Posted by Harry [NR] on 8/28/08 5:24am
Msg #262154

Notary Rotary Candidate Index (NRCI)

In order to make searches more productive for all the companies that use Notary Rotary to locate signing agents, we just released the Notary Rotary Candidate Index (NRCI). The "nurksey" is a score ranging from 200 to 800 designed to represent the fitness of a notary listing by simulating the thinking of a scheduler. (I realize the door is wide-open for jokes.)

To view your NRCI score, you must perform a search of your ZIP code. The rounded score will be depicted in the Recommendation column as a bar indicator. Your raw score (the Candidate Index underlying the image) is stored in the image's alt tag; hover your mouse over the recommendation bar and it should pop up.

There are approximately 15 criteria that factor into the NRCI. Completeness and profile currency are major contributors, meaning that stale profiles are heavily penalized. Also considered are a wide variety of Notary Rotary participation and support elements. In other words, all other things being equal, the more you support Notary Rotary, the more it will support you.

I plan to update the scores in-bulk on a weekly basis (the application that calculates them takes about 40 minutes to run), but may add individual, on-demand calculation in some cases. Because of this periodic schedule, you will not see immediate changes to your score in response to your actions.

Finally, the scoring formula is subject to change and will likely evolve to accommodate future additions to Notary Rotary.

Harry
Notary Rotary

Reply by aatatusko on 8/28/08 6:03am
Msg #262156

Thank you!

While I don't fully understand how the scoring works I hope it helps schedulers avoid inactive signers. I feel like I just passed a test I didn't even know I was taking!

Reply by Haynes Mobile Notary - Kathleen on 8/28/08 7:16am
Msg #262173

Re: Thank you!

Thanks Harry agreed. Kat

Reply by 1AZNotary on 8/28/08 9:32am
Msg #262193

Thank you! n/m

Reply by sue_pa on 8/28/08 6:50am
Msg #262160

Sorry but it still makes NO sense

at least for Pennsylvania. You've got Maryland notaries (who don't cover Pennsylvania - Illene, you're one of them with top billing !!) rated higher than experienced agents in PA. WHY do the PA listings have as many or more MD notaries listed when they clearly don't cover our state? There is even a signing service listed with top rating.

Reply by Dawn/PA on 8/28/08 6:54am
Msg #262162

Re: Sorry but it still makes NO sense

And Sue, I can not understand how you are closer to my zip code than I am! The size of Jacobus is well, small and my guess is I am pretty much in the center of "town" and a stones throw from the post office. I will never understand that.

Reply by kkarate on 8/28/08 7:00am
Msg #262165

Re: Sorry but it still makes NO sense

A credit score for notaries. Just what we needed to go along with the other notary issues.

Reply by sue_pa on 8/28/08 7:00am
Msg #262166

Re: Sorry but it still makes NO sense

Yup, I forgot to mention the screwed up mileage. One of my major coverage areas excludes me on this site - no idea why. I know someone in that area and she says my town excludes her although she comes here also. An accurate straight mileage search without whatever that accu and quick CRAP is would certainly make more sense - you know, people within 1-15 miles, within 16-30 miles, etc.

You and TK are the ones I was looking at - people, even nonpaying basic members, are rated higher than you two yet they don't cover this area and are A LOT further away.

Makes no sense.

Reply by Tess on 8/28/08 11:29am
Msg #262243

Re: THIS is not what I payed for! Harry, I am currently

receiving more calls from other sites and this will make it worse, this will make me rethink renewing my membership when it comes due.

Reply by Tess on 8/28/08 1:52pm
Msg #262298

Re: Paid! Now I will go hide! :) n/m

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/28/08 6:56am
Msg #262164

Sue and Dawn...it's probably just the mechanics of the

radius & zip code search...and I believe the search only measures to the "city limits" (in this case zip code outer fringes)....

Reply by Dawn/PA on 8/28/08 7:01am
Msg #262167

Re: Sue and Dawn...it's probably just the mechanics of the

I more or less understand that-but my little town isn't more than 2 or so square miles. The boy scouts can deliver newsletters to every home in 2 hours thats about 6-8 boys. Oh well, it is what is.

But that being said, to keep my ranking up, I guess I will have to chime in more often and I am not crazy about that.

Reply by sue_pa on 8/28/08 7:03am
Msg #262168

Re: Sue and Dawn...it's probably just the mechanics of the

Yet there has never been an explaination given out of the 25 premier members in our county why only 10 of them actually work in Pennsylvania and why 15 of them are from Maryland and don't work in PA.

Reply by Linda_H/FL on 8/28/08 7:16am
Msg #262172

Re: Sue and Dawn...it's probably just the mechanics of the

Sue..that's what I was saying - their location falls within the radius search, PA or not....if they're located within 20, 40, 60 or whatever miles of the searched zip, they'll show up. I do agree with you that they shouldn't but that's probably way....

Maybe if it was required to put in the State AND Zip Code that would preclude out-of-state listings from showing up...so anyone searching would need to look for a PA notary in <zip>, that might help....just a thought.

Reply by sue_pa on 8/28/08 7:20am
Msg #262175

that's what I do

my county, PA and in the premier listings 15 totally unqualified - for PA closings - people show up. I'm not reading their profiles so perhaps maybe one or two of them are comissioned in both states, but I doubt it.

You plug in either the quick or accu search (not sure which one) and 3 zip codes show up - what's up with that? my county has perhaps 70ish zip codes.

Reply by jojo_MN on 8/28/08 12:41pm
Msg #262271

Please don't do that. Some of us are dual commissioned and

wouldn't come up in the searches if you do it that way. I'm on the border between Minnesota and Wisconsin. There is very little work in Minnesota. If I didn't come up in Wisconsin searches, that would cause problems.

Reply by Harry [NR] on 8/28/08 2:44pm
Msg #262319

Re: Sorry but it still makes NO sense

Sue, can you please give me the ZIP code you're using in your MD vs. PA comparisons? As it stands, the system is performing a strict radius search, without regard to state. While we can filter the search results to the state in question, that would be harmful to notaries holding multiple commissions that live on other borders.

However, I THINK I might be able to accommodate everyone with some programming changes whereby dual or triple-commissioned people would need to specifically identify supplemental states. I'd like to look at some specific ZIP codes, though.

Thanks,
Harry
Notary Rotary

Reply by NCLisa on 8/28/08 8:28am
Msg #262182

Listings with NO Profile have 7 bars!

So I really don't understand how it works. If you get 0 bars for having your profile information blank.

Reply by SReis on 8/28/08 9:06am
Msg #262188

Mailboxes Etc has a higher rating than anyone listed BUT

they are only a notary service, whereas MA is an atty only state. I would think that a "scheduler" would place this listing at the very bottom NOT the top. Also, I would love to know why they have more bars than me when I have a more up to date listing & have a Premier Membership.

Reply by OR on 8/28/08 10:03am
Msg #262206

Re: Thanks :o) n/m

Reply by Paul2_FL on 8/28/08 9:38am
Msg #262196

Harry, I'm sorry but I see this as VERY subjective on your part. How does this make it more productive for companies that use NotRot when, by virtue of this NRCI, you are deciding who is a good candidate based on some criteria you developed?. The fact that someone doesn't update their profile, or may not be good at crafting a profile does not make them a less than desirable SA but yet their NCSI score would be penalizing them. IMHO I don't believe that's fair. My suggestion would be to cull out the inactive SA's thereby giving the companies a clean active list of SA's to chose from. Again, I don't think you should be deciding this for them.

Reply by Carolyn Bodley on 8/28/08 9:51am
Msg #262198

This reminds me of the short period of time when posts could be rated, and your proposal to remove our posting rights if our post got negative marks.

Reply by Les_CO on 8/28/08 11:00am
Msg #262231

Re: Notary Rotary Candidate Index (NRCI)Carolyn

At least you have the highest rating (that you deserve) when some that deserve to be blacklisted like Dean that used to run a deadbeat ss. are still listed.

Reply by JohnnyB on 8/28/08 9:54am
Msg #262200

This system may not be totally fair, but it is still objective. He is not reviewing each profile personally. I am sure he has spoken with companies to determine the best criteria and they want some efficiency in finding an agent. An agent who does not update his/her profile, or does not create a profile, probably indicates a lack of commitment to the business. I think this is a very good for the full-time notary.

Reply by Vince/KS on 8/28/08 9:58am
Msg #262202

A marketing skill is to "give the troops something to talk about." That means that some will like a particular idea or concept and some will not. It breaks the pose of not caring and allows others that are trying to achieve a particular goal to do so - it gets people out of their “comfort zone.” It sometimes creates confusion, or worse yet, a complete lack of caring.

What Harry is doing is innovative. It helps him and helps those that do the things necessary to help make his business successful.

If a person doesn’t feel like updating their profile (making some wonder if they are still providing notary service), it gets into the formula. If persons contribute to the knowledge of others on this forum, they get credit. If some simply ask questions (are not afraid of the feedback) and allow persons that have constructive answers to respond, it gets credit. If persons pay for a premier membership - it gets noticed and has higher potential. And so on. If it does not work, he’ll likely do away with it (he’s done so before) But, in the meantime, it’s creating activity and I’ll bet a lot of folks will make sure the profile is updated for whatever minuscule credit that will bring them.

Reply by Paul2_FL on 8/28/08 10:43am
Msg #262222

While I agree with you that what Harry is doing is innovative it still is subjective based on his criteria. Let's start with:
1) "If a person doesn’t feel like updating their profile (making some wonder if they are still providing notary service), it gets into the formula".
Does this mean that one would have to "change their profile" in order to get credit or just log on? If a person likes their profile why change it? If you need to just log on what's the point?

2) "If persons contribute to the knowledge of others on this forum, they get credit."
Who decides what knowledge is "good" knowledge? There are people such as Sylvia, PAW, Brenda and others who constantly give good advice on this forum and they get credit from their peers in response but there are also others who's advice is suspect at best. Do they get equal credit just because their on the forum? Does Harry look at every response to determine what is a valid contribution to the knowledge of others?

3) "If persons pay for a premier membership - it gets noticed and has higher potential"
Being a Premium member just means that you are paying for certain privileges offered by NotRot it doesn't mean you are a better SA.

4) "If it does not work, he’ll likely do away with it (he’s done so before)"
Yes that's true but in the meantime this NRCI could adverserly affect some good SA's because of low scores.

Believe me I'm not dumping on Harry! I believe he's working hard to make NotRot the best forum on the web and I applaude him for his efforts. I personally look at this site almost every day because I consider it the best. My concern is more in how this NRCI was created. Someone earlier mentioned that he may have asked companies what they were looking for before he created this. If this is true then the list should be published so that we can determine for ourselves what we need to do to improve our image to the industry at large.

Reply by jba/fl on 8/28/08 1:18pm
Msg #262287

"If a person likes their profile why change it?'
You don't have to change a thing to update your profile...go in under edit, go to bottom of page and click to accept change. This updates your profile - it shows that you are paying attention to yourself and your business, it shows that you are active as of, for ex., yesterday or today.

Reply by Cody Doty on 8/28/08 12:13pm
Msg #262256

I agree, I think the main thing is to keep you profile updated and as complete as possible. I believe that all SAs that are serious about their business probably do this anyway. I know I started doing inspections and I updated my profile to reflect that. I also would update mine because I knew if they saw I updated my profile recently I would maybe get a call, v/s the other notaries that have not updated in over a year....they might assume they no longer are in the biz.

Reply by Michelle/AL on 8/28/08 10:02am
Msg #262205

Thank you, Harry. n/m

Reply by Tannis Zamora on 8/28/08 10:21am
Msg #262211

Thank you Harry and thank you Notary Rotary Staff.

I have learned so much from this forum and I feel my business has grown professionally because of Notary Rotary. I just got recommissioned and it was a PLEASURE to order my Bond and E&O from Notary Rotary. I am FREE from the NNA forever!!

To the NSA's on this forum who take the time to share their experiences and wisdom, a big thank you as well. I cannot name you for fear of forgetting someone, but just know I really appreciate the time you take to research and answer questions.

tannis zamora TN

Reply by LKT/CA on 8/28/08 10:31am
Msg #262216

While I think it would be easier to just clear the database of outdated accounts, I'm game to see how the NRCI works out.....may need fine tuning and tweaking because it's new but I think it should be given a chance. Not everyone will be on board with the new system but it would be that way no matter what Harry came up with. Can't please all the people ALL the time. I give Harry 4 stars and a chocolate bar for not only coming up with a new idea but doing so in a speedy manner.

Reply by Julie/IL on 8/28/08 4:20pm
Msg #262339

Only time will tell how well it works. Thanks Harry for at least attempting to help us all out. Maybe in doing so you will find what works best. Although no matter what you do, you won't be able to please them all. Thanks again!

Reply by Sharon Taylor on 8/28/08 10:35am
Msg #262217

Thanks, Harry...not! Penalize me for not posting????

Sorry, but I dislike the idea of being penalized because I do not post often on this forum. I visit the forum every day, often several times a day, but I try to limit my posts to times when I feel I can truly add constructive information or comments to a thread, and I read much more than I post. Just because I am not chatty or say "that's what I think too" a lot or choose to defer to those who have already made excellent posts on a subject doesn't mean I should be penalized for "not participating". I AM participating by being a Premier Member, by visiting every day, by posting when I feel my post would be useful and helpful, and by striving to provide the best possible friendly knowledgable and caring mobile notary service to the lenders, title companies, signing services and borrowers involved with any assignment I accept. JMHO

Reply by Rachel_NJ on 8/28/08 10:48am
Msg #262225

Re: Thanks, Harry...not! Penalize me for not posting????

Posting is part of the 15 factors? If that is the case then this forum is going to be filled with utter nonsense posts. Unless of course they do make another Forum. Discuss Work, Just Politics, Leisure and "Boost your NRCI rating".

Reply by Sharon Taylor on 8/28/08 10:56am
Msg #262228

Well said, Rachel

LOL Count this as the first of my "Boost your NRCI rating" posts. ROFLMAO

Reply by jba/fl on 8/28/08 1:19pm
Msg #262288

No, Sharon, you already posted today so that's 2! LOL n/m

Reply by bfd110_IN on 8/28/08 11:17am
Msg #262239

Re: Thanks, Harry...not! Penalize me for not posting????

I agree about the posting issue.... There are people in my area that has never posted a single peep and are rated higher that me and I am a paying member and they aren't. I feel this is a poor rating system. Soo if they don't post anything is there score going to go down???

Reply by Tish/CA on 8/28/08 1:30pm
Msg #262290

I absolutely agree with Sharon and Rachel,

you are encouraging all of us on this board to add our two cents only for the purpose of earning extra points toward a "better" rating. I think it'll create gobs of minutia. A typical thread that may attract 5 or 6 posts, sufficiently anwering a question or comment, will now consist of 40, 50 60, 100 posts? I hope you reconsider "contributions" as a criterion for a more favorable rating. JMHO

Reply by linda/ca on 8/30/08 1:27am
Msg #262684

Re: Thanks, Harry...not! Penalize me for not posting????

Sharon and Rachel I whole-heartedly agree with your comments of being penalized for not posting. I feel it is not only unfair, however, will create a pethoral of "empty speech" on this site, mine included if that is what it is going to take for a higher rating. I did not read the forum the day the new system was discussed so I did not want to create a new thread. Responding this late I know that my thoughts will probably not be heard or considered, however, this was one of my biggest issues with this new method as well as non-paying individuals getting higher ratings; that is irrational. I too would think paying a fee would do more for notary rotary than posting, especially for the sake of generating higher points. I have faith that Harry will straighten this out (hopefully real soon) however at this point, this is all very disturbing.

Reply by MW/VA on 8/28/08 10:43am
Msg #262223

Thanks, Harry! WoooHooo, I feel like a "high roller".

Reply by LC/AZ on 8/28/08 11:08am
Msg #262236

My profile shows that I have 12 bars. (out of 13) I'm wondering what must I do to achieve the "perfect score"? Harry, please, tell me what's missing?

Reply by sjp on 8/28/08 12:12pm
Msg #262255

I also would like to know too.

Reply by Cody Doty on 8/28/08 12:18pm
Msg #262258

me too.

Reply by Sandra Clark on 8/28/08 11:29am
Msg #262242

Thanks Harry!

Reply by Ernest__CT on 8/28/08 11:55am
Msg #262250

Harry: Thank you! All others: Give it a chance. n/m

Reply by davidK/CA on 8/28/08 12:26pm
Msg #262261

A suggestion to Harry

Obviously there must be a detailed formula behind the rating system so that it can run automatically and updated frequently.

While you have offered only minimal information of how and what goes into the computation (ex: are "n/m" posts valued as much as a complete comment, or what is the relative value of a profile "update" that actually made no changes other than the "date last updated" to a change in the written text). Each factor appears to be the type of data point that is controllable by the member making the overall valuation "suspect".

If all majority of the values for the formula come from the profile, and a member can change their profile at any time, and for any reason, then the rating system is not very relevant as a measurement of the quality of the notary because it can easily be "gamed".

The same holds true for the "posting factors". IMHO, there is already way to many "me too - n/m" messages that offer no value to the discussion. If you count those postings in the formula, all you will be doing is encouraging even more of them. Personally, I don't even click on those postings, yet they still take up space within the specific discussion.

All these issues (and others) turns what should be a legitimate and useful valuation process into nothing more than the existing division between Premier Membership and "non-paying members".

My suggestion would be to continue the process, but temporarily restrict access only to Premier Members until you have worked out the "bugs". Then release it to everyone, knowing that the valuations expressed are solid and based on really important factors that can't be "gamed".

Reply by Becca_FL on 8/28/08 12:02pm
Msg #262252

Harry, Why am I only listed in my home county now?

I've dropped off the St. Lucie County searches yet you list someone in my county that has a much lower rating than I have? This isn't working for me.

Reply by bhb/VA on 8/28/08 12:29pm
Msg #262263

Thank you, Harry!

Reply by linda/ca on 8/30/08 1:40am
Msg #262685

Why are you thanking Harry when you have a title company listed first (I do mean #1) in your area? Unless I am missing something here, that is the first thing you should be working on...getting them off the list period!! That irritates the heck out of me and I am no where near you. I am in a different state.

Reply by Ernest__CT on 8/28/08 2:03pm
Msg #262300

All such formulae are secret by design.

Google and other search engines jealously guard their criteria for rating Sites and the placement of links within their Pages. An algorhythm, Harry's or anyone else's, should never be made public. People, clever or otherwise, would do what's called "gaming the system".

If Harry said that the number of Posts had a major effect on our rankings, we'd see "I want to know, too."-type Posts. I Harry said that the last date of Profile update were most important, we'd see people updating their Profiles three times a day.

Don't try to game the system. Don't pressure Harry. Don't keep Posting about how unfair the chosen ranking system may be. Do what you normally do. The professionals will naturally get higher rankings and the amateurs will fall like stones into well-deserved obscurity.

Reply by Vince/KS on 8/28/08 2:25pm
Msg #262313

Re: All such formulae are secret by design.

A bit harsh Ernest, but well said. Most companies or schedulers using the search feature will likely look harder at those that have a better than average number. Those that have less than average may be able to gain a lot simply by looking at others that have the kind of score they want and emulate it. In other words: Update profile once a quarter (and have it say something helpful to a scheduler), ask or respond to a question from time to time, consider buying a premier membership (maybe even some of the other products available here), and generally demonstrating some proficiency and interest in being a professional. Who knows whether certification makes a difference or public vs private identity or closings completed or links to/from other websites or amount of E & O coverage makes a difference. How about general honesty of the person (some profiles are interesting when they indicate the person says they are “now doing notaries” - and then list 1,200 completions). Just guessing, but any of these may be important to the notary - if not to the person looking for one.

Reply by Gerry_VT on 8/28/08 3:37pm
Msg #262327

I won't tolerate being rated by a %*#@ computer program. I am hiding my profile from searches (even though I "achieved " the highest possible rating.

Although I don't do loan signings (since Vermont is an attorney state, at least for loans), I did receive a very interesting job offer related to notary work, the Internet, and non-loan real estate work through Notary Rotary. Since the project is not yet publicly announced, I will not identify the employeer. I also won't be receiving any similar assignents until this farce goes away.

Reply by Gerry_VT on 8/28/08 5:22pm
Msg #262363

Gross stupidity

Harry,
You are too stupid to be running this service. I will delete my profile momentarily.

By the way, I have not forgotten this is the second time you have tried this idiocy.

You just are not capable of understanding what information is useful and what is useless.

You are forbidden from ever contacting me through any channel whatever.

Reply by Ronnie_WA on 8/29/08 12:18am
Msg #262488

I don't think this is a good approach. We pay good fees to participate in this site and the forum moderator is not in a position to know what type of quality service we are providing to the clients who find us through this forum. Only the clients we service are in a position to judge that and, if we don't provide outstanding service, they won't call us again. They are the best judges of our professional performance. Somebody who has plenty of time on their hands can get a higher rating by posting frequently vs someone who is out there actually providing stellar service to clients and does not have the time to post. I don't care for the approach.

Reply by Mamie on 9/1/08 4:06pm
Msg #262887

Sorry, I am so late getting in and up to date on this forum. Thanks Harry!