that had nothing to do with notary work or collections.

He certainly doesn't need me to defend him, but at least we always know where he stands. Whatever you think of his rough-around-the-edges style, I feel he knows his stuff regarding the signing business and being a notary. I think he gives lots of great advice -- and obviously doesn't take himself too seriously! Cali, I for one, appreciate all that you contribute to this board, FWIW -- including the laughs!

Reply by Gary_CA on 4/28/08 8:16am
Msg #245353

Getting Paid really shouldn't be this big of a problem...

Pay me up front... charge the borrower... small claims court... WARNING WARNING Acme Signing Services is no pay...

Gee many Christmas folks...

Do good work 80%+ pay in 30 days... remind the others and be patient 30 more... after day 60 either bug the hell out of them or decide to write it off.

I've written a couple off, I've bugged the hell out of a couple... all in all I get paid 90%+ as I'm sure most here do.

I guess some day I might file in Small Claims, but when I do, they wouln't have any assets, they'll have already spent them all in fax toner.

As for the no pays... I keep my ears open and avoid the notorious, but the rest, even some that have a pretty bad rap, get one chance from me. If they turn out bad I'm out one signing... if not, I've got a new client.


Mind out of the gutter folks... stop collecting, start producing. Give it out in slices, it comes back in loaves. (I'm not saying be silly and work for free, just keep the right focus, that's all).

Reply by LkArrowhd/CA on 4/28/08 4:30pm
Msg #245417

Peeks in room and runs like HE??..... n/m